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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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 My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Fri, 17 September 2004 12:07
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Ok FINALLY installed my r154 - another thing out of the way.
Glen is gonna host some pics for me.
basically, the box hits on both sides, the drivers side a lot more so than passenger side. I also made up packers to drop the gearbox a tad, and made some engine mount spacers - these are to help with my carby setup...It also served a good purpose for fitting the otherwise huge box.
I also needed to cut out the shifter hole - i overdid it a bit, but ya get that 
Tools needed:
Fitting the box:
- OXY TORCH
- BLOCK HAMMER
- BALL PANE HAMMER
TO CUT hole in shifter location:
- TIN SNIPS
- ANGLE GRINDER
- POWER FILE.
The crossmember i used was out of an MZ10 auto soarer - thanks wilbo!
The shifter lever also sits too far back as the pic shows, so ill take the oxy to that sometime over the weekend - the plan is, if i make the lever dead straight, itll be fine and will look good also.
It appears a different speedo cable will be needed, but ill sort that out later.
So after all that, a couple of hours work and some fucking around fitted her like it was factory!
Feel free to throw any questions my way, as the process is still somewhat fresh in my mind!...
Blake
[Updated on: Fri, 17 September 2004 13:11]
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do
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Fri, 17 September 2004 12:19
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So, MZ10 crossmember just fitted? How was the tailshaft?
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do
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Fri, 17 September 2004 12:23
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| mrshin wrote on Fri, 17 September 2004 22:19 |
So, MZ10 crossmember just fitted? How was the tailshaft?
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Tailshaft not made yet. Will be done last before exhaust system in a few weeks.
MZ10 xmember made it look like it was original and went there!
The offset of the MZ10 auto is MUCH larger (prob 1.5-2") than the ma61 manual one. Perfect fit.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do
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Fri, 17 September 2004 14:26
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query only: can you have a spacer between gearbox crossmember and body where is bolts up? am just curious.
oh - you might want to put up a "not modem friendly" warning of the subject of original post.
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Location:
sunny coast, qld
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Fri, 17 September 2004 22:48
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Looks like you have been hard at work there Blake!
Not long now hey? 
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 03:18
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| Chris Davey wrote on Sat, 18 September 2004 08:48 |
Looks like you have been hard at work there Blake!
Not long now hey?
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getting there man. A couple of the acc brackets made today..so soon enough the engine can go in and get plugged in...then i can do a Blake version of the flame throwing V8...
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 03:19
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Holy crap, can you shrink those pics down a bit (or a lot)? They don't fit on my 17" monitor, I have to scroll around to see what's going on! 
Looking good, but I don't like the idea of spacing the gearbox down. When I used the wrong crossmember on my gearbox it positioned the output shaft about 10mm too low and this created a noticeable wobble/vibration at low speeds... this will kill your uni's quickly. Is there any way you can mount the box without spacers?
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do
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Sat, 18 September 2004 03:20
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| thechuckster wrote on Sat, 18 September 2004 00:26 |
query only: can you have a spacer between gearbox crossmember and body where is bolts up? am just curious.
oh - you might want to put up a "not modem friendly" warning of the subject of original post.
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Yeah i dont see a problem with it at all provided u use quality hardware - ie HT bolts. If you used crap, sure itd probly snap off.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 03:23
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| Norbie wrote on Sat, 18 September 2004 13:19 |
Holy crap, can you shrink those pics down a bit (or a lot)? They don't fit on my 17" monitor, I have to scroll around to see what's going on!
Looking good, but I don't like the idea of spacing the gearbox down. When I used the wrong crossmember on my gearbox it positioned the output shaft about 10mm too low and this created a noticeable wobble/vibration at low speeds... this will kill your uni's quickly. Is there any way you can mount the box without spacers?
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I also spaced the engine up. It's pretty level if youre under the car looking - i had a spirit level there the other day. I Needed the spacers to space the bellhousing more so it wouldnt hit the tunnel entrance, so they are a must - Otherwise no doubt with me revving it, itd smack the tunnel. Theres a good 20mm clearance now, which im hoping is enough.
The spacers are only 10mm too.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 04:24
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Looks good dude, but they need to be smaller so we can actually see them, and you need to learn how to focus your camera! Half the one's you've sent me are like that!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 04:50
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Blake, I would check the pinion angle. With the diff being firmly fixed, any more than 3 degrees will result in a nasty vibration and premature wear of the universal joints.
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Location:
Lost in the K hole
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 05:50
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blake, i think youre missing everyones point - only dave (above) has spelt it out for you...
it doesnt matter if the engine spacing matches the gearbox spacing, or if its at and angle or whatever...
pinon angle is critical!
are you junning a single piece shaft, or a two piece with a centre bearing?? be careful dude...
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 06:40
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| ed_ma61 wrote on Sat, 18 September 2004 15:50 |
blake, i think youre missing everyones point - only dave (above) has spelt it out for you...
it doesnt matter if the engine spacing matches the gearbox spacing, or if its at and angle or whatever...
pinon angle is critical!
are you junning a single piece shaft, or a two piece with a centre bearing?? be careful dude...
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two piece
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 07:22
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Yup, pinion angle is what I was trying to say. Ideally you want to have the pinion angle exactly the same as it was setup from the factory; to do that, the centre point of the crank pulley needs to be at the same height as the original 5M, and the centre point of the gearbox output shaft needs to be at the same height as the original W58. If either of these are out by even a small amount, the pinion angle will be all screwy - and that's bad, mm'kay?
You'll find out for yourself when you start driving the car and it shudders every time you take off from the lights... believe me it's not a nice feeling.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 07:45
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how the hell do i find out what the original height was 
Is it measureable with someone elses 5m ma61? or would there be a New spec book around?
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Location:
Lost in the K hole
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 09:33
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what do you reckon the offset of the stock centre bearing mount is? proabably the same as the size of that there spacer id reckon...
...and dave can attest to the 'badness' of the drivetrain shudder and moan the day i put that bearing in upside down 
perhaps a single piece shaft is in order??
you could probably change the orientation of the diff in the x-member quite easily too.
... what do people think about a 1pc shaft in the ma61? does anyone know if its been done on a stock setup, and if tere were any bad consequences?
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Registered:
August 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 09:36
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| ed_ma61 wrote on Sat, 18 September 2004 19:33 |
what do people think about a 1pc shaft in the ma61? does anyone know if its been done on a stock setup, and if tere were any bad consequences?
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Nathan has one for his GAY61, but as we all know its not driving yet
give him to xmas 2005
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 09:51
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| V8_MA61 wrote on Sat, 18 September 2004 17:45 |
how the hell do i find out what the original height was
Is it measureable with someone elses 5m ma61? or would there be a New spec book around?
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It's not so much the "height" but more the "plane" in which the crankshaft is in needs to be parallel to the original 5M crank.
When I checked mine, I used a roofing angle protractor. I placed it on the crank pulley determined the degrees off vertical it was at, and then placed it on the pinion of the diff to determine the same angle. I subtracted crank angle from the diff angle to determine the pinion angle.
With live rear ends, 4-6 degrees is acceptable for a leaf spring rear end, whilst 1-3 is desirable for a multilink rear end (because it is more firmly attached to the suspension). With an IRS, the diff is firmly affixed to the diff cradle, so ideally a pinion angle of 1-3 degrees is acceptable.
To adjust the pinion angle it might be easiest for you to adjust the height of the gearbox crossmember up or down. You may need to massage the transmission tunnel a little to make this all happen.
EDIT - and for god's sake, shrink down the pix.
[Updated on: Sat, 18 September 2004 09:56]
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Registered:
August 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 10:12
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Don't shoot the messenger. 
Pics edited.
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Location:
New Zealand
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 11:22
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| ed_ma61 wrote on Sat, 18 September 2004 21:33 |
what do people think about a 1pc shaft in the ma61?
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Biggest problem I can see is having to remove the motor or the diff to be able to get the gearbox out, unless you get brutal on the diff crossmember.
Callum
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Location:
Lost in the K hole
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 12:21
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taking the diff out of a supra isnt THAT big a deal...
for the advantages of a 1pc shaft 99% of the time, i could live with the pain of changing the clutch once a year
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 13:49
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Well, the parts car as Glen said had a single-piece shaft. There was no issues with it as I could see, drove smooth even though the engine was running like shit.
The downside is obvious, but there are less things to go wrong.
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Location:
syd
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sat, 18 September 2004 15:04
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mate some cars and a lot of 4WD have much more than 5 deg on da tailshafts
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Sun, 19 September 2004 00:34
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Ed, so you are saying consider dropping down the centre bearing that same distance as the box to make the angle exactly the same? WOuld that help matters?
Single piece TS is the cheapest and easiest way out...are they as strong as a 2 piece?
Thanks for the advice Dave...ill look more into it today
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: My R154 Install to MA61- How to do PICS ADDED
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Mon, 20 September 2004 02:29
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| 3krolla wrote on Sun, 19 September 2004 01:04 |
mate some cars and a lot of 4WD have much more than 5 deg on da tailshafts
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Because leaf springs hold the diff much more 'loosely' than a multilink suspension, up to 6 degrees is acceptable.
Those rock crawling 4WDs run even more angle but you will notice they run quite a different tailshaft setup.
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