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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 05:02
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Guys I am so pissed off at the moment
just got the car back again after waiting like 3 and half months and that hour something happened i think its the timming and cams they are F%^ked, and now he wants me to pay more again. The mechanic claims that i got the wrong Head Gasket, as there was no oil flow through the head at first. until he made a bybass into the head so oil will flow. So my question is did i get the wrong head gasket
i have a 1989 mr2 turbo 3sgte its the complete orginal jap spec. I purchased a 1.6mm HKS head gasket for it with qouting the year 1989 and the bore 87.5. which i am pretty sure is the gen 2 motor which is what the 89 - 93 came as. I need to know is there any variations in these headgasgets???? any help would be so much appreciated.
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Location:
Perth
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 05:21
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| MR. 2 wrote on Thu, 06 January 2005 13:02 |
i have a 1989 mr2 turbo 3sgte its the complete orginal jap spec. I purchased a 1.6mm HKS head gasket for it with qouting the year 1989 and the bore 87.5. which i am pretty sure is the gen 2 motor which is what the 89 - 93 came as.
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The bore is 86mm.
Not sure about the rest of your problems though. Sorry.
Gabe
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 05:37
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this is so odd i have done so much searching and im seeing this more and more
"HKS Stopper Metal Head Gasket TOYOTA MR2 1990-1995 Turbo ; Engine Code: 3SGTE Thickness(mm): 1.6 Bore(mm): 87.5"
I dont know what to think... i Am so sure that this is right its the only listing that i can find and i know HKS are the biggest range of aftermarket parts for the 3sgte, and everywhere i go even HKS say that its all right. but then blitz have a 1.6mm Gasket that is the bore of 86mm... what the F^&k is going on here.
can anyone shed some light.
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Location:
Perth
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 05:43
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Not sure..... it's not even possible to bore the 3s out to 87.5mm.
I'd say a typo on HKS's behalf??
Gabe
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Nthn Beaches, Sydney
Registered:
October 2004
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 05:44
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| MR. 2 wrote on Thu, 06 January 2005 16:02 |
i have a 1989 mr2 turbo
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"HKS Stopper Metal Head Gasket TOYOTA MR2 1990-1995 Turbo
You've said 1989, then 1990. That's not the problem is it?
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Location:
nth ringwood, Victoria
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 05:50
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the h/gaskets are the same till 98 then they changed for the 3sge BEAMS motor he didnt put it back to front did he there is only 1 oil gallery and that at the back of the block
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Location:
nth ringwood, Victoria
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 06:02
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just checked you can not change them around they have a dowell locator either end and gasket will only fit 1 way. If he put the motor together its up to him to check and make sure that the gasket was right anyway most of the aftermarket gaskets have a 3mm oil restrictor built into the gasket .The altezza 1s have them now
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 06:11
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Tell the guy he is a moron and that his bypass has f'cked your head. 
Get him to replace it with Toyota part number 11101-88481 
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 07:36
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gt
| Quote: |
HKS Stopper Metal Head Gasket TOYOTA MR2 1990-1995 Turbo
You've said 1989, then 1990. That's not the problem is it?
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no not really because not many people relise that the production on mr2's started in 10/89 they are the same motor as the 90.
so what people are telling me is:
head gasket cant be wrong.
can be put in backwards because its not possible
then i have another question why when it was started orginally did it not have any oilflow to the head, i know the head was just fully re-coed again.
also toobs what do you mean by | Quote: |
Tell the guy he is a moron and that his bypass has f'cked your head.
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i just want to know how you come to this conclusion?
thanks for all the replies.
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Location:
MACKAY
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 12:24
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What has actually happened , has the cams locked up due to no oil .
How did your mechanic make a bypass to the head ,
ALL gen 1,2,3 head gaskets are interchangeable , was there good oil flow to the head when he returned the car to you .
Trevor
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 21:09
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this i dont know yet... this is what happened when he put together he said no oil when into the head at all. so he made a bypass from the turbo feed on the block into where the oil press switch goes (had an oil pressure gauge there, so i couldnt tell you the oil pres cause the gauge isnt hooked up. anyways i dorev itfor about 8 mins hard. then 15 mins easy as soon as i came off the freeway i head a cruncing noise (something getting chewed) and then i stoped tried to starte it and then i tried to kick it over and it wont start it now makes the noise (when you kisk it over its a slower ne ne ne then starts now its a nenenene like the timming belts not sp9inning anything, or its spinning freeley. i havnt pulled anything apart cause i havent had time.
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 22:45
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If you aren't getting enough oil to the head your cams will most likely mangle the bearings and close up the oil journals.
It is possible that they clogged up one or more of your oil journals in the block when they machined the deck and so the oil wasn't flowing freely to the head.
In either case I would be going back to the mechanic and telling him to fix the problem other wise tell him he owes you a new head!
The Toyota part number I listed is for the Gen3 3SGTE head... tell him he owes you one of those 
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Thu, 06 January 2005 23:29
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yeah i wouldnt mind the gen 3 head mmm
thanks for the info guys. its just his trying to put it back on me saying that i got the worng head gasket which it seems is imposible to have done becuase HKS only make one and it is listed for 89 to 93 some places have it listed till 95. also i rang toyota trd have 2 head gasgets also for 3sgte.
10/89 to 12/93 then gasket 2 1/94 to 99
i am going to kill this guy.
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Location:
South Australia
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 03:28
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Yeah you got stooged.
Even if you did get the wrong head gasket (which I can assure you that you didn't) - who cares? He put the engine back together incorrectly and it blew up - 100% his problem, not yours. NO GOOD mechanic would put an engine back together with an incorrect head gasket that kills oil flow to the head.
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 03:45
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thanks guys i can now go back to him and confront him with no worries and say fix my car you shit head....
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
October 2004
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 04:58
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i'll lend u my year 10 baseball bat 
So how did it go? did you get him to replace it for you? He bloody well should dude.... wasnt there like a warentee on the job?
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 05:43
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the car is still in the garage so nothing has been done. And warntee on the head gasket sure... but this seems likes a different problem however he pulled the head off and therefore the timming had to be reset and thats where i think the problem lays so this is again his problem.
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 06:27
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Mmmmmmm, the way I see it, your oil pressure sender is in the head right? So if no oil was getting to the head, you would have seen the oil warning light or no oil pressure registering on your gauge (not sure if mr2;s have a gauge also??)
Who would reassemble the engine and start it without getting oil pressure first???
Any 1st year apprecntice mechanic would know that no oil pressure = bad and would investigate the cause of it, even if it was the gasket (which I very much doubt)
The fact this 'mechanic' has re=routed the oil to the head externally suggests he DID know of this oiling problem but couldn't be farked removing the head again to investigate the cause.
He obviously knew there WAS oil pressure at the oil pump / block / turbo feed, and NOT at the head which means a blocked oil gallery or head gasket issue. Running an oil feed like you have said may have worked as a dodgy patch up if it was a gasket issue, obviously is wasnt the gasket at all.
From the information you have provided thus far, he owe;s you a reco head, a head gasket + labour etc, (more like a rebuild as metal from your cam journals have probably found their way through the motor..check the sump.)
Don't pull it down yourself. work something out with him and have a qualified mechanic who is prepared to give a written report do the post mortem or at least be present as a witness when old mate pulls it down.
My 2c wth
Good luck..
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 08:10
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| Quote: |
Mmmmmmm, the way I see it, your oil pressure sender is in the head right? So if no oil was getting to the head, you would have seen the oil warning light or no oil pressure registering on your gauge (not sure if mr2;s have a gauge also??)
Who would reassemble the engine and start it without getting oil pressure first???
Any 1st year apprecntice mechanic would know that no oil pressure = bad and would investigate the cause of it, even if it was the gasket (which I very much doubt)
The fact this 'mechanic' has re=routed the oil to the head externally suggests he DID know of this oiling problem but couldn't be farked removing the head again to investigate the cause.
He obviously knew there WAS oil pressure at the oil pump / block / turbo feed, and NOT at the head which means a blocked oil gallery or head gasket issue. Running an oil feed like you have said may have worked as a dodgy patch up if it was a gasket issue, obviously is wasnt the gasket at all.
From the information you have provided thus far, he owe;s you a reco head, a head gasket + labour etc, (more like a rebuild as metal from your cam journals have probably found their way through the motor..check the sump.)
Don't pull it down yourself. work something out with him and have a qualified mechanic who is prepared to give a written report do the post mortem or at least be present as a witness when old mate pulls it down.
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thank you so much that has been the biggest help yet... i swear to god i hope that this hasnt gone into the block otherwise i am going to friggen die the car has just been rebuilt 20,000 km with all the good gear.
thanks again.
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 09:57
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ok here is what i have found... i pulled the rocket cover off the head its still perfect thank good the cams are in great order. and it seems the damage is external thank god..
but what i have no idea.
i have taken some pictures and a movie the timming belt is loose as and there are metal shavings everywhere, if anyone has some time just go to the ftp://220.244.201.74 and there are the files there.
if the ftp dont work i have uploaded them to yahoo
http://f2.pg.briefcase.yahoo.com/t_revup
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Location:
tallahassee FL usOFa
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 14:46
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with those pics & not knowing the car, i can't tell much, but i do know that there is never anything at all good about metal bits, unless they are from a machining operation, like a drill or tap. those shavings are not & do not look like that at all, if they've "installed" an external oil line.
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 15:25
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From the location of all those metal bits it looks like it must be from your cams.
Maybe the builder didn't install the end bearings on the cams properly (or at all)?
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 15:47
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cams in the head i have checked and they are sweet, the cam gears are perfect.. its loer down i cant see it as u can see i took the cam cover off and i just cant see anythig its its further down, all i can do is hope that everything is all good
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Fri, 07 January 2005 16:33
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Below the cams are the water pump, cam guide & tensioner, oil pump.
Must be one of the above then.
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Tue, 11 January 2005 03:51
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Sorry, can't see anything except filings in those photo's.
What happened to the engine whilst you were driving it exactly??
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Tue, 11 January 2005 21:59
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thats right filings from what i have no idea.. its come from somewhere in the timming cover the lower part ther but i cant make out what. I know its not aliminum metal because a magnet picks it up so its i would presume something else other then the water or oil pump because i think the both of them are aliminum metals.
steve i cant really tell you what happened i just was driving then heard some crunshing sounds then i pulled over and then started the car up again the sound still there i shut down the car and then tried to start one more time and will not start... that is due to the timming belt being so loose now.
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Location:
South Australia
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Wed, 12 January 2005 01:28
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The solution to your problem is to take the lower cam cover off
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Toymods member
I supported Toymods
Location:
Rydalmere, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3sgte head gasket question
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Wed, 12 January 2005 04:02
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If the cam gears are still good, then the reason why the timing belt would be loose is if one of the tensioners wasn't tight. But that still doesn't explain the grinding sound you heard either.
fix.
I know what the fault with mine was (could say a cracked head, near the valve guide on exhaust #2, it's not a very big crack but it's enough to let in water and bubble it in the radiator), but with yours you're still at a loss. I do hope you find out the problem soon and hope also that it's not a big fix.
PS: Anyone know where I can pick up a good reco-d Gen 3 head from? 
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