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Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
August 2003
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86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 20 March 2004 03:00
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The T-series axles are quite expensive already, especially once installed. Any other alternatives?
Alot use a Hilux LSD, do they just use the LSD or whole thing as axles etc? And does it have dics (I have no idea....and cant find much detaile dinfo on conversion).
If not any other ideas or anything I could tear out of another vehicle and makes some mod to fit in AE86?
Supra ones??? etc etc
Maybe even different make than Toyota? What about Silvia ones (no idea once again).
Any chance in fitting something with independant rear suspension settup?? Or impossible etc etc.....
Just lookin at the prices and they seem to be rising like UAI entrance scores for incomplete and damaged units....
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Location:
c'town, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
August 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 20 March 2004 07:49
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There is not much info about alternatives... abit bout Hilux diff but doesnt tell you much.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 20 March 2004 08:17
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This topic has been discussed A LOT on this forum. Keep looking.
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Toymods Social Secretary
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 20 March 2004 09:11
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with about 3 different searches i found about 20 or more individual threads ranging from
hilux to corona to MX23 to skyline.....
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Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
August 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 20 March 2004 13:44
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My bad..
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 20 March 2004 15:15
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Personally, I'm a fan of MS110/112 Toyota Crown axles. They come factory fitted with disc brakes and are a F series centre, with 27 spline axles. LSD can be fitted easily, but you will need to cut the unit down, and re stud if you want to stay with a four stud pattern.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
March 2004
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 20 March 2004 22:34
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If you are talking N/A 4ag and you are in Melbourne there is a dood who makes cheap LSD's to fit into any centre.They are a prety simple thing and cost $250 fitted,and a lot of the rally boys use them.My bro in law has one in a 1200 coupe rally car and swears by it.So ,T-18 diff and rear sect. of tail shaft,r/t141 discs and caliper,and a trip down to Tayell automotive in East Bentleigh should net you everything you are after.This is a good,cheap,light setup that should come in under $400.These things are said to be good for about 200 h/p so serious boosted drift/drag,is probly asking a bit much.P/M me you're phone # if you want to more .
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 01:17
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And I intend to try one of these things in the near future 
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I supported Toymods
Banned User
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 01:19
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Interesting. So this place sells a complete made up center or what?
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
November 2002
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 03:42
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sounds too good to be true.. anyone got more info on this?? or tried one of these LSDs?
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
March 2004
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 11:15
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Tayell Automotive .3 Griffith Ave. Bentleigh East VIC
(03)95795529......This thing is not a centre, it is a device thats made up of a couple of plates of steel and 4 springs as far as I could see.I am still yet to drive one ,so I would sudjest calling john at tayell for a full explaination of the thing. He is a top bloke and very happy to talk to folks.I think if you are basicly a hoon on a budjet,this may be gold.If anyone rings him, say Joe put you onto him so I might get a better price if I take that route.Seems mega tight arsed to want a better price , but I am a hoon on a budget.
Joe
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 12:10
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if it's better than a welded diff, I want IN! 
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Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
August 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 13:01
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This may sound stupid, but I dont understand how u can just lock a diff by welding it. well of course it can be done but how does it work? Like aint parts meant to move for a reason? etc etc...
Ah I guess I am gunna get flamed but oh well....
Alot would say why ask about an LS axle then. I was more after the brakes... (with my current experience/knowledge).. I have been having constant problems with bits in the drum setup.
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Location:
Malaysia,Kuala Lumpur
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 14:55
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| Quote: |
Personally, I'm a fan of MS110/112 Toyota Crown axles. They come factory fitted with disc brakes and are a F series centre, with 27 spline axles. LSD can be fitted easily, but you will need to cut the unit down, and re stud if you want to stay with a four stud pattern.
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Is this a solid type housing axle or an Independent type ?
27 spline ?? ..is this a 4.5 ish final drive ratio ??
Cut the unit down ??...what's this ?
cheers
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 21 March 2004 22:33
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He means taht stock the axle is too wide and as such needs to be "cut down" in width for it to fit into a sprinter. The spline on the axles has little effect on the final drive gearing from what i know but rather just how many splines the axle/diff interface has.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 04:08
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I called this John guy (who is very helpful).. What it is, is a device made up of a few spacers and 4 high tension springs, which is fitted into the diff center. What it does it evenly distribute the power to both wheels ALL the time. It is not a lock diff, and still has some give for turning etc etc. He said their original design was rated to around 160HP from the flywheel.. Although they are using higher tensile components now, so he said it should be able to cope with a bit more (maybe another 20hp).. They have had GREAT success with it. He is using it in his rally car at the moment. But also on track, moto khana, street etc etc. Generally for street use, you should get a few years use before the springs start to wear out.. but this does depend on how you drive it.. I think this could be a perfect option..
Ok now to the prices . He said if you give him just the center, it will cost you $250.. If you give him the center and housing he will have to disassemble it so it will be about another $50..
Once the springs start to wear out, it costs around $150 to recondition it.
When either the springs wear out, or you push too much power to it, it will just revert back to being an open diff (ie only one wheel will spin)..
I think what we should do is perhaps get in contact with John again and see if we can get enough people interested, if he will do a good price for people that mention Toymods (he said he had 3 calls about it already)..
Cheers
Gaz
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 04:10
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oh and it will take him around 10 days to complete it..
Gaz
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 05:07
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this is the invention ive been waiting for!!! will it be super sketch in the wet like a welded diff but? (thats the only reason why mine isn't welded, ever hit a pothole full of water in the rain with one??you may understand!)
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 05:24
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If you floor it in the wet then yes, it will be slippery. it doesn't work like a welded diff. if you drive normally it will be just like a normal open diff.
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 06:04
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Hmm, this "LSD" from John sounds interesting - if it works as well as it's meant to, I WANT!  Only problems are: I'm in Brisbane, and I don't have a diff to use yet. Maybe I can get someone in Melbourne to buy a center for me and have it modded and then sent up to Brisbane
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Location:
NSW, East Coast
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 06:27
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I new someone would invent/create something like this one day.
How do i contact this person, PERHAPS A "GROUP BUY", if someone in Melbourne is willing to do the organising and shipping.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 06:32
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Ok seems we have a lil bit of interest. I'll call John tomorrow and see what he can do for us all. As for freighting interstate, i'm not sure how much it would cost.. Considering the weight, i think it might cost a bit.. No idea what company to use either. I'll post back here when i get some prices
Cheers
Gaz
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 06:57
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Thanks Gaz
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
August 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 08:26
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I assume he can he also do this for S series?
I am in adelaide and this sounds good. More details needed!
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
March 2004
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 09:36
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Last time I talked to John he said he had only seen 2 centres that he could not physicaly fit this thing into (one was a volxy golf from memory), so nearly any centre will accomidate one.I am going to try my bro in laws one this week and tell what i think.May be a bit hard to tell as this car is not much of a grunta.
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Forum Moderator
Location:
Toymods
Registered:
February 2004
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 11:49
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If you need an S series diff to test it on you can have mine. Only partially rooted.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 15:22
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| mrsoopra wrote on Mon, 22 March 2004 14:32 |
Ok seems we have a lil bit of interest. I'll call John tomorrow and see what he can do for us all. As for freighting interstate, i'm not sure how much it would cost.. Considering the weight, i think it might cost a bit.. No idea what company to use either. I'll post back here when i get some prices
Cheers
Gaz
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You can post a complete diff centre around Australia for $50, it comes under their 20Kg limit (a S series centre is 17-18Kgs from memory). Having said that, I'll let everyone know I have a complete S series open centre and T series BOC locker centre for sale, for $50 each, and yes, I'll post directly to the modifier to save you postage costs again if you're interstate.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Mon, 22 March 2004 23:11
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Thanks CLG.. There is your answer Demuire.. around $50 for postage.
Gaz
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
September 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Tue, 23 March 2004 05:14
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AusPost is a surprisingly good option for sending parts. I got a set of 15x7 mags (with 205/55 tyres mounted) sent from Melbourne to Brisbane for ~$22/each!
There's a postage calculator on the AusPost website at http://www1.auspost.com.au/pac/aus_parcel.asp. Putting in Fook's postcode as 4059 and 3165 for East Bentleigh, 19-20kg for parcel, and unspecified size; regular parcel $23.40; express post $86.30 . So, less than $50 for return freight - cheap!
Hope this helps,
Dominic
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Tue, 23 March 2004 05:27
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cheers for that link Gecko.. That'll come in handy around here i think
Gaz
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Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Tue, 23 March 2004 07:12
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Sounds like the "Phantom Grip" thingy. Is that what it is? Is this guy in Melbourne the Aus distributor or something? Can you guys let me know if it works. I may be interested.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Tue, 23 March 2004 08:06
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he is a mechanic/engineer..
just modifies the diff.. He custom make the components himself..
rock on.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
August 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Tue, 23 March 2004 08:12
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if this ends up being able to be done on an S series, I would be willing to pay someone in melb to get an S series done and shipped to me. I'll make it worth your time and centre!
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
March 2004
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Wed, 24 March 2004 01:39
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Looks like the same idea..
Yes its easy done to S series diff..
Gaz
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Club Member
Location:
sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Wed, 24 March 2004 07:16
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Mrsoopra / Gaz,
Is he interested in a reduced price for a large / batch order ?
Thanks,
Mitch.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Wed, 24 March 2004 11:50
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demuire - if its cheaper maybe us brisbane guys can send down a few together?
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Wed, 24 March 2004 12:29
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Mark: Yep would definately be in for a group send I have to find a diff first... 
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I supported Toymods
Banned User
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Wed, 24 March 2004 12:32
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I could be interested aswell. I might even be able to arrange some cheap shipping for us Bris people
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
August 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Fri, 26 March 2004 05:45
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Interested here, also local.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Fri, 26 March 2004 07:20
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Kinda interested too. hard to say unless i drive it before.
But shouldn't this kinda be discussed on the parts for sale now?
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Fri, 26 March 2004 10:30
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Ack, didn't get to drive it last night  Hopefully will soon though, I'll letcha know what I reckon
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 27 March 2004 13:29
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any news on this?
and for us interstate guys, can he just send up the parts and we fit it ourselves? Should be a lot cheaper with less labour and shipping fees..
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 27 March 2004 17:33
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What started out as a "don't waste our time, do a search" thread has become a wildfire
Pretty interesting hey
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 27 March 2004 22:44
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that looks like a really nasty bit of gear to me, I would (not) like to see the ammount of metal that comes out with the diff oil after time
Allan
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 27 March 2004 23:18
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It sure does LOOK pretty frightening... But I'm not going to knock it till I've tried it 
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Location:
c'town, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 27 March 2004 23:24
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these do look dodgey, make sure you understand how they work before you consider to buy.
also looks like u will have to drop the oil about 4 times more often than usual.
in other words talk to these rally guys that swear by them, ask them what they do to look after their diff, how many times they change the centre and/or oil.
otherwise for a cheaply replacable, very available T series with low powered car shouldnt be 'too' bad.
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 28 March 2004 02:05
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my only concern is that from the looks of it, (the phantom grip one), it is fully preloaded, and it only locks when the chunk of metal jams between the spider gears when it gets twisted.
this compared to a normal LSD which does not have as much preload, and the "LSD load" increases as acceleration increases...
just seems a bit worrisome that even at slow speeds, and parking, the preload is already there... particularly for in the wet... and i guess that depends on how much actual pre-load action there is?? just seems ass-about 
would love to see it tho...
CYa, Stewart
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 28 March 2004 04:26
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so it would step out a bit more than an lsd but not as much as a locker, wear quicker, muck up your diff oil quicker - but it doesnt make your axles chirp around roundabouts while the feds are behind you, and it only costs AU$250 plus postage? i would definately be in for that, just use lucas oil stabiliser, and learn to control the extra power over. i'm saving for one of these as of right now! awesome find
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 28 March 2004 05:28
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well, it means that you have the full 'locking effect' (or should i say friction effect) when driving straight, then you break that friction when enter a corner or one wheel loses traction, and after that the friction decreases (movign friction<static friction), so it's like a poorly locked locker, and it's LSD properties decrease with increasign wheel speed differential..
oh and it wedges itself between the spider gears suddenly to lock the spider gears!!!
i can't wait to hear how it drives in a street car (as opposed to race car)
Cya, Stewart
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 28 March 2004 05:54
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U guys are putting me off the whole concept. I jsut thought about the cheapness of it. Anyway I guess i wouldn't opt for it so much. I might as well lock up the diff instead. Less maintainance and crapping around. I don't like the thought of jamming things between gears.
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sun, 28 March 2004 08:50
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Looking at it, it does seem a little flawed... But I won't rag it just yet. I'll be interested to pull it out of the car, have a look at it, look at the oil, etc. as well as driving it, see if it really does work backwards, as it would appear...
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Location:
NSW, East Coast
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Thu, 01 April 2004 13:08
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Any progress on this subject.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Thu, 01 April 2004 13:34
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I think we are all too chicken to try it  ..
But in all seriousness, if I get my hands on an S series diff center, and have a lazy 250.. I would
rock on.
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 03 April 2004 07:53
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Hey guys, still havent managed to collar the guy with the rally car and driveit / look at it yet, but I HAVEN'T forgotten!
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Location:
timaru NZ
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 86: Alternatives to T-series rear-end for LSD & discs?
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Sat, 03 April 2004 11:02
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when you guys say he only need the diff centre , are you refferring to the crown wheel/spider-gear carrier or the whole diff head. why i ask is sending a whole diff head to Australia would be rather expensive.
if he is doing a few T series units, could someone inquire as to whether he can supply it in kit form.
i am very interested.
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