| Author | Topic |
|---|
Location:
Canberra ACT
Registered:
November 2002
|
|
ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Thu, 25 March 2004 05:33
|
 |
Hi Guys,
I am looking at buying an ST185 GT4 as a 'project' car.
I've heard a lot of references to the GT4 being an expensive car to own/maintain. Was just wondering what this means. Can any current owners comment on whether this is because:
(a) Minor services are expensive;
(b) Parts have a tendency to break;
(c) Parts that will require replacements are difficult/expensive to get;
(d) Insurance is astronomical (which I already know!); or
(e) The standard car requires lots of enhancements to make it enjoyable.
The GT4 would make a great performance car, but I want to make sure it doesn't end up being a money pit.
Any advice or info is greatly appreciated.
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Thu, 25 March 2004 06:41
|
|
its not too bad if you can do all the work yourself. If you have to pay someone to do to work, its very expensive. Parts are expensive, but not horrendous.
Timing belt is almost impossible to do without dropping the engine, as is clutch etc.
Even getting to the spark plugs is a mission as you have to remove the intercooler etc.
I'd say (A),(C) and (E) are true. (E) because in standard form the car isn't fast really. A lot of weight. But its easy to get lots more power.
(B) The cars are generally reliable and well made. They don't have the brittle reputation of like the WRX gearbox etc.
(D) Insurance isn't too bad. My car is $800 full comp. Mods are boost controller, wheels, suspension, gauges, steering wheel etc... typical stuff. Thats with Justcar.
|
|
|
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
September 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Thu, 25 March 2004 08:24
|
|
| spectral wrote on Thu, 25 March 2004 17:41 |
My car is $800 full comp. Mods are boost controller, wheels, suspension, gauges, steering wheel etc... typical stuff. Thats with Justcar.
|
 Us Sydney People can only dream about a price like that.
|
|
|
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Thu, 25 March 2004 10:56
|
|
|
Any 10+ year old turbo performance car you will cost you.
|
|
|
Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Fri, 26 March 2004 00:09
|
|
smt_007
im with u on that call i pay almost that on my mr2
|
|
|
Location:
Ballarat, Vic.
Registered:
September 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Fri, 26 March 2004 04:17
|
|
Im getting screwed over on the insurance thing. My daily's been insured with my as the main driver (under mums name) since i was 16 but aparently i still don't have a rating (even though theres never been a claim so i cna't have had an accident!!). So the mr2's insured 3rd party F&T. Funnily enough the company that the dailys under and the mr2 are basicly the same company!!. so its like 700ish for 3rd!!! 
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Fri, 26 March 2004 04:41
|
|
I guess this comes down to do you want to have a stock one - or a modified one ?
Drivetrain wise the gt4 is pretty much unbreakable .. bar for a sheared CV on mine ( metal fatigue + mechanic overtightening castle nut ) - and recently a blown head gasket ( 14 psi all its life for 210 thousand KM on a stock HG will do this )- mine has been extrememly reliable. The diffs and gearboxes are renouned for being virtually unbreakable , and the 3sgte is also touted as probably the strongest 4 cylinder motor ever built
Insurance wise - i pay 1800 a year currently - but mines a little more modofied than Spectral's , and im with shannons + just turned 25
Anything major motorwise ( cam belts , head gaskets, clutch ) will require the motor being dropped ut - as its an absolute prick to try and work in the engine bay - not alot of room for your hands , and the engines slant doesnt help much .
re modifications , with a decent suspension kit ( ie whiteline works kit ) and a boost controller + a decent exhust setup - the Gt4 transforms 100% over its sluggish stock self. Still heavy compared to others on the same field ( ie evo and WRX ) but theres only 100 or so KG difference and i can vouch for a mildly modified GT4 being able to hold its own against said WRX's and evo's.
If you want probably the most complete package toyotas ever made outside of the supra , GT4 is the go .. For the price there is nothing in the market that comes with the same amount of performance options + strength, you just have to live with a prick of an engine bay to work with
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
July 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Fri, 26 March 2004 13:18
|
|
sorry to break topic.. but ur gt4 is nice as.. its a pity you got lost or whatever at start of cruise
| spectral wrote on Thu, 25 March 2004 17:41 |
its not too bad if you can do all the work yourself. If you have to pay someone to do to work, its very expensive. Parts are expensive, but not horrendous.
Timing belt is almost impossible to do without dropping the engine, as is clutch etc.
Even getting to the spark plugs is a mission as you have to remove the intercooler etc.
I'd say (A),(C) and (E) are true. (E) because in standard form the car isn't fast really. A lot of weight. But its easy to get lots more power.
(B) The cars are generally reliable and well made. They don't have the brittle reputation of like the WRX gearbox etc.
(D) Insurance isn't too bad. My car is $800 full comp. Mods are boost controller, wheels, suspension, gauges, steering wheel etc... typical stuff. Thats with Justcar.
|
|
|
|
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Fri, 26 March 2004 14:43
|
|
| Classique71 wrote on Fri, 26 March 2004 15:41 |
If you want probably the most complete package toyotas ever made outside of the supra , GT4 is the go .. For the price there is nothing in the market that comes with the same amount of performance options
|
Dont forget the MR2 GT......its well supported by aftermarket manufactures and has the best power to wieght ratio out of the above. Mid Ship making it the perfect weapon.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Sat, 27 March 2004 01:12
|
|
current market sees the mr2 turbo double the price of a GT4 or say a Ma71 - thats what i meant - for $$'s theyre isnt much better in the 10 - 15K pricerange!
I completely agree re Mr2 though - serious weapons ..
|
|
|
Location:
Sutherland, Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Sat, 27 March 2004 13:22
|
|
GT4's are damn well built and every bit of extra weight is only strength, handling and comfort...did I mention style??
The GT-FOUR is a credit to Toyota and the whole Celica genre. I'm proud to own a car that, even though its 13 years old, still has looks and you don't have to be an owner/lover to see them!
Toyota didn't build a little plastic buzz box with a lifespan (WRX??) they built a solid hunk of love that will give you as much love and joy as you give it. You'll never fully appreciate one until you own one and drive it properly...which brings me to my point....GT4's are bloody bullet proof and when they are driven for what they were designed for will last ages and cost minimal amounts. Drive it like a dickhead and it will start costing you $$$$$$$$$ I usually fit category B.
The drivetrain is bullet proof to 500horsies but drop the clutch every day to work and laugh at V8's and you'll feel the clunks set in. Treat it with respect or pay.
Seriously, drive it hard and fast for hours on end...no probs...no $$$ The key here is smooth driving, not necessarily slow, just smooth.
Traffic light drags every day...$$$$ selling a lemon in 2-3 years.
READ THIS! If you don't have access to a workshop or garage and are not prepared to do the work yourself then either be rich, drive SMOOTHLY or don't buy one!
Just changing the oil filter is a bitch..let alone the turbo/gearbox or even the air conditioning compressor!!
If you don't swear now then you'll soon learn. After time, working on the 4 is actually fun in some sick shit way.
Maybe I'm just in love ;)
|
|
|
Location:
Canberra ACT
Registered:
November 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Sun, 28 March 2004 06:24
|
|
Thanks for the advice guys.
I am very keen on a GT4, but there are two things that worry me:
(1) The running/maintenance costs. I can't do much of the work myself, but I do take very good care of my cars. I'm not a compulsive traffic light hero either. I guess as long as I buy a car in good condition, I should not be up for too many major expenses.
(2) Whether I would fit! May sound funny, but I had all sorts of problems with my ZZT231 Celica. I had to have the seat lowered to fit into it, even then there was not enough headroom. I'm not sure how the ST185 compares for size?
On the insurance side, NRMA charged me around $1,500 per year for full comprehensive on my ZZT231. AAMI (who is usually significantly cheaper) quoted me $1,620 for a ST185 GT4 (that is about 1/3 the insured value!). Crooks!
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Sun, 28 March 2004 11:31
|
|
I'm 6'2" and I fit no problems... there is a lot of room for a car of its type.
If you fit a wheel smaller than the truck sized standard wheel, you can heel-toe a lot better. I used a 330mm Momo Top Power and its perfect.
I found with my long legs, my thighs/knees were hitting the bottom of the standard wheel when I twisted my leg to hit the accelerator with my heel.
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Sun, 28 March 2004 11:31
|
|
| Jag7799 wrote on Fri, 26 March 2004 23:18 |
sorry to break topic.. but ur gt4 is nice as.. its a pity you got lost or whatever at start of cruise
|
What cruise?
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
July 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Sun, 28 March 2004 13:47
|
|
| spectral wrote on Sun, 28 March 2004 21:31 |
| Jag7799 wrote on Fri, 26 March 2004 23:18 |
sorry to break topic.. but ur gt4 is nice as.. its a pity you got lost or whatever at start of cruise
|
What cruise?
|
that wasnt you at the last toymods brissy cruise from mt cootha?
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
August 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Mon, 29 March 2004 04:33
|
|
No, that would have been me.  I get lost easy.
GT4's do cost money to keep and run. My petrol bill has certainly gone up over my ST184. Any work done will cost extra and you have to find someone that has half a clue. You know about insurance. But if you can afford it and can find a good one then you will love every minute with it, even if you are just standing there looking at it or soaping it up.
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Mon, 29 March 2004 06:58
|
|
my favorite benifit of gt4 ownership is the looks of envy/awe it gets from WRX owners , and SS commodore owners now and then ..
i guess its a litte envy on WRX's part seeing our AWD sportscars dont look like tarted up 4 door econoboxes 
|
|
|
I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Mon, 29 March 2004 07:30
|
|
I don't entirely agree that GT-Fours are expensive to maintain... Apart from a regular supply/change of oil & go juice and a couple of $15 rubber boots (steering rack and CV's) I haven't had to really repair anything...
Yes fuel consumption can be bad at times, however, any turbo will be bad (my KE20 sucks down 25ltrs in 150kms if I drive hard).
My insurance is only $1400 with Justcar and I'm under 25 and the cars insured for 18K.
A tool worth about $20 will fix any problems with getting to the oil filter and if you can't work out how to change the spark plugs then you should go buy a Hyundai or something with 5 year warranty & service plan.
Parts can be difficult to get... but thats much the same for any 10+ year old import or locally delivered car that wasn't sold in super high volumes...
The GT-Four doesn't really need any mods to be enjoyable... mine is stock apart from the mags and it still goes reasonably hard...
The main point of the car as far as I'm concerned is that its fairly rare to see these days (esp the Group A) and you get a LOT of looks!
|
|
|
Location:
Canberra ACT
Registered:
November 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Mon, 29 March 2004 10:11
|
|
| Quote: |
I'm 6'2" and I fit no problems... there is a lot of room for a car of its type.
|
I'm only 6'4" but I had ALL sorts of trouble with my ZZT231. If the GT4 is as bad in the headroom I won't be buying one!
| Quote: |
The main point of the car as far as I'm concerned is that its fairly rare to see these days (esp the Group A) and you get a LOT of looks!
|
I do like the fact that they are a bit unique and are not the same as every second car on the road (ie. WRX)
Guess I won't know until I drive one of these beauties. I don't suppose anyone knows of a good GT4 for sale in Canberra?
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane, QLD
Registered:
February 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Mon, 29 March 2004 11:21
|
|
| Matty P wrote on Mon, 29 March 2004 20:11 |
| Quote: |
I'm 6'2" and I fit no problems... there is a lot of room for a car of its type.
|
I'm only 6'4" but I had ALL sorts of trouble with my ZZT231. If the GT4 is as bad in the headroom I won't be buying one!
| Quote: |
The main point of the car as far as I'm concerned is that its fairly rare to see these days (esp the Group A) and you get a LOT of looks!
|
I do like the fact that they are a bit unique and are not the same as every second car on the road (ie. WRX)
Guess I won't know until I drive one of these beauties. I don't suppose anyone knows of a good GT4 for sale in Canberra?
|
you're about my height then, i doubt you'll have much trouble, i dont think they'd be smaller than ST162's, and i fit in those without too much worries, a smaller than stock steering wheel would make things a bit more comfortable...but its smoething i could live with
if you're really curious, scout around for ST182's at dealers, jump in one and i'm sure they'll be identical on the inside to GT4's
|
|
|
I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Wed, 31 March 2004 05:55
|
|
Theres about 5 GT-Fours (ST165 - ST185) including one ST185 Group A for sale on the eastern coast...
Check www.carpoint.com.au under Toyota Celica's
Theres a couple in www.tradingpost.com.au as well
|
|
|
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Wed, 31 March 2004 09:56
|
|
what do you think would be cheaper to own
MK III Supra w 1j or 2j
OR
Celica GT4 (165,185)
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Wed, 31 March 2004 10:12
|
|
depends - do you intend to modify or not ..
much of a muchness as far as im concernened - though supras easier to work on
|
|
|
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Wed, 31 March 2004 10:14
|
|
|
hmmmm thanks dude
|
|
|
Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Wed, 31 March 2004 10:16
|
|
but the Gt4 looks cooler 
you know that ..
BTW are you going to dyno day 9 rob - if so - the greyboeast will be back to challenge for top st185 again
|
|
|
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
|
|
Re: ST185 GT4 Cost of Ownership
|
Wed, 31 March 2004 10:19
|
|
yeah baby I will be there!
I vow to only ever have increasing dyno readouts. Finished exhaust for this one 
can't wait to see your super beast man!
you can crash here again if you want I suppose, though, I am kinda thinking about going to a cuz's wedding in the US if I can afford it.
and the gt4 can rally, and go sick power out of corners but it can't go crazy sideways 
|
|
|
