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DAMO
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May 2002
got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 09:42 Go to next message
Got my gze sprinter on the rollers today and it pumped out 137.2 @ 7000rpm at the rear treads. I thought that wasn't bad. More importantly it feels great to drive. I'm still having a lot of issues with getting the thing to idle properly. Once the thing is run in I'm gonna bump the rev limiter up as it seemed like it wanted to go more.
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GZE-STYLE
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 10:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thats pretty darn good! What mods you got? Bigger pulley, Maybe a SC14?
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Twinky
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 10:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I take it was 137hp???

So like 100kw @ the wheels?
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DAMO
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 10:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
No that's KW's. Head work, cams, oversize pulley, 2.5" mandrel exhaust, front mount intercooler and modded intake system.
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Blown86
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Perth
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 11:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jeez that's pretty good!!
What's the cam specs?? Mods to the intake??
Is boost at 12 - 13 psi??
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GZE-STYLE
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 11:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Nice work DAMO
good stuff Smile Smile
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LadySX
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 14:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Now I am gonna cry Crying or Very Sad
Congrats on your power figure Smile
I got 82kw when i got mine dynoed. MAP gze with extractors, 2 1/4" exhaust, CAI and 175mm pulley Sad
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Twinky
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 14:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
82kw, that almost makes me cry too Sad

I think it depends on the dyno

My mate had a ta22 celica with AFM GZE (108kw @ flywheel) and got 92.5 kw at the wheels. NO MODS
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Cal_AE86
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Re: got my car dynoed Tue, 15 April 2003 23:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Those figures are all over the shop. 137kw sounds a little too good to be true to me. I have noticed a lot of dynos quoting different figures lately. About a month ago I was at a dyno day, where a car pulled 204kw. The next day on a different dyno the figure was 230. I suppose you can only ever compare with cars that are on the same dyno on the same day. What ever the case, that must be one seriously quick Sprinter.

Cal.
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Nark
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icon4.gif  Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 01:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Was the run done in 4th? Was temp compensation turned on? And where was the temp probe?

Check here to see what 4A-GTE's put out:
http://www.toymods.org.au/Dyno_Day_3/Graphs/
http://www.toymods.org.au/msgboard/index.php?t=msg &th=1787#msg_num_3

Sorry to doubt, but that figure looks ridiculously high to me.

I'm sure your car puts out a lot of power, but I don't think it's THAT much! I think the dyno operators were playing silly buggers with you.

[Updated on: Wed, 16 April 2003 01:14]

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biased99
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Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 01:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shit...My 1UZ put out 127RWKW on a dyno here in the A.C.T a couple of months ago...and I'm told a Gen3 Commodore put out 133RWKW on the same dyno on the same day!

That is one serious GZE...
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Cal_AE86
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February 2003
Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 01:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Does anybody know what sort of power losses one should expect from flywheel to wheels on a Sprinter? 30%?

Cal.
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Youngy
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May 2002
Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 01:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Well done Damian,

Your car must be almost finished now!... Very Happy
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Chris Davey
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sunny coast, qld
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Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 03:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
i don't think it would be 30% drivetrain loss for a manual sprinter. I have been told that jzz30 auto soarers lose 25%. so...
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LadySX
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Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 04:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I have always heard FWD lose 22% through drivetrain, and 30% for RWD, me, well I lose about 50% Rolling Eyes
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gold28
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August 2002
Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 06:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Well done, I am sure it goes well regardless of the numbers. Either way it won't be long until your thinking you could do with some more. That is a sad but well known fact.

Shame your not in Sydney, you could bring it tot eh next Dyno day and compare on a level playing field.

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celicamad85
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Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 10:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Nark wrote on Wed, 16 April 2003 11:09



I'm sure your car puts out a lot of power, but I don't think it's THAT much! I think the dyno operators were playing silly buggers with you.


why is it so hard to accept nark ?...when you want to compare a 1uzfe to a 1ggte the gear ratios tyres size and power losses from 2 different cars dont seem to mattter, when you want to compare two specific motors, i think your jealous because its not a 1ggte and its putting down a pretty fine amount of power



Nark wrote on Wed, 16 April 2003 11:09



I'm sure your car puts out a lot of power, but I don't think it's THAT much! I think the dyno operators were playing silly buggers with you.


i think you play silly buggers all the time

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DAMO
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Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 10:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
thanks guys, I'm really happy with the power it is pumping out, not just numbers on a stupid graph. It pulls hard. I know it's not the fastest car on the road but I'm happy with it which is all that matters. Why cant a GZE pull those sought of figures?? A few dollars have been spent on it let me tell you. 13 pound was about the boost level it got to. There is no reason why the dyno operator would be playing funny buggers as he didn't build the engine and he didn't need to prove it's worth, even he was quite surprised with the power it developed. I suppose I did have a reasonably low ambient temperature to help figures. Can any tell me why this thing will not idle below 2000 rpm? If you try to adjust the idle screw out on the throttle body it just dies. I have to have the idle screw fully in(Commodore throttle body). By the way I'm running a Haltech EMS.
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Nark
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icon2.gif  Re: got my car dynoed Wed, 16 April 2003 23:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne, pull your head in and check the facts before you open your mouth. This doesn't even have anything to do with 1UZs and 1Gs. Geez, get over it!

Damo,
I'm just saying, if Yogi's 4A-GTE pulled 119kW on the dyno at 20psi, your 4A-GZE would be pretty magical to match that using 13psi, let alone beat it by almost 20kW!
Mick R's 4A-GTE also pulled 116kW at 16psi.
From your list of mods, I'm pretty damn sure your car hauls arse. I'm just saying I doubt that it's 137kW of arse hauling! Smile
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DAMO
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 00:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Well yes I can see from those figures how mine doesn't seem right but I also did see two 2jz's on the same dyno, one with head, cam and various other mods run 370kw at 14psi and one standard with boiost turned up with 250 at 25psi

[Updated on: Thu, 17 April 2003 00:31]

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biased99
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 01:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hmmm...Reading that last post, methinks the dyno itself may be a little "out".
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LadySX
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 01:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
where'd ya get it done Damo?? I want my car on that dyno Smile
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Nark
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      Nark@toymods.net/Work
Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 01:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Remember that the size of the turbo makes a big difference.

A T88 at 7psi will still flow shitloads more than stock turbos at 14psi, and thus make more power.
Much in the same way that a T28 turbo will make more power at 14psi than the SC12 at 14psi.
Headwork will also increase flow.

From your list of mods, I think the only thing that Yogi didn't have on his car was the cams. I'm pretty sure Mick's engine had slightly larger cams though.

I'm not trying to detract from your achievement, dude. I just find that figure a bit fishy.
Bring the car up to the next dyno day! Smile
If you can pull 137kW, you'll be in with a pretty good chance to take home a trophy!
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DAMO
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 01:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
No it doesn't sound right. It was done at geelong tune ups. Take yours there ladysx and you to could have 137kw @ the wheels. Like I said before it doesn't really matter about numbers to me, it feels good to drive. Now if I could only get it to idle properly!!
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gold28
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 01:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Yeah some dyno tuners have been known to calibrate their dyno's to read on the high side of the truth. It makes them look great when someone makes an extra 20kW when they tune the cars.

Either way, If your happy and it's pulling hard, who cares. It will still whip most cars on the road. Very Happy
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Chris Davey
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 01:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
don't bother comparing 2 different dynoes on 2 different days as it will never be accurate.

if you want to compare go to the drags and work out your terminal speed and weight in pounds.


HPat wheels= (MPH/234)^3 * (weight in pounds)

then multiply that figure by .8 because of wind resistance

eg. MPH=110 weight=2750
RWHP=228

good for comparing anyway.
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Nark
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 01:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Yup! Take it to the drags!! And tell us what you get!
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Ruckus
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 02:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Well done DAMO, where did u take it?
My GZE ke20 was dynoed at about 117kw at the wheels @7800rpm
It was done at BGT in Hawthorn.I don't think those figures are unatainable. certainly over 120 kws is possible.
Id post a pic of the dyno graph but im not sure how.
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Cal_AE86
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 03:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ruckus wrote on Thu, 17 April 2003 12:13

Well done DAMO, where did u take it?
My GZE ke20 was dynoed at about 117kw at the wheels @7800rpm
It was done at BGT in Hawthorn.I don't think those figures are unatainable. certainly over 120 kws is possible.
Id post a pic of the dyno graph but im not sure how.


What was it producing at 7000rpm?

Cal.
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Ruckus
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 03:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
105kw at 7000rpm.
Damo i know how u feel with the idleing thing.
I ran microtech on mine and it wasn't idling for months, had to have my foot on the gas at the lights etc.
All it needed was a lil tune of the computer, i presume things just change over time, cos i know it idled fine when i got it.
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LadySX
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 03:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I so thought the GZE reached peak power at 6400rpm. Does the peak rise with mods?
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gianttomato
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 04:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lady SX, he's added cams and an overdrive. The cams, depending on their profile and adjustment, can alter where the power starts and ends. Also with a larger pulley, the charger is underdriven and so the peak efficiency of the supercharger may be at a higher engine rpm, and hence push peak power higher up the rpm. The Nevo boys will have a much better idea regarding this than me.
Damo, nice work. I'm a little skeptical, but only because I only got about 130 from 3 litres of NA 6. Laughing
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DAMO
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 04:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ruckus, did you also have problems with it stalling when it came down from high RPM. What sought of vac do you pull at idle. The tuner said it definately not in the tuning. I was gonna drive it up to the nationals but i need three feet to drive this bitch.
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Cyber-punk
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 05:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
this might sound stupid but are you sure its not rwhp instead of the quoted rwkw?
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Cal_AE86
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 06:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mine is running about 9psi, a front mounted intercooler from a VR4 and Microtech. I got 90rwkw. It needs a tune. I am hoping to get 100 when it is tuned next week. I just can't imagine 4psi extra boost and cams making another 37kw. I suppose stranger things have happened. Have you got any photos of your car?

Cal.
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DAMO
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 06:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Look I'm sorry if my quoted figures have offended you all. Maybe I read the graph wrong. Maybe it's 37.2 kw. Does that make you all feel better.
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Cal_AE86
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 06:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DAMO wrote on Thu, 17 April 2003 16:37

Look I'm sorry if my quoted figures have offended you all. Maybe I read the graph wrong. Maybe it's 37.2 kw. Does that make you all feel better.


I for one am not offended. I just want to know how to get 137 out of mine. Now, how about those pics?

Cal.
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barbel
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 10:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
why does everyone have to be sceptical of everyone's results and bag people out, a friend had his sprinter tuned and got 125kw at the wheels, 4agte t3 turbs nice cooler std 9-10psi. and i've seen this thing munch some cars on the road. mk4 tt supra to the list and some WRX's and the likes. this thing is a machine. nice balance.

cant help but sense that everyone thinks they are better than everyone coz there car has more power or is faster, so puttin me of the car scene lately. share your enthusiasm and not your big heads.

Damo, well done on the result... could be a number of variants with your result, but just remember as long as your happy with it, and u smoke a few people... who gives a rats!!
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Sprinta
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 13:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I personally think his figure seems spot on..
What i dont get is howcome 4agte's arent much higher? Ive heard alot of people running 160rwkw with a 4agte etc.. Is this correct or too high a figure as well?
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3S-GE_Man
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 13:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
i don't know if this is good, but my 4th gen got 71kw (96hp) @ the wheels (factory at the fly is 103kw brand new), with only a K&N pod filter, on a dyno dynamics, dyno that was in comptetion shoot out mode. and 104+ super octane booster with 3/4 tank of reguerler fuel (like 91octane). i'm going for min 75kw next time with 98octane and 104+ super in it, and advancing of timing by a bit.

Nezza Cool
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3S-GE_Man
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 13:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
and gen 3 V8 commodores make about 160-170kw at the wheels.

Nezza Cool
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Cyber-punk
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Re: got my car dynoed Thu, 17 April 2003 15:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
barbel wrote on Thu, 17 April 2003 18:13

why does everyone have to be sceptical of everyone's results and bag people out, a friend had his sprinter tuned and got 125kw at the wheels, 4agte t3 turbs nice cooler std 9-10psi. and i've seen this thing munch some cars on the road. mk4 tt supra to the list and some WRX's and the likes. this thing is a machine. nice balance.

cant help but sense that everyone thinks they are better than everyone coz there car has more power or is faster, so puttin me of the car scene lately. share your enthusiasm and not your big heads.

Damo, well done on the result... could be a number of variants with your result, but just remember as long as your happy with it, and u smoke a few people... who gives a rats!!



i think its just peoples experiences and knowledge telling them that somthing doesnt seem right so they question it. i'm sure most if not all would happily be proved wrong and that the car actually does put 137rwkw down

i seriously doubt jealousy or "putting" people down is the intention.
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biased99
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Re: got my car dynoed Fri, 18 April 2003 01:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
3S-GE_Man wrote on Thu, 17 April 2003 23:44

and gen 3 V8 commodores make about 160-170kw at the wheels.

Nezza Cool


Obviously depends on the dyno, as the Gen3 tested on the dyno on which my car ran put out 133RWKW. I have heard that another Gen3 Commodore went across a dyno in QLD at 165RWKW...which means mine would have gone across that dyno at something like 150-155RWKW Smile (This assumes that the two Gen3s in question were in similar states of tune).
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Youngy
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Re: got my car dynoed Fri, 18 April 2003 02:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I personally see no reason to doubt those power figures, Damo has posted in the forums in the past in relation to just how much work and effort he has put into the build up of the 4AGZE. It is not like he just dropped the thing in from a front cut and pulled that figure.

Hey Barbel, is that your car in your avatar?

Cheers
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gianttomato
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Re: got my car dynoed Fri, 18 April 2003 02:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
I would have hoped that by now we all would have worked out that a chassis dyno is a handy tuning instrument and an attention grabber for 'Horsepower Hero' style shootouts, but that the actual numbers can mean very little in real terms.
Assuming a Dynodynamics dyno, Damo's 137 rwkW motor should be putting out conservatively around 240 hp at the flywheel, using their std calculations.

Probably another way to work out what power an engine is producing is to ascertain the duty cycle of the injectors. For example, assume 365 cc/min injectors running at 75 % duty cycle. That translates to 274 cc/min of flow per injector, so total flow of 1095 cc/min for a 4 cylinder engine. Using the old rule that approximately 5 cc/min equals 1 hp, this engine should be making around 219 hp at the flywheel. Some aftermarket ECUs will tell you what the injector duty cycle is.

I hope this helps.

Edit: My point is the numbers are actually not that unbelievable (both are within the same ball park) and easily quantifiable.

[Updated on: Fri, 18 April 2003 02:59]

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barbel
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Re: got my car dynoed Fri, 18 April 2003 02:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message

Youngy, yeah my car in the avatar.

Cyber-punk, thats exactly what i mean. why does he have to prove anything. if he's put the money and time into the motor/car then good for him.
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Seca Boy
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December 2002
Re: got my car dynoed Mon, 19 May 2003 07:05 Go to previous message
Damo, can I ask where you got your engine work done in Melbourne?

I want that sort of power through my front wheels Laughing
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