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170bhp Regular Registered: January 2004	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve? Sat, 28 May 2005 05:16 Takai, with regards to engine size they tested anumber of engines upto 90mm bore size, 5 valve substantially better. as to the 20v head just being chucked on a bottom end comeon guys get with it!!! we can only imagine the amount of R&D toyota and yamaha did before this motor went into production, Takai you make it sound like a decision they made over coffee, I very much doubt that!!and as for sayin well yamaha did the development work for the R1 Well bloody hell is it a suprise to find out that they also developed the 20v 4age for toyota!!!!!Takai alot of your thoughts on port size are definately 80's thinking! Takai I also don't know where you got your information for airflow, but the tech paper shows airflow versus valve lift and airflow versus rpm and again the 20v is far superior!!It doesn't significantly decrease, it significantly increases!! as rpm was increased VE for 4 valve dropped off as VE for 5 valve increased.Takai the valve angles on a 20v are far superior ESPECIALLY when you consider intake port angle!!! yeah no short turn there baby, if you think this is wrong look at ALL modern motors to see the difference in port angle, 20v does have one of the steepest but it follows the convention of many high speed motors in this regards, the old trend was very wide valve angle and flat intake port this is OLD SCHOOL, just about all motors now are very narrow valve angle and steep intake port, the valve angle allows for higher compression(higher combustion pressure therfore higher output) with out having to ruin the flame front with huge valve cut outs and huge wedge on the piston to get comp ratio back up again.you will see when they went from silver 20v to black 20v they actually reduced the squish area, cam timing is very very similar and they put out more BHP.in forced induction motor squish is actually detrimental, how do I know this? many SR20 turbo motors on the dyno!! also any one that says small port bigger than 20v or big port better is such and such a case if you read my first post properly (if you can read and comprehend technical that is) you will see better VE, better flow, better CE, higher BMEP for 5 valve, if you compare two motors and one has all those things better and rpm etc are equal then output MUST be higher, no argument!! Jonny2t love ya thinking with regards to your valve timing locations you are spot on in your thinking vvt gives us the best of both worlds, and again you are right with regards to the Atlantic TRD parts!!! CLG what do I want from a standard motor - MORE!! as for the usual FUKED responses like why don't george bush use a 20v if they are so good, how about the rotary engine? why isn't it used in sports car racing or f1, because regulations state it can't be used, why can't 5 valve be used in F1, get the FIA regs, maximum 4 valves!!! Why can't the NR750 motor be used in motorbike racing? I remember that one clearly(most of you guys probably were sitting around making a mess for your mums in ya nappies!!) but Honda bought out this trick oval piston 4 cyl motor, 8 valves per cyl, it was like a mini V8, two rods per cylinder, it didn't even get one race in, NEW RULE, one conrod per piston, overnight it banned it, so because that motor is not running in motorbike racing following some of your thoughts it must be a useless motor!!!!!FUK I love listening to experts, how old are some of you guys? early 20's, yeah sure is a lot of technical in your favourite tech mag, fast fours or something weak like that!!!get on an engine dyno and learn the truths!! I have had bigport, small port 20v and gze on engine dyno and the results consistantly come up the same, I used 20v for my turbo motor knowing the VE was higher, higher VE = more torque, more torque = more power, end of story! FUK I LOVE EXPERTS!!! [Report message to a moderator]

	Subject	Poster	Date
	Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Fri, 27 May 2005 12:54
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Big T	Fri, 27 May 2005 13:39
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Fri, 27 May 2005 14:49
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Fri, 27 May 2005 15:09
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Jonny2TG	Fri, 27 May 2005 15:34
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Sat, 28 May 2005 00:26
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	CLG	Sat, 28 May 2005 01:12
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Jonny2TG	Sat, 28 May 2005 01:42
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 05:16
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	floody	Tue, 31 May 2005 13:06
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 05:33
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Henn	Sat, 28 May 2005 05:41
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 05:48
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 05:46
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:05
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:07
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Acoustic	Tue, 31 May 2005 16:03
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:10
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:15
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:14
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:17
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	shinybluesteel	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:40
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	JFAllen	Sat, 28 May 2005 07:28
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:39
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:43
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:43
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:45
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:48
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 06:58
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Jonny2TG	Sat, 28 May 2005 07:52
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Sat, 28 May 2005 08:24
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	bored	Sat, 28 May 2005 10:45
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 10:08
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:12
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:14
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:24
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:19
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:32
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	bored	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:40
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:43
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:48
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:49
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:53
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	IRA11Y	Mon, 06 June 2005 07:26
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	ke382TG	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:50
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sat, 28 May 2005 11:59
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	ke382TG	Sat, 28 May 2005 12:37
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sat, 28 May 2005 13:58
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	boudan	Sat, 28 May 2005 15:22
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Acoustic	Tue, 31 May 2005 16:16
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	*rivmasta*	Wed, 01 June 2005 00:38
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	off-road	Sun, 05 June 2005 09:14
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	off-road	Sun, 05 June 2005 09:31
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sun, 29 May 2005 01:29
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Ben Wilson	Tue, 31 May 2005 00:03
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Joshstix	Sun, 29 May 2005 02:26
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sun, 29 May 2005 08:14
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	SEXY 16	Sun, 29 May 2005 09:41
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	river	Sun, 29 May 2005 11:53
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sun, 29 May 2005 12:00
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sun, 29 May 2005 12:08
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sun, 29 May 2005 12:11
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Mr Revhead	Sun, 29 May 2005 12:34
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Sun, 29 May 2005 13:35
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	ROLLA GTi	Sun, 29 May 2005 13:45
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Jonny2TG	Sun, 29 May 2005 14:15
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sun, 29 May 2005 14:58
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	THE WITZL	Mon, 30 May 2005 02:34
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	funkdoc	Mon, 30 May 2005 11:02
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	4agte	Mon, 06 June 2005 08:18
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	floody	Mon, 06 June 2005 09:57
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	4agte	Mon, 06 June 2005 10:10
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	floody	Tue, 07 June 2005 04:13
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Mon, 30 May 2005 09:14
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Mon, 30 May 2005 09:18
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Tue, 31 May 2005 10:36
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Jonny2TG	Mon, 30 May 2005 15:37
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Johnny	Mon, 30 May 2005 15:55
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	justcallmefrank	Tue, 31 May 2005 02:07
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Tue, 31 May 2005 00:26
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Ben Wilson	Tue, 31 May 2005 01:02
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Tue, 31 May 2005 01:04
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	THE WITZL	Tue, 31 May 2005 07:41
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Jonny2TG	Tue, 31 May 2005 08:23
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Tue, 31 May 2005 11:40
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Tue, 31 May 2005 11:56
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Merudo	Tue, 31 May 2005 11:57
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	xolent	Tue, 31 May 2005 12:17
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Tue, 31 May 2005 12:25
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Tue, 31 May 2005 12:43
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Tue, 31 May 2005 12:34
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Tue, 31 May 2005 12:57
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Tue, 31 May 2005 13:13
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	funkdoc	Wed, 01 June 2005 12:41
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Wed, 01 June 2005 14:04
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	emmac	Wed, 01 June 2005 14:45
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	rx-3 ip	Sat, 04 June 2005 06:26
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sun, 05 June 2005 13:15
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sun, 05 June 2005 13:47
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Kr0n1k	Sun, 05 June 2005 17:34
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	170bhp	Sun, 05 June 2005 22:28
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	EMP-2TG	Sun, 05 June 2005 23:50
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	off-road	Sun, 05 June 2005 23:34
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sun, 05 June 2005 23:40
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	jkvsnn	Tue, 07 June 2005 03:19
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Tue, 07 June 2005 03:34
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Sun, 05 June 2005 23:44
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	SEXY 16	Mon, 06 June 2005 01:00
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Mon, 06 June 2005 02:01
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	off-road	Mon, 06 June 2005 02:40
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Mon, 06 June 2005 04:02
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Mon, 06 June 2005 07:04
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	*rivmasta*	Mon, 06 June 2005 07:29
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	*rivmasta*	Mon, 06 June 2005 07:32
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Mon, 06 June 2005 08:14
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Mon, 06 June 2005 09:06
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	4agte	Mon, 06 June 2005 09:11
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Mon, 06 June 2005 11:38
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bobski	Mon, 06 June 2005 16:41
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Blown86	Mon, 06 June 2005 23:30
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Corona RT142	Mon, 06 June 2005 23:31
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	adamaw11	Tue, 07 June 2005 01:26
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Bill Sherwood	Tue, 07 June 2005 02:54
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	shinybluesteel	Tue, 07 June 2005 03:03
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	lumpy	Tue, 07 June 2005 05:52
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Fri, 10 June 2005 01:50
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	TheStitt	Wed, 08 June 2005 06:24
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	510rob	Thu, 09 June 2005 19:48
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	takai	Fri, 10 June 2005 04:23
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Fri, 10 June 2005 04:57
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Mr Revhead	Fri, 10 June 2005 05:49
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Fri, 10 June 2005 06:21
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	Mr Revhead	Fri, 10 June 2005 07:02
	Re: Is 5 valve better than 4 valve?	oldcorollas	Fri, 10 June 2005 07:24

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