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RWDboy Forums Junkie Location: South Australia Registered: July 2002	Re: Petrol Prices Fri, 16 September 2005 02:50 86tt wrote on Fri, 16 September 2005 00:18 RWDboy wrote on Fri, 16 September 2005 00:06 Oh so now you are a better person than us too? It takes a very articulate and insightful individual to go and make a judgement about people, their beliefs and their process based on the fact that they have qualifications and don't agree with your argument (which is not really *your* argument, but some other 'websites' claim that you are pimping). there's no point debating any further, you have existing companies who are currently providing the technology & products and you have information about inventions that tracks back to more than 100 years ago, you have newspaper articles of great inventions and even a video of a news item on a water powered vehicle dating back 20 years ago, you have horror stories of people that are threatened and killed by the authorities, and all these information are right in your face, but ignorance overcomes your intellegence, just because you thought you have a PhD or a degree, it makes you think everyone else out there is insane, what weren't told to you at your university isn't true. I am sick to death of writing massive posts to clarify a viewpoint that is so flipping obvious in the first place. This is why I've resisted jumping into this argument, but once again I have encountered another special type of ignoramus that I feel is worthy of being blasted into oblivion via the use of a massive post. Okay, for starters, you reckon that University is perpetuating one big fat lie. I'm not sure whether you have or haven't, but it sounds to me like you should perhaps *go* to University before passing judgement on it. You are suffering from what you presume to be the same problem that we are suffering - i.e. selective beliefs. Firstly, alot of these companies are very very young, and alot of them aren't producing the massive energy saving benefits that they claim. Secondly, alot of these 'claims' by certain people that they are going to be killed are just that, 'claims'. Threatening to kill people is against the law in most countries (in Australia for example it falls under the category of 'assault') - chances are the reason that no charges have ever been laid is because most of the people making these claims have nothing to back it up and are probably suffering some kind of psychological condition whereby they have a massive need for attention. You reckon that 'authorities' don't want particular energy saving schemes to work - well I say that's utter bullstick. It is in EVERY country's interest to become energy efficient. It would give a MASSIVE advantage over other countries when it comes to trade etc if the amount of energy we used to create our products was *less* than that of those countries around us. To be honest, it sounds to me like you have started to block out simple logic so that you can believe some more easily perpetuated falsity (such as the conspiracy that all governments resist change). Furthermore, you claim that 'ignorance' has overcome my 'intelligence'. Well once again you are so far off the mark it is ridiculous. I am not 'ignorant' of the claims of some companies, newspapers, individuals etc. I think University is quite poor, to be honest. I totally agree that in some degrees the way they teach and what they teach is utterly ridiculous, plus I also know that alot of people who exit their degrees and jump in to the workplace do *not* get what they were expecting, and there is a massive learning curve immediately in place for them. Whilst I may know this from experience - you have yet to make it clear why *you* think University's suck ass. Which brings me to another point - your communication skills suck ass. I mean, if you were to explain your background and position more clearly then I would *know* that you haven't done any University study (or have only done limited amounts), but because you don't actually say much in your massive spiels about conspiracy garbage, all I can do is make an 'assumption' that you haven't done any University because your argument is full of holes and you aren't able to rebut anything slightly theory related that is thrown your way. 86tt wrote on Fri, 16 September 2005 00:18 Or think about this, you have an internal combustion engine in your car, which is shit all inefficient, say 30%? The rest gets turned into sound and heat, so much heat that you need another system to consistently remove the heat so your engine doesn't overheat, you pump the heat out with coolant, and a couple of 10, 12" electric fans, huge radiators that cracks and needs to be replaced every few years, why? Why doesn't all these wasted heat gets harnessed and recycled and turned back into energy? Because no oil companies nor car manufacturer give a f..k about the wasted fuel and energy! Car manufacturers don't give a crap about wasted fuel and energy ey? Okay - instead of me having to explain to you WHY they actually give a crap, how about you tell me *WHY* they don't give a crap. How about trying to add some logic and reasoning in. 86tt wrote on Fri, 16 September 2005 00:18 Have a look at such innovation: http://www.whispergen.com/main/acwhispergen/ a company that builds a boiler with a sterling engine to recover lost energy, these household boiler most likely boil the water up to around 60 degrees, but while providing 8kW of heating they can recover an extra 1.2kW of electricity, that's about 15% of the original intended power! If car manufacturers were any keen, wouldn't it be great to have such device to recover the extra heat wasted from inefficient combustion engine and use it to charge the battery, run the air conditioning etc.? No more huge radiators and thermo fans! Combine this with a system to run a generator when the brake pedal is on (already being done with hybrid cars) How much more will that would improve the overall system efficiency of the car? The media keeps going on about how they're building more fuel efficient cars, that's all B.S.! Look at the efficiency of today's corollas (1L/10km premium unleaded) and the corollas 10 years ago (1L/10km unleaded), where's the improvement? It's just a big lie that everybody's is believing! Well just so you know, the improvement has come in emissions, safety (notice that the corolla now weighs between 1100kg and 1200kg as opposed to 900kg?), and to correct your figures (which were pulled from your ass) the Corolla (1.6litre VVTi 5-speed manual, petrol engine) uses 7.0litres per 100km (according to the vehicle certification authority - this test is a metropolitan type of fuel consumption figure). Unfortunately the exact same tests have not been tried on older model Corolla's, but a brief look at my stack of wheels magazines and I can give you a rough figure for a Corolla of both ten and twenty years ago - ten years ago the Seca RV (1.8litre, similar level of performance) used 7.3litres per 100km (however this included a highway driving figure) and the Corolla Twin Cam (venerable AE82) of 20 years ago used 9.2litres per 100km. How about - you go to http://www.greencarcongress.com and look at what those conspiratorial maniacal car companies and those dreaded evil narcissistic 'authorities' are doing to promote and develop greener cars by the use of thermo electrics (ie - exactly what you were referring to above). 86tt wrote on Fri, 16 September 2005 00:18 EDIT: Just found some info to say 70% of an engine is lost through heat, so some energy are lost through sound and the rest out the flywheel, so I can safely assume IC engine have peak efficiency at 30%.... so if it produces 100kw, then it'll be safe to say that if we reserve 10% of this heat so the engine stays at the correct operating temp., so the other 60% of heat which is worth 200kw! If the sterling system can recover 15% of 200kW, that's an extra 30kw, and the air conditioning probably only drains 0.5-1kw? How'd you like an extra 30kw to play with? I think the reason that this doesn't occur in cars is because of the weight of the system - please go and look at how the system operates and you should be able to figure out why it won't work so well!!! So while you may be quite right in bringing to our attention some various sources which purport to be able to create energy out of nothing, please don't go boonta when we shoot you down with a decent argument. [Report message to a moderator]

	Subject	Poster	Date
	Petrol Prices	godsend	Tue, 06 September 2005 12:59
	Re: Petrol Prices	Sprinter Adam	Tue, 06 September 2005 13:09
	Re: Petrol Prices	ae80	Tue, 06 September 2005 13:12
	Re: Petrol Prices	Evan	Tue, 06 September 2005 23:23
	Re: Petrol Prices	ViPeR_NiPPleX	Tue, 06 September 2005 23:57
	Re: Petrol Prices	rthy	Wed, 07 September 2005 03:52
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Wed, 07 September 2005 02:14
	Re: Petrol Prices	Shraka	Wed, 07 September 2005 02:15
	Re: Petrol Prices	Corona RT142	Wed, 07 September 2005 02:17
	Re: Petrol Prices	bigg willie style	Wed, 07 September 2005 03:39
	Re: Petrol Prices	thu187	Wed, 07 September 2005 03:58
	Re: Petrol Prices	Roundy	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:00
	Re: Petrol Prices	ke382TG	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:04
	Re: Petrol Prices	suthol	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:13
	Re: Petrol Prices	Shraka	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:18
	Re: Petrol Prices	Corona RT142	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:21
	Re: Petrol Prices	rthy	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:23
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:28
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:46
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:48
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:49
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:51
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:52
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Wed, 07 September 2005 05:06
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 13:27
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 13:46
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Wed, 07 September 2005 13:52
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:02
	Re: Petrol Prices	dingaling	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:06
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:15
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:20
	Re: Petrol Prices	dingaling	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:26
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:38
	Re: Petrol Prices	Merudo	Wed, 07 September 2005 05:35
	Re: Petrol Prices	Corona RT142	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:30
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:31
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:31
	Re: Petrol Prices	ke382TG	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:31
	Re: Petrol Prices	Corona RT142	Wed, 07 September 2005 04:32
	Re: Petrol Prices	Shraka	Wed, 07 September 2005 07:42
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Wed, 07 September 2005 05:12
	Re: Petrol Prices	Corona RT142	Wed, 07 September 2005 05:13
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 07:30
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Wed, 07 September 2005 07:34
	Re: Petrol Prices	bubbles	Wed, 07 September 2005 07:35
	Re: Petrol Prices	rob_RA40	Wed, 07 September 2005 05:25
	Re: Petrol Prices	Corona RT142	Wed, 07 September 2005 05:36
	Re: Petrol Prices	Smokey228	Wed, 07 September 2005 06:43
	Re: Petrol Prices	Corona RT142	Wed, 07 September 2005 09:51
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Wed, 07 September 2005 11:46
	Re: Petrol Prices	dingaling	Wed, 07 September 2005 12:27
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Wed, 07 September 2005 13:49
	Re: Petrol Prices	dingaling	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:00
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 14:06
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 07 September 2005 13:29
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Wed, 07 September 2005 15:04
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Sat, 10 September 2005 17:05
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Sun, 11 September 2005 06:15
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Sun, 11 September 2005 09:43
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Sun, 11 September 2005 12:17
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Sun, 11 September 2005 06:15
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Sun, 11 September 2005 06:20
	Re: Petrol Prices	Benjamin	Sun, 11 September 2005 06:28
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Sun, 11 September 2005 13:24
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Sun, 11 September 2005 13:56
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Sun, 11 September 2005 14:15
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Sun, 11 September 2005 14:38
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Mon, 12 September 2005 03:34
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Mon, 12 September 2005 06:31
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Mon, 12 September 2005 16:14
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Tue, 13 September 2005 06:03
	Re: Petrol Prices	Marc205	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:02
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:22
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:48
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:56
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Tue, 13 September 2005 09:12
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Tue, 13 September 2005 09:43
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Wed, 14 September 2005 15:35
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Wed, 14 September 2005 15:41
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Wed, 14 September 2005 15:54
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Wed, 14 September 2005 16:06
	Re: Petrol Prices	poh_86	Mon, 12 September 2005 07:14
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Mon, 12 September 2005 07:39
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Mon, 12 September 2005 13:51
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Tue, 13 September 2005 06:05
	Re: Petrol Prices	Lucid	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:26
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:27
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:35
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Tue, 13 September 2005 08:41
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Wed, 14 September 2005 16:08
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Wed, 14 September 2005 16:31
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Wed, 14 September 2005 17:22
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Wed, 14 September 2005 23:41
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Thu, 15 September 2005 00:06
	Re: Petrol Prices	mynameisrodney	Thu, 15 September 2005 01:08
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Thu, 15 September 2005 06:41
	Re: Petrol Prices	Marc205	Thu, 15 September 2005 09:17
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Thu, 15 September 2005 13:11
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Thu, 15 September 2005 13:18
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Thu, 15 September 2005 13:32
	Re: Petrol Prices	Norbie	Thu, 15 September 2005 13:29
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Thu, 15 September 2005 14:06
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Thu, 15 September 2005 14:27
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Thu, 15 September 2005 14:48
	Re: Petrol Prices	RWDboy	Fri, 16 September 2005 02:50
	Re: Petrol Prices	86tt	Fri, 16 September 2005 05:07
	Re: Petrol Prices	smt_007	Thu, 15 September 2005 14:31
	Re: Petrol Prices	oldcorollas	Thu, 15 September 2005 14:45
	Re: Petrol Prices	TRD_Supra	Fri, 16 September 2005 09:30

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