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bunny
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icon4.gif  1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Sun, 19 May 2002 06:15 Go to next message
im going to put a 1GGTE into my MA 61. ive sourced an engine but where to start ? so many people say different stuff.
ive heard it will bolt strait up with an MZ10 soarer cross member and bolt strait up to the W58 using the 1GGTE bell housing/clutch ect .
Does anyone have any advice/ideas on this? Smile
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gianttomato
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Sun, 19 May 2002 07:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
If you have you're heart set on doing this, then what you have said is essentially correct. I think the X member you need is a GZ10 or a GA60.
My thoughts about this aren't great....I don't think the 1GGTE has the low down torque to adequately move 1350 kg around nimbly, and off boost performance will be inadequate. This thread in the old forums is where we all had our say: http://www.toymods.org.au/forums/viewthread.php?FI D=4&TID=5287

Cheers Dave.
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Sun, 19 May 2002 12:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
holy shit thats a lot of arguing over an engine conv. looks like everyone will find out who was right in the next couple of months. its going to go in as soon as i can find the x member ive already got the other stuff i need. but still any advice is apreciated as im going for a budget price conv otherwise theres no point.
ps ive sourced some ways to up the torque on the 1G
Smile
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Nark
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icon12.gif  Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Sun, 19 May 2002 14:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bunny wrote on Sun, 19 May 2002 10:53 PM

holy shit thats a lot of arguing over an engine conv.

You can say that again!! Smile
I'd love to see the conversion when you're finished dude!

Whilst I think the 1G-GTE won't be very nice in such a heavy car, I'd like to be pleasantly surprised!
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bunny
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................. Mon, 20 May 2002 03:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Nod
i need to find justcallmefrank, to see if hes still got the x member.
and as far as weight the engine is going to take a few kilos off and im losing some other bits as well it should weigh about 1100 to 1150 when finished.
how much does your RA 60 weigh?
and irf anyone has advice on spraypainters it would be appreciated i need to redo the factory colour.
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Nark
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icon2.gif  Re: ................. Mon, 20 May 2002 04:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
My car weighed in at 1220kg with half a tank of petrol.
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bunny
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Re: ................. Mon, 20 May 2002 04:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Question
what does your car go like with a few people in it?
and also how did u manage to use the factory computer?
ive been told they neyer run properly without an aftermarket.
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Nark
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icon2.gif  Re: ................. Mon, 20 May 2002 04:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I really notice 4 people in the car... It's definately more sluggish. Builds boost more slowly. Once boost is there, it's OK, but you really notice the difference down low.

Whoever told you that about the ECUs was probably bullshiting to you for their own gains. Nothing runs as well as a factory ECU. You just need to get someone to wire it up.
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gianttomato
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Mon, 20 May 2002 04:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
MA61 weighs 1340-80 kg depending on options. Don't believe what your rego sticker says.
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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Mon, 20 May 2002 11:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Whaat? My post from the other day didn't work...stupid internet.

Anyways, I was just saying how I thought this would be a cool conversion. A MA61 is roughly 1350kg or whatever...yet the 5ME is at least 30kg heavier than a 1GGTE. Thats like half my weight...

Weightwise, the best comparison I can draw is to a S15 200SX. Roughly, the two coupes would be around the same weight, yet no one whinges about the weight of one of those... Razz

As for the cross-member, best bet would be to find who I was going to get one from...dont know if he still has it. Dudes name is Rob, e-mail: aquadream@optusnet.com.au

I'm off to explore the wonders of fitting a 1UZFE to the Mk2 in the next year or two, possibly looking into turbocharging later. So's Rob...although I think he bought a Soarer front-cut...thats gonna be nasty to make that sump fit...

Have fun!
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zorro
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Mon, 20 May 2002 11:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Why bother with a 1G when a 1JZ motor fits straight onto the 5M crossmember (with a few engine mount mods). Worked well for me.

http://1jzsupra.20m.com/

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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Mon, 20 May 2002 12:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hehe, wondering when you would make an appearance Smile
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 02:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hehehe
why not a 1jz?
because :its too bloody expensive
: everyone wants to do it (or has)
:i like high reving engines
: i appreciate fuel economy
:nobody has an MA61 with a 1GGTE
:alot can be done with the engines
:i have some inside info on how to increace torque
:it moves the center of gravity back
:and its lighter
Smile
i hope these answer your question.
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Malkomv2.0
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 03:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I think that the only relevat questions you need to ask are:
What are you going to do with the car?
What is your target power figure?
If you want to drive on the street, and the target power figure is above 150rwkw, then you are wasting time and money on a 1g. Yes they are good motors, yes they rev well and you can get some good torque figues out of them, just not at lower revs.
The 1jz is by far the most suitable engine for both race and street, and the only real hurdle is a manual gear box. It has the advantage of being at least five years younger than a 7m or a 1g, and will use very little fuel if driven nicely, not like that's ever going to happen tho!
By the time you ditch the standard turbo's, make a steampipe manifold, upgrade the computer and injectors and intercooler, you may be close to a stock 1jz running 14psi.
I don't think that they weigh much more than a 1g either. As for you centre of gravity problems, I know what you mean. MA61's just don't like staying in a straight line do they! Especially in the rain.
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 03:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the 1 jz is alot younger and definately the better engine but it is a very expensive conversion and with the 1G i can do the work to the engine over a period of time as the initial costs are not high and i like the fact that no one has done it.
the fact that it doesnt move down low isnt such a problem because if i dont feel like a thrash putting along is all good with me.
and on the old forums i asked the 1JZ vs 1GGTE fuel ec question and the overwhelming response was that the fuel ec achieved by the 1 JZ was nowhere near as good as the 1G
Razz
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Nark
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icon1.gif  Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 03:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
151rwkW = 3rd Gen 1G-GTE @ 14psi. As was demonstrated by Darren's car.
It's not that hard. Smile

Difference in weight between 1G-GTE and 1JZ-GTE is around 25-30kg.

The fuel economy figures that you've seen are from lighter cars... I'm pretty sure that a 1G-GTE pulling 1400kg around would guzzle... Might end up worse than a 1JZ-GTE...
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 04:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
like i said the supra is only going to weigh as much as your RA60 when finished ive managed to lose 100 kg so far
so its gointg to hopefully get the same fuel ec as your getting
this conv is going to get done no matter how much people try to discourage me.
if its crap and it doesnt work ill just have to put up with it untill i can afford a 1 JZ but hopefully nit wont be.
Laughing
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 04:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ps my big ugly 5M is only doing someting like 95kw at the wheels,
so somehow i think 151 maybe just a small improvement
and considering that pitiful output its taking 12-13 litres to the 100 k's to do that so fuel ec is a plus also Up To Something
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Grant
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 05:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bunny, if you want to see what a 1JZGTE looks like in an MA61 have a look at http://www.1jzsupra.20m.com/.


Grant
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Norbie
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 09:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
1G into an MA61, wow that's a new one... why did you decide to put one of these into a Supra, and not a Celica? Putting the smaller engine into the larger car doesn't make that much sense to me, but I'm sure you have your reasons.... hope it works out OK for you.

And since when is the 1JZ expensive? Considering what you get for your money, I reckon they're an absolute bargain at the moment...
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maxdamage75
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Tue, 21 May 2002 11:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
i don't really see what the big problem is as how the celica xx's came with a variety of engines including the 1g-gte.
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 04:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rolling
got a GA 61 crossmember,sump,oil pickup today
looks like its all good
it had a 1G EU in it so same block
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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 07:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Yeah dude. Good to see someone going through with it. Keep me informed on your progress.

Nathan

cjon6306@bigpond.net.au
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Norbie
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 08:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
maxdamage75 wrote on Tue, 21 May 2002 9:58 PM

i don't really see what the big problem is as how the celica xx's came with a variety of engines including the 1g-gte.

Celica XX's came with 1G engines, but not the 1G-GTE. They were available with a 2 litre turbo engine, but that was the M-TEU.
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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 08:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hes correct, some had the 1GGE and some had the 1GEU.

Incidentally, the 1GGE wasn't much slower than the MTEU. Both had 160ps, but due to the lard arse nature of M-series engines, it was like 60kg+ weight difference.

Just something I sorta picked out from some page on the Jap Celica XX club...good old Babelfish
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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 08:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mind you, the big daddy 5MGE 2.8GT was the fastest of the lot...but then it did have the most power...
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japspec
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 11:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hey Bunny

So whats this secret way of increasing torque in a 1ggte?
All ears.....?

Cheers
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 13:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
replacing both turbos with hi-flowed garret T02 water cooled turbos, aftermarket computer, exhaust ports, and bigger injectors(someone mentioned JZ ones)
are the planned mods after advice was taken considered and used.
these thing are said nto considerably increase torque (not just power) Smile
Up To Something
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japspec
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Wed, 22 May 2002 22:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Yeh I would hope that would increase torque.

I've got a late model 1ggte (looks brand new! It's beautiful!! ) and have been toying with the idea of using the turbos from the 1jz on it with the standard computer. Also geting an exhaust and boost controller

Do you know if there are any larger injectors that will work with the standard computer? Maybe 1jz injectors?? I know I'm reaching but it would save a bit of dosh on an aftermarket computer.

Cheers
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Norbie
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Thu, 23 May 2002 08:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
A couple of hi-flowed turbos will certainly increase peak torque, but at what RPM? Generally speaking, hi-flowed turbos take longer to spool up (especially if they're larger), so you might find you have even LESS bottom-end grunt than a stock 1G already has. I don't think too many turbo setups would spool faster than those tiny ceramic turbos on a stock 1G...
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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Thu, 23 May 2002 08:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
About one of the best ways to increase low-end torque on a 1G is one of those stroker kits, but then you would lose some of the revviness that makes the 1G what it is, and for the expense, you may as well have installed a 1JZ.
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Thu, 23 May 2002 10:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Match porting the intake manifold ive heard does some good Razz
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japspec
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Thu, 23 May 2002 10:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Norbie:
Yeh you would think there would be less bottom torque if you changed to any other turbo. Nothing could spool up quicker than those pipsqueek things!
So I guess fuel volume must be increased with any turbo change to keep the low rpm torque. Hence my question earlier about using some bigger injectors with the standard computer as the cost of something like a stroker kit is out of the quetion, cool thought though!!
I saw another post about hi flowing injectors! Dose this work effeciently and safley with the stnd comp????
One reply to that post said to increase the fuel pressure will increase the injectors flow rate???? Sounds a bit danger!!!

Cheers
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japspec
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Thu, 23 May 2002 10:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
No Message Body
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Norbie
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Fri, 24 May 2002 05:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Increasing the fuel flow at low rpm will not increase torque - if anything, it will decrease torque because the engine will be running way rich! The only way to increase torque at any given rpm is to increase airflow.
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gianttomato
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icon10.gif  devil's advocate Fri, 24 May 2002 06:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
So, you get a 1G then you buy a stroker kit from HKS to take it out to 2.4 l. So then you have an expensive unrevvy engine with 2 turbos that are too small and won't run well with std ECU. Freak

In the meantime for considerably less cost you could get a 1JZ - new, 2.5 l revvy powerful motor with appropriately sized turbos and runs well on the std ECU. Evil or Very Mad
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Fri, 24 May 2002 14:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
2 ltrs is fine for me and there will be no stroker kit or 1/2JZ
just a 1GGTE with some small mods fiting perfectly and running sweet:)
ps the sump i found has a munted bottom, does anyone know where id get it repaired
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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Sat, 25 May 2002 01:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Is it a sump from a 1GEU or what not? Cos you need the front sump.
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bunny
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Sat, 25 May 2002 13:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
aye, that it is, if u got a spare one lying around feel free to mention it Smile
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justcallmefrank
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Re: 1G GTE :MA 61 conversion Sat, 25 May 2002 13:57 Go to previous message
haha, nice try
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