| Author | Topic |
|---|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Wed, 04 June 2003 10:29
|
 |
Just curious to know what the st185 was capable of in stock trim over a quarter ...
They are a prick to launch - so ive found ...
Any ideas on 4wd launch techniques without busting the thing to bits ?
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Wed, 04 June 2003 12:52
|
|
Stu,
Stock the ST185 should do about 15.2sec.
Your best launch will come from about 5.5K to 6K RPM launch then just sidestep the clutch it works well just hope your clutch can take it, they tend to ware quickly.
The drive train is pretty strong and can take it.
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
south of the big smoke
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Wed, 04 June 2003 23:50
|
|
garys GT4 does 18's 
heheh damn clutch 
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Thu, 05 June 2003 00:48
|
|
|
Yep, thats right. My car does 18's and thats before i turn the ignition on
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Thu, 05 June 2003 08:12
|
|
The clutch i have is a heavy duty unit - i made sure i got that - as ive heard the stock ones Shithouse and slips under high boost ..
the one i have is pretty decent - took me ages to get the feel for it right after the ta22 -
Ive heard the drivetrains pretty good especially the gearbox !
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Fri, 06 June 2003 02:08
|
|
yeah i've got a heavy duty ATM also but its still not good enough, i'll be swithcing to a twin plate as soon as finances allow.
The heavy duty wont slip until it gets a little heat into it, but they also wear out pretty quick. Mine is about 18 months old now and its getting towards being on its last legs.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 02:38
|
|
The HD clutch in mines actually still pretty good - the previous owner didnt thrash the guts out of her - which is the main reason i bought it - bar that little driveshaft incident - for a 200 thousand KM motior it doesnt make a puff of smoke and idles like new ..
Gearbox Still has good feel in the synchros thogh i think the selector fork might be a bit worn - nothing major though ..
re twin plate - how much would that set you back ?
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 02:52
|
|
It doesnt need much thrashing to wear it out. 3 or 4 drag meets will do it.
The twin is gonna cost me about $1600 although it retails for $1900 odd. Its a good investment if your planning on upping the power cause not only will it hold but it want wear so easily.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 03:06
|
|
well, the mods have started gary - Got my group A Bar - just waiting ona reply from one of your guys up in Sydney for the mounting bar and thast will be going on ..
Spent yesterday nutting out the exhaust system ( 3 inch Straight thru system + 3.5 inch aussie dump pipe ) with the local gosrt Shop .. he thinks he can do it for about the $1600 mark all stainless - including the dumpy. thats going to be the first powermod 
not looking for huge power increases in the next 6 to 12 though the exhaust is a definate - as is a few swaps to the intercooler setup .
Id prefer to get the car handling right and have a bit more poke than stock - before i go the full nut and make it a 140 + RWKW car
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 03:37
|
|
CeLiCa: Managed to get another Grp A bar new - they had one left at altona so i grabbed that while i could - Ill still bring your bar back as soon as we can pick a day after ylur exams
re exhaust system - the one under it's only around 2.5 ich max and twistybendy - the one i want is basically the same as what i had off the ta22 - Straight thru - minimal bends - and neighbour annoyingly loud :)The reduction is only half an inch off the dump pipe - otherwise its 3 inch all thru . Price includes the dump pipe as well - fitted
i need the highflow cat and dumpy anyway - and the rest of the system isnt stainless as far as i know
The ststem i had from the same exhaust dude on the ta22 lasted 8 years with no corrosion , and is Still going strong under the ta22 with Jezz .. Id only needed to replace the muffler once - just before i sold it
Its a long term investment , plus i miss having a noisy car ( lol ) my ta22 howled and barked - and you could hear it for miles - the Gt4 is just too sedate for waking up the neighbours in a kilometer wide area
( plus ill probably sell the AVO cat back system to recoup some of the costs )
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 03:45
|
|
We'll set a time for around a week once they are all done. There's another guy that wants to pay a bit more than u did for it because his cousin has a panel beating shop and can get it fixed for nothing. I'll PM u as soon as my exams are over.
I still dont get why the exhaust is costing you so much.
Stainless dump ($450) + cat ($250) + muffler ($200) + piping ($150) + optional resonator ($70) adds up only to around $1100.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 03:56
|
|
Try pricing the Aussie exhaust system - they are WAY over $1600
Exhaust shops in melb might be cheaper too - and really i dont mind having exactly the same work done locally and have my car back in a day or so tops - then not having it for a week or more - with people i dont know working on it
for 400 extra approx i know what this guy can do - i have my car back in about a day - I dont have to travel to melbourne and back ( twice ) + I can watch the progress of the car being gorsted whenever i want.
It mainly comes down to convenience and reputation.
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 04:58
|
|
Stu,
$1600 for a full stainless system is a descent price, i wouldnt be complaining with that (not that you are).
Dont rush into moving your top mounted intercooler to the front, In the next 2 months i'll be developing a front mount kit for your car. It'll be 600x300x76 & bar & plate. Will be virtually bolt on including all brackets, pipes, hoses and clamps, as well as affordable.
The Aussie system isnt cheap but it has been very well developed, they have done lots of designs & put alot of R&D into it. So its the best you'll get. Its only draw back is that its not stainless but i'm sure Russell would do one in stainless if requested.
Celica,
I'd be interested in that clutch if its at the right price. Some details if you can please, brand, specs etc.
I take it you located in Vic?
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 05:13
|
|
* ears perk up at bolt in intercooler kits !! *
about time this happened
Re exhaust - nods to the system - it will be going in after october at this stage , when shannons gives me the big tick of approval re cheaper modified insurance! WooT! The dump pipe will be the only thing im getting off Aussie exhausts , as the exhaust guy here doesnt have the means to laser cut flanges
I dont mind volunteering my st185 for the test mule for the intercooler BTW  Is this part of garys big busness plans ?
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 05:15
|
|
$1600 for a full stainless system is a good price especially if the job is done right. I just dont understand the reasoning behind the use of stainless steel over mild steel. Some people say it flows better but I dont think that justifies the price. Of course it will me more durable but its not as if your intending on keeping the car for 10-15 years.
Ive heard nothing but good things about the Aussie system but it does seem a bit overpriced. That's probably why most of the GT4 systems head to the states from what it seems on alltrac.net.
GEE120, how much to do you think you will sell the cooler for? There's a guy in Sydney that sells complete systems including piping for around $1100 so you may have some competition.
I'll try to get you the details on the clutch. He had it on a 205 motor using a ST185RC gearbox so im sure it will be the same for the 205 gearbox (correct me if im wrong). He complained that he wanted a clutch that would slip a bit for launches instead of gripping the way it did. If i could get the clutch for around $800-1000 would you be interested if its what your looking for?
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 05:48
|
|
Stu,
Thanks for the offer, but i've allready got a test car.
I'm using a car that is totaly stock other than exhaust and no extra boost. Yeah it does kind of fit into the plans i've got.
Celica, $1100 is pretty cheap but does it have all brackets hoses and clamps with that? Also what kind of cores is he using and is the piping stainless?
I think i may know who your talking about, Is his name Shai.
$600-$800 for the clutch sounds ok but may be willing to pay a little more depending on brand and other details.
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 06:12
|
|
Yes, im talking about Shai... I'm not sure about the particulars of his system... all I remember is him pissing off a lot of people on the GT4 yahoo group. I emailed him a little while ago and he still makes the kit.
I'll ask about the clutch for you... I remember him saying that its a triple plate clutch or something like that but it was a while ago so I cant remember now.
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 06:41
|
|
Celica,
Not that i want to bad mouth anyone. But the guy who's car i am using to develope the kit was trying to buy a kit from Shai for many months with no return mails and empty promises. If you ask me shai seems like a bit of a dodgy bloke. And i think he was also using cut down truck cores (second hand).
Mind you the perfomance of his kit that he stated was quite impressive. An intercooler that cools compressed air to cooler temps than ambient air (not possible without refrigeration)  Thats so laughable its not funny.
I wouldnt really call that competition. No offence intended, i'm not trying to have a go at you Celica just merely stating what i know.
Theres much more i know but i wont get into that right now.
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 06:42
|
|
Hmm, tripple plate  That sounds interesting, cant wait to get details off you
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 08:12
|
|
I followed the discussion on the GT4 list and it was pretty funny after he claimed those impossible intake temps. He did seem pretty dodgy but who knows.
Anyways, im looking forward to seeing your kit. Have u decided on a price yet?
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 08:38
|
|
He also claimed that its a 10 sec car using a CT26 @30 PSI.
Mind you he hasnt had the car on a Dyno to see what power it makes nor has he taken it to a drags to get a time slip.
In all honesty its hard to say without doing it all first and seeing what its all gonna cost me to do. I'm aiming at $1600-$1700 but hoping to do it cheaper.
But like i said, it will be with brand new Bar & Plate cores, all piping, brackets, hoses & clamps. So you wont need to buy anything extra, just put it all together and viola.
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 09:35
|
|
|
The million dollar question is: will it fit behind the stock bumper or do u need a GRP A one?
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 10:11
|
|
Yeah i know, this is why i'm going to spend a few weeks developing this kit to make it really good quality.
I was going to speak to both Tim & Josh as they both get parts from over here. But even at $1600 i think they'd jump on it.
Keep in mind at the moment i'm trying to base it on the max it would likely be, where in reality it may end up around $1300-$1400. Thats where i would like the price to be but i got to wait to see how it pans out.
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 11:09
|
|
|
Good luck with it all
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 11:12
|
|
|
Thanks mate
|
|
|
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sat, 07 June 2003 13:54
|
|
Hi Gary, as you know I was in the process of sorting out a new clutch for the car and did end up going with the same set up that was last in the car. This clutch combination has lasted me for 2 years of hard launch abuse and when I pulled it out still had decent meat on the pads but the springs had gotton loose and the plate had 3mm of warpage, not bad considering and still was useable. I can get the exedy single plate extreme clutch kit for around $700 because of the amount of clutches I have gone through the guy must feel sorry for me...... my 4th clutch in 7 years.
NOTE this is a 3 puck sprung center clutch that has been tested at 9600 load clamp. Has been used for city driving before but not the most enjoyable especially in traffic. I have used a twin plate previously and they are great.The one used was my second clutch and had a greater clamp load (9800) with a much more enjoyable peddle feel and came with a lightened flywheel and an ultra light wallet. This unit failed me after 18mths when the pressure plate calapsed after a 6k launch at the nats.
Anhar Khamas
GT4 Group A
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 05:00
|
|
|
Thanks for the info Anhar, i didnt doubt that the button wouldnt last quite a while but the pedal feel from a twin plate is much nicer its almost like stock which is what i'm after but with a crap load of clamp pressure.
|
|
|
Location:
Perth
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 05:20
|
|
Back to 1/4 mile times yeah stock gt4 does around 15.1 or so.
I have a close friend who has a ST185 GT4 who has forged internals, highflowed turbo with t4 wheel and still stock top mount cooler.. It ran a 13.6 or something. Then he bought and installed the ST205 carlos sainz diff (maybe gearbox as well?) and due to the ratios it reduced the time to 12.9..
Now i have no chance of beating him with my turbo ae86 hehe 
Thats very quick in my books especially with the weight of the GT4 and stock interwarmer..
Just something to look forward to
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 05:45
|
|
thats not bad from a Gt4 !
the carlos sainz 185 gearbox has shorter ratio gears so it accellerates alot harder than say mine ( the slowest model of the lot )
the mods there are pretty simple though i guess hes worked on exhaust / dump pipe setup as well ?
id be lucky i think to squeeze a 14 out of my Gt4 with the exhaust system im planning - needs more boost ! and a trip to jenny craig
BTW : removing the felt inulation stuff under the bonnet - will that reduce the heat side of things under there as theres no insulation - or is it a waste of time ?
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 06:15
|
|
so.. can someone explain to me the difference between say a twin plate clutch and a 6 button clutch?
'cause a 6-button would set you back less than $1600... is the twin plate a smoother start? more grip?
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 06:28
|
|
Stu,
The isulatio does pretty much sweet FA, i got rid of mine you wont notice any real difference if you get rid of it but you'll get better air flow under the bonnet.
Draven,
A button clutch is a cheap alternative to a twin plate, whether it be 3, 4 or 6 puck they hold close to the same amount of torque/power but the twin holds a little more.
Buttons tend to shudder a little when taking off slowly and the whole car vibrates (Not the case wirh all button clutches) But they are a leg work out and a half in most cases.
A twin doesnt need as much pedal travel to get the same and more clamping pressure and its very easy to push in & out as it feels almost like stock.
Both clutches are either on or off. They are very hard to slip.
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 06:34
|
|
aahhh, thought so.
I've got a heavy duty clutch at the moment, and I quite like the hard effort to put the clutch in... whenever I drive a car with a light clutch now I almost put my foot thru the firewall, and it feels flimsy... not much feel.
was just checking out my options, because before too long I'm going to need another one (along with a *long* list of mods)
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 08:58
|
|
|
Dont get me wrong, i hate the feel of realy light clutches but a button is too heavy in traffic. A twin feels more like a heavy duty which is a little heavier that stock.
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 09:22
|
|
well, fortunately my job allows me to avoid peak hour traffic, so it's not so much of an issue for me.
of course ideally I'd love a twin plate... but in all honesty the extra $$$ is a bit too much for me
|
|
|
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
October 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Sun, 08 June 2003 18:43
|
|
Hey yeah, I've been wondering about that under bonnet insulation stuff too. Not sure what the purpose of it is - maybe keeps the heat from cracking the paint? Surely the engine can't get that hot? Or perhaps it prevents steam coming off the bonnet in really cold climates (like Japan, or Melbourne... ). I've noticed traces of steam coming from my bonnet vent on cold wet mornings - & that's with insulation!
I'm wondering if taking the insulation off is gonna make the turbo steam like crazy when rain goes through the Grp A vent (not a problem with the standard St185 scoop). A mate pointed out (just his theory) that getting rain on a hot turbo could perhaps cause it to crack?
Yep, 15.2secs is the official ST185 time. (when I say official, I mean quoted from www.alltrac.com). 13.8secs for an ST205 Group A. Anyone know the official time for a ST185 Group A?
I definitely agree - launching the GT4 certainly ain't easy!
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Mon, 09 June 2003 02:43
|
|
|
Ive taken my underhood insulation off and you can actually see how much hot air is coming out of the vent. Once it was really rainy and steam did come out as the water hit the turbo and heatsheild. It is there to protect the paint from heat and the turbo from water.
|
|
|
Toymods Board Member
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Mon, 09 June 2003 03:10
|
|
take off the insulation
it serves no decent purpose and removing it has no side effects
|
|
|
Location:
Perth
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Mon, 09 June 2003 13:31
|
|
Hey
Yeh i forgot, the exhaust has been done too.. 3" dump pipe from memory and 3" mandrel the rest. He has put a small fan on the intercooler and it seems to have minimised the heatsoak a little especially in summer traffic.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Wed, 11 June 2003 04:53
|
|
Gary:
Your intercooler idea - will it work around the aircon + battery or would those need to go ?
I want to keep the aircon in my GT4 - and i see this as an obstical for frontmounts
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Wed, 11 June 2003 05:18
|
|
I am going to be designing it so that very minimal changes will need to be made.
Worst case scenario you will need to chop a little into the bumper support bar (hoping to avoid that though)
No battery or aircon changes will need to be made though.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Wed, 11 June 2003 08:07
|
|
Will you throw in a nice plumb back BOV too gary ?
Minimal changes are good (tm)
i want my BBrrr air on the inside too aircon stays !
I should have a bit more space with the slimmer Grp A bar for mounting too - which is sweet
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Thu, 12 June 2003 01:36
|
|
Doing a BOV on it as standard will not suit everyone as people have different tastes in what they wnat from a BOV.
Aircon wont have to be touched.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Thu, 12 June 2003 09:29
|
|
Since most of the GT4 crew have posted here - i just thought id pose another question re stereos and speakers in doors ?
what have you guys done to alleviate another stupid move by toyota by not putting factory 6 inch mounting points in the doors ??
Suggestions , pictures etc ?
So far im looking at 300 bucks a Side for custom Fiberglass pods that cover the whole base of the door .. Not ideally what i wanted to DO but the only option if i want 6 or 6.5 inch splits up front
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Thu, 12 June 2003 11:51
|
|
|
dont look at me for this one, my stereo barely works
|
|
|
Toymods Board Member
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Fri, 13 June 2003 01:57
|
|
| Classique71 wrote on Thu, 12 June 2003 19:29 |
what have you guys done to alleviate another stupid move by toyota by not putting factory 6 inch mounting points in the doors ??
|
hmmm... i threw that into the too hard basket and just put speakers in the dash and parcel shelf
|
|
|
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Fri, 13 June 2003 03:18
|
|
|
Just get some good 4inch splits... they will do the job
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Fri, 13 June 2003 08:36
|
|
It has good 4 2 ways up front atm .. Had the Amp tweaked with yesterday and results are 100% better on what they were - i can now PLAY the cd player pretty lod ( like i used to ) with minimal distortion ..
Stereo guy also suggested slotting a set of 8 inch subs off the amp i have and running the fronts and rears off a new deck - seeing my current one is 2 channel RCA out .. he said 4 channel is a much better setup ( obviously ) and will sound a lot better
Though for now the stereo is livable - a little tweak to the bass and the back ones livened up ..
|
|
|
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Fri, 13 June 2003 08:45
|
|
|
Speaking of 1/4 miles What should we expect from a stockish 162? So I know what I have to 'improve' on?
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 1/4 mile time for stock Gt4
|
Fri, 13 June 2003 08:52
|
|
My Guess would be in the low/mid 16's Gt4's really are a turd to get off the mark - but as soon as they are rolling - WHEE !
a 162 would be easier i guess to get off the line - providing you didnt spin the fronts silly
|
|
|
