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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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 Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Fri, 02 August 2002 04:22
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Taken from here:
http://fuelwatch.com.au/news_articles/news0802/toy ota_hydro.asp
Toyota Starts Marketing Of Hydrogen Cars
By Damien Reid
The development of Toyota's hydrogen technology has moved beyond the laboratory and out onto the streets with the Japanese manufacturer leasing 20 road-registered Kluger four-wheel drives to interested technology related companies, institutional organisations and research facilities.
Such has been the success of its hydrogen fuel cell hybrid technology in Japan and the United States, that Toyota has fast-tracked its development program and expects to have the vehicles on the road before the end of the year.
The water-sipping Kluger will be a newly developed prototype based on the company's first FCHV-4 concept but will include conventional vehicle-like performance as well as improved reliability, cruising distance and overall functionality.
Although the vehicles will look like your conventional Toyota four-wheel drive, they are still prototypes and will be tested for costs, cold temperature performance and other issues which is why Toyota is leasing them only to select areas of the private sector.
Its plans are to lease 20 units in the first year to entities which have access to hydrogen-supply infrastructure and after-sales service.
Like the Prius which is on sale here, the concept revolves around an electric motor supplying power to assist a "conventional" engine which in this case is a hydrogen unit instead of the petrol motor used in the Prius.
Toyota began testing the FCHV-4 on public roads in Japan in June 2001 and the United States a month later covering more than 110,000 kilometres on public roads as well as on the company's proving grounds and test tracks, providing valuable insight toward the commercialisation of the technology.
Toyota claims society's acceptance of the new technology as well as its "expectations for cleaner mobility solutions" is the main reason behind the early introduction of the cars to market.
Expected to heighten consumer acceptance of hydrogen as a fuel in Japan and North America, Toyota's marketing of the FCHV technology will be a strong force for the establishment of standards and infrastructure required for the full-scale commercialisation of fuel cell-powered vehicles.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Fri, 02 August 2002 05:46
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I've done a whole lot more research on BMW's approach to the fuel problem, by burning liquid hydrogen in a conventional engine, this way we don't effectively throw away over 100 years of research! Plus they still make noises like a regular car! Only this time you only have to worry about water being the only product!
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Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Fri, 02 August 2002 10:36
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heh - be great as an antoi tailgater deevice - just plant the boot - and the tailgater gets coverted in water 
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 06 August 2002 12:41
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wow could i put a turbo on that???? 
it is really good to see though gave me a warm fuzzy feeling reading it
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 06 August 2002 12:45
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I ended up doing a whole essay on it last year for uni...they even have a few hydrogen filling stations around Germany and you can buy a BMW 750Hi (think thats it) from the showroom floor.
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Location:
A.C.T
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 06 August 2002 23:10
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Awesome idea, i can't wait till Toyota release them over here in Australia. There's just one thing.... I WON'T BUY ONE CAUSE YOU PROBABLY CAN'T SHOVE A TURBO ON THEM!!!!! 
ANDRE
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Location:
Brisbane - Chapel Hill
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Wed, 07 August 2002 00:24
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Rotaries lend themselves well to hydrogen too, and mazda researched this years ago ... hope it comes to fruition .. and yep, i'd bet you could turbo it.
either that, or the next best thing: put a hydrogen gas turbine engine in your car
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Location:
A.C.T
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Wed, 07 August 2002 01:43
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Yep i've read that about the rotors as well. Apparently the rotating combustion chamber aids in the successful burning of the hydrogen. Conventional piston engines aren't as good because they have some issues relating to the hydrogen hitting the hot valves on the way into the combustion chamber and exploding prematurely. Or something along those lines. Anyway, i just assumed that you wouldn't be able to turbo them cause there would not be sufficient exhuast emmisions, but hey, someone please prove me wrong!
André
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Location:
Sutherland, Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Wed, 07 August 2002 12:13
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My uncle has been running a 5hp Briggs and Stratton pump on Hydrogen for years. His conversion chamber is only about 3 litres capacity and produces plenty of hydrogen to run the engine for donkeys ages.
For those who are curious, he adds a solution (salty I think) to the water and runs an electric current through the water via a couple of electrodes (I'm sure everyone did this at school) and hey presto, hydrogen bubbles!
He then runs the hydrogen down a tube (under its own pressure created from the sealed water cylinder) into a crude gas carby.
The result is a mad sounding pump (pop,pop,pop:)
I could only then assume that by having a larger tank of water (say normal fuel tank capacity) you could run a standard engine with an LPG setup for a thousand kilometers before dumping the water and replacing it with freshly solutioned water. You would of course need to start the engine on other fuel so it would get the current going and therefore start the bubbles a flowin!
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Location:
Brisbane - Chapel Hill
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Thu, 08 August 2002 07:30
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good form.
however, wehn it comes to hydrogen or electric cars, if the electricity comes from the powerpoint ... then we are simply shifting the pollution problem somewhere else ... and in australia, that means coal power.
Geez i hate the russians ... if it wsnt for cherynobyl, im sure we would all be running clean, efficient, nuclear power stations by now. (and dont give me that hazardous nuclear waste argument crap)
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Thu, 08 August 2002 09:53
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I'm with you. I'd be much happier having to deal with a few barrels of nuclear waste periodically as opposed to the tonnes and tonnes of pollutants released by our conventional power stations for the much smaller amount of energy they produce 
And to the stupid people who want to shut down the Lucas Heights nuclear reactor (not that I think the sensible people here are such people), explain where we are going to get the radio isotopes commonly used in radiation therapy...you know, some of the really important ones that have half-lives measured in days and stuff...
Sorry for the rant 
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Fri, 09 August 2002 01:07
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Yeah, closing down Lucas Hieghts would be a disaster for the local hospitals... Shame the average Australian is too stupid to be able to think that far.
We live in a coutry where the majority of people believed the propaganda lies and voted to stay a monarchy...
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Sun, 11 August 2002 07:53
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There's no reason you couldn't turbocharge an conventional engine running on hydrogen. There's still just as much exhaust emissions as any other type of engine - sure those emissions are just water (well steam actually), but the turbine doesn't care what it is - it will work just the same!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Sun, 11 August 2002 09:54
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Quite frankly, I'm of the opinion that if we get these turbo-hydrogen engines working...who gives a shit how much fuel they use etc. fuel is cheap, in never-ending supply, and nothing is going to hurt the planet!
Who cares if its not as efficient as some of these fuel cell cars? Its gonna be damn more fun! 
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Mon, 12 August 2002 07:16
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Well, that depends where the hydrogen is coming from in the first place! It's not like there's vast pockets of hydrogen floating around, you have to start with some other substance (eg water) and apply some sort of process (eg electrolysis) to get H2. And if the electrolysis process is being run by a coal power station, you're back to square one!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Mon, 12 August 2002 08:46
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Yeah I know. In the case of BMW, they have solar power plants providing the energy for the electrolysis!
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Mon, 12 August 2002 10:18
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there were some dudes over in finland or something that were using the energy from wind or geysers or something to crack the water and create heaps of hydrogen - they were saying it was going to be the next generation's middle east...
theres a thought... sooner or later the pricks will start charging through the nose for it, and the government will just tax it at 400 per cent on top of it...
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 13 August 2002 03:00
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Well having been doing work on nuclear energy in school i can confidently say that people have a reason to be worried. I would rather put up with a large amount of pollution then "not safely disposed of" barrles of nuclear waste. Alot of people think Chernobyl was a disaster and in fact they are partly right. It was devestating and the effects still are but it was because of the stupidity of a select few people who wanted to test the limits of the nuclear core. Nuclear cores have rods that are placed in the nuclear cores to slow down and sometimes stop the reactions from occuring but some idiot decided to see how far they could take the core before putting the rods in to slow it down. By the time the core was at critical temp the said idiot decides to slot the rods in and call it a day only problem is the core got so hot it expanded and the rods could no in fact fit in the holes anymore. BUT as i said i am only just recently studying this so i am about 99% sure its right. If im mistaken sorry and please correct me.
Matt
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 13 August 2002 03:08
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who's determining whats not safely disposed of?
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 13 August 2002 03:17
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Hey,
Well from what i understand there are certain places that are specifically designed for disposal of radioactive waste which includes materials from hospitals. This costs money to dispose of this way so there are businesss out there who would quite happily dump their waste into the ocean or bury it. I think nuclear reactors are probably one of THE best forms of energy available but it is people out there who just wait for one thing to go wrong and make instant judgment without the right information. But im not afraid to say i am in the same boat as those people. I was against nuclear reactors up until i heard what really happened, and how they work. Now i am all for them. Anyways thats just me. Everyone is different.
Matt
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Location:
North Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 13 August 2002 03:56
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for those who can remember there was an article in the courier mail a few weeks back saying that we are more likely to have a ice age than global warming, it really is a bunch of tree hugging hippy crap!!
yeah, three mile island and chernoble were caused by bad plant design and stupid people (i see stupid people, they are everywhere, they walk around like regular people, but there not...)
more people are killed in africa each year by fumes given off by all there coal powerplants than nuclear powerplants ever have.....
on another note, it's amazing how so many people can be persuaded by the voices of the few, ONLY as an example, the boat ppl thing, there was (still maybe) shit on tv every night about it, and how bad it was, even though little johny howard was getting above 70% approval rating for his descisions......
all this environmental crap nearly borders on fanatisism think about some of the tactics, emotinal blackmail, propaganda (yes that is what it is) and extreme protests, hey i like my local KFC, but i'm not gonna chain myself to it when it gets shut down, especially when i know ther is another one down the road....
just my 2c, not trying to hyjack a thread, just a bit of a rant...
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 13 August 2002 04:27
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wow. that is exactly how i feel. Is it just me or does the media control our country and even control the way we think. That is exactly right with the boat people. The media portrayed it as inhumane and i thought even though i disagreed with it that i was only a select few that agreed with john howards approach. Now i find myself in a similar situation with all the stuff that has been in the media about Hoons. WHAT can we do about it. at the end of the day very little because the media simply chooses what makes a story worthwhile if it does come at a great loss to members of the public. Sure you can write a letter of complaint but how easy is it to toss a letter into the bin compared to doing an article on the car scene from our perspective. Plus this may disagree with many people on here but my guess is that most of the people who watch the news are now thinking totally different to the car scene because of one or two articles. All the information the media gave was correct but that information (video clips) was a few dickheads doing dickhead things (referring to FORCED on today tonight). sorry if i offended anyone. Oh also im all for hydrogen cars ( to stay on topic ).
Matt
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Location:
North Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Tue, 13 August 2002 05:00
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unfortunately it isn't a clear cut "the media want ppl to think the worst" no matter what is on tv it is all based on the same thing, entertainment, it's only there because ppl will watch it, simple as that...
with the whole hoon thing, not to abuse stereotypes or anything, but the australian public, on average, is getting older, and i'm sorry to say, more conservative....
by today tonite showing these wanks doing wank things only goes along with these ppls ideas, and they get a warm fuzzy feeling because television is agreeing with them, and will continue to support the station that this crap was on....
a news report that says that a bunch of car enthusists had a great cruise to BWCP, and up mt tamborine, had a bbq, chatted a bit, and then went home, isn't going to draw much attention, but focusing on that fool forced and whatever he does, creates interest, society has to change before the media will, and the media could change society, (anyone read a book called catch 22)
it's funny how today tonite sent their tapes of that fool doing stupid things to the cops and they said they want to "catch up" with him, but i bet if i video taped the fifteen trucks a day that cut me off, or tailgate me a 115km/h, or give me the finger when i look at them through my targa-top (not just trucks, but like today tonite i'm appealing to a sterotype), the po-lice would laugh at me and tell me they have "better" things to do...
c-ya,
p.s. same disclaimer as above
p.p.s. hydrogen cars kick ass....
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Wed, 14 August 2002 01:42
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alright i think ive said all i can think of. I saw one of those hybrid cars on the street i think it was petrol electric. I didnt think they were brought out yet?
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Location:
North Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Wed, 14 August 2002 12:25
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me and my dad went to a honda dealership a while back, and had a look at one, looks nice, if only we could figure out a way to make the batteries smaller/lighter, it would be much better....
but apart from that, there very spiffy cars, pitty they cost more than a wrx, or soarer.....
c-ya,
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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 Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Thu, 15 August 2002 00:33
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The Petrol-Electric Toyota Prius and Honda Insight have been on sale in Australia since the beginning of the year I think...
I've only seen one Prius. They're just too expensive.
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Location:
North Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Toyota Hydrogen Car
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Thu, 15 August 2002 01:14
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i heard that the first guy in sydney to buy one traded in his WRX, apparently he got sic of fuel costs, and speeding tickets...
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