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Dream Machine (PC)
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Tue, 27 August 2002 22:15
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Guys I have to buy a new PC. Not sure what to get though in terms of engine and bolt ons as I have been out of the game for a while.
Any suggestions for the best (value for money a consideration)
-->Sound card ( considering my Bro is a sound eng and wants to set me up with some cool software)up $600
-->3D vid card ( I love a bit of gaming) up to $400 or so.
-->I wanna get at least a 2GHz processor (prolly a 2.26), but am unsure whether to go with intel or AMD at this stage, is there a new AMD out soon or something ??
also Motherboards - something with a little flexibillity so that when the 2gig processor is old and slow ( God FOrbid )I can wring a little more grunt out of it !!
Therst of the machine will have be a 80 HD and at least 512 M of RAM.
Thanks
Matt
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Tue, 27 August 2002 23:40
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Go the AMD!!!
There's a new Athlon 2600 running on a revised core. It kicked the fastest P4 in nearly every single test.
P4 wasn't running RAMBUS RAM though, but I prefer those tests since none of us are ever gonna even think of buying RAMBUS...
You could wait for the Hammer to be released... AMD's new 64bit chip...... Linux has support for the chip already, and I'm pretty sure that Windoze does too now. It's fully compatible with the 32bit i386 instructions anyway...
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 00:41
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Thanks Nark , how long for the "Hammer" ??
How much more does the RAMBUS RAM cost??
Will the athlon handle gaming and multimedia as well as a p4 ?
Thanks
Matt
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:15
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Not sure about the release date. From memory, it's Q3 2002...
Not sure how much RAMBUS costs, a non-specific answer would be "a shitload". 
Athlon is better in all games apart from Doom for some reason.
Multimedia performance is stronger due to its superiour ALU and smaller pipeline.
P4s have better FPUs and have bigger memory bandwidth (especially with RAMBUS).
The reviews I've read on the Hammer show that it will 0wn both Athlon and P4 by a big margin.
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:31
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There is a new P4 out now. The 2800. Running DDR ram it kicked the latest AMD cpu.
I am a service manager at a computer wholesaler and we move alot of stock. My personal experience is "there is no substitute for quality." I get back alot of amd cpu that f#*$ up. Probably around 50 amd cpus returned for every 1 intel. Your choice tho. Both cpu brands are quick. I recomend buying the best brands possible tho.
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:35
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When I bought my last machine the athlons were significantly cheaper for the top end processors, is this still the case ?
I might make enquieries about when a "hammer " will be available.
sounds like it will be worth waiting for !
any word on motherboards for the athlon vs hammer, obviously being 64 bit the hammer will not go onto a athlon board ??
Matt
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:37
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Be lucky to get hammer out before the end of the year. They is also designed with workstations in mind so they should be well outa your price range. Unless u got a spare $800 or so for just the cpu.
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:40
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I am upgrading from an overclocked P2 233, so anything, P4 or Athlon, over 2GHz is gunna be more then quick to me.
what about sound cards, and vid, I like ist person shootem stuff, (Quake, halflife, unreal, etc, and Mech warrior style of stuff)what should I pay, I dont want games to come out that dont support my hardware !!
Matt
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:42
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What is an athlon 2600 worth retail ??
I assume about 250 for the board.
matt
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:43
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Whatever cpu u get, buy it with a decent motherboard with onboard sound. Then buy a decent brand video card. Say a geforce 4 ti 4200. Put in 256mb of ddr ram and a 7200 rpm hard drive. Get a burner too as they ain't that much more expensive anymore. An that should easily meet your needs.
Brett.
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:44
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Sound card - go a Sound Blaster Extigy if you can find one. kick ass quality, good peripheral support and it looks cool!
Get em for somewhere round the $500 or so, check www.eyo.com.au or HT perhaps?
Audigy is similar qual, but internal and without some of the cool stuff.
I'm more of a fan of Intel CPUs - my AMD died three times before I told the guy to give me an intel... I've got a P4 1.8, goes hard.
Video card - GeForce 4 Ti4200 DDR for round about $330 or so.
M/B - get something with support for at least the 266 bus, preferably 333 so you can use the PC2700 ddr ram, and get one with USB2 and ATA133. I think Intel have a good M/B - I can find out which one if you like.
Cheers
-nick
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 01:52
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I want a good sound card as my bro is gunna chuck in some cash so he can do assignments on it, (he studying recording/ sound eng).
Sound blaster extigy sounds like my price range.
good to see concensus on the vid card, makes it easy for me !!
i will get 512MEg of the fastest ram i can get, for the recording and stuff it needs to do, might do vid editing later too.
Thinking of a p4 2.26 or so, Time to get some quotes !!
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Brisbane - Chapel Hill
Registered:
June 2002
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 02:30
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The Hammer will come in a variety of forms from server to mobile. They will be more expensive than the Athlon, but that's a given. They are not just designed for the workstation though.
But since they're new, they will be pretty hideously expensive...
No idea on mobos as yet since the Hammers are still in the final phases of development.
AMDs tend to die if the heatsink isn't installed properly, this is not a fault of the CPU, just bad heatsink design and bad installation...
You could always try a dual Athlon system.... I'm planning one for my next upgrade.
BTW, I wouldn't recommend a dual CPU system if you're gonna be using Windoze... It sux.
If you want reading material, try these...
Hammer:
http://www.hwextreme.com/reviews/processor/opteron /
Athlon 2600 vs P4 2.53GHz:
http://www.amdmb.com/article-display.php?ArticleID =202
I think these two CPUs are about the same price.
P4 2.8GHz vs Athlon 2600:
http://www.hothardware.com/hh_files/CCAM/p4_28g.sh tml
Looks like the P4 2.8GHz is more superiour to to the Athlon 2600 (which would be evident from the numbers)... But at 166% the price...
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Central Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Wed, 28 August 2002 03:42
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Matt:
Gimme a buzz on 0416240433, and i'll get some prices for ya! I actually work at a computer shop on the coast. I can do stuff at "Mates Rates" so yeah 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
south of the big smoke
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 03:51
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hey Nark did you know that they are no longer making the duron processer and will replace it with the XP chip as its budget chip when the claw hammer chip is released
i was gunna say the same as rvrolla but he is closer so i would go with him
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 05:22
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Thanks Guys , I appreciate it.
i will most likely go with as quick a p4 as I can afford, i want it to be as stable and reliabel as possible.
Stay tuned Daniel, I'll email you with my wish list as soon as I can get it together.
Thanks again,
Matt
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Central Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 05:59
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No worries mate, Pentium 4's are ok, now, but i still preferr Athlon's
I have an XP1600, kicks butt over the P4's for games etc, BUT they both have they're advantages and disadvantages.
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Location:
Sydney, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 06:23
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One thing I found with the Athlons, as soon as you get it scrape that crappy pink stuff off the heat sink and use some proper white heatsink compound (only a tiny amount needed)... solves a lot of heat problems...
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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 Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 06:45
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If you want, send me a list of the components you want and I'll get a quote for you.
Just so that you can compare prices.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
South of Wollongong
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 08:06
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Yer, im happy with my xp2000 
I reckon www.gamedude.com.au is the best priced site i've seen.
Been to any computer fairs?? ppl there are usually happy to match or better gamedude prices.
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 09:03
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I really need to buy a "complete system", it makes it easy=ier to claim off my tax, rather than components, so i'm really looking for one place that can supply the lot as a going concern with one invoice.
Besides,like i said Ive been out of the game a while, and dont fancy putting hte bitch together and making it go, I would always be worried that I could have done it better.
I'll send out a few emails, i can buy it through where I work to get "education" prices, this works out about 20% off retail, dont know if you guys will be able to beat that.
Thanks
Matt
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Location:
Western Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 12:30
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A mate I was talking to on icq said that you should get rid of the heatsink and fan on the cpu and get a Volcano 9 and thermal paste which costs $50. Don't know what a Volcano 9 is though.
On the subject of computers, does anyone know where you can buy a reasonably priced laptop?
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I supported Toymods
Banned User
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 12:39
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Reasonably priced and laptop just does'nt go togeather in the same sentence :-
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Central Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 13:36
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A volcano 9 is a big arse mother of a heatsink!! It is made by Thermaltake,
http://www.thermaltake.com/products/heatsink/v9.ht m
I should imagine they arent cheap
As for the AMD vs Intel thing, I unfortunantly would have to agree with Helmann, AMD's do have a higher return rate, but if you install them, leave them alone, they work a treat. AMD's are also a bit easier to tweak.
RAM
RAMBUS RAM is crap IMHO, it is expensive and is like bloody old skool EDO, has (depending on the mainboard/chipset) to be paired up. i.e. Has to have 2x128 to make 256, can't just use 1 x 256mb.
DDR RAM is good, doesn't get as hot, dues to the fact that it's not quite as quick, and is wayyyy cheaper and dont have to pair it up. It is slowly creeping back up in price though...
VIDEO
GeForce 4 is the way to go for video, the MX440 chipset GeForces are reasonable for performance, and are at a very reasonable price.
SOUND
I wouldn't bother with an Extigy, unless you have a specific purpose, I would go for the Audigy. Or much much cheaper, a Sound Blaster Live! DE 5.1 or use onboard sound, see how that goes and you can always up date later?
CD BURNERS
CD Burners are cheap at the moment!
MAINBOARDS
I have a Asus mainboard, it personal preferrence really. But I love this one I did a mates Athlon XP 2000+ on one of these:
http://www.giga-byte.com/products/7vrxp.htm
It has everything from Memory Stick / Security Digital (MMC) / Smart Card Reader connectors to onboard raid and 8 USB (4 USB II and 4 USB 1.1) Its not too badly priced either! Check it out
A few suggestions for ya, BUT in my opinion, don't waste you money buying the latest and greatest CPU out, you'll pay hundreds more just for a little bit of performance. Eg 2800, it will come down in price within months anyways.
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 23:38
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TOYO3T. What I meant was, gimme a system spec.
Then I'll see what sort of prices I can get for you.
As mobos go, I like the Asus ones. But the best thing to do is to read up reviews on mobos for the specific CPU and RAM that you're gonna run.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Thu, 29 August 2002 23:50
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Matt
hows this for a decent priced laptop
IBM R32 Notebook - P4 1.6G 256/20 14.1 DVD XP PRO
P4 1.6GHz, 256MB, 20GB HDD, 8x DVD-ROM,Win XP Pro,
14.1" TFT SCREEN, 16MB video mem, 56K Modem, 10/100 E'net
$2725 (ex tax)
$2997 (inc GST)
From our supplier DPI, sounds like a good deal to me.
Ben
AE86 Trueno 4AGE
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Fri, 30 August 2002 15:06
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The only Athlon's I've seen come back to our shop in the last 8 months are one's owned by "tweaker types". All the one's we have sent out with either Retail heatsinks or sufficient heatsinks on OEM chips have not come back. Time will tell, that 3 year warranty from AMD may come in handy!
You guys are right about that pink crap on standard heatsinks... I changed a few of our display PC's over to Artic Silver III and they each showed temperature decreases at idle and under load.
I've heard some heatsinks with that pink stuff actually require it to be cured? by leaving the fan off for a few seconds so it melts around the dye and forms a good seal between the base and cpu dye. Dunno if I'd be up for that! 3 year warranty anyone?
A word of advice...
Consider how much noise you could tolerate from your PC, in the environment it will be used in! At the store the machine will sound quieter than at home in a closed of study area etc.
Chances are that without modding you can not get a quiet cool pc of the AthlonXP variety. Even the standard Heatsinks are noisy little things, but it all depends on your threshold of tolerance.
I got pissed with my noisy Volcano 7+ and replaced it with a quieter Cooler Master OEM unit (SP5 something) that does well in my case, a codegen mini-server ugly beast.
Sum up your requirement for the present and next year or so, and start from there. $100 compromises aren't worth quibbling over!
Anyway, Good Luck, and please don't compare your system to the latest on the market! It will only hurt you 
g'nite all 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Central Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Sat, 31 August 2002 00:44
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The Volcano 9's are meant to be quite quiet. They have they're own termal control in the fan! So at idle, the fan would spin down to lower RPM and maintain a steady temperature control.
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Location:
Western Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Sat, 31 August 2002 01:47
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Hi Ben
Thanks for that mate.
Thats a pretty good price for a laptop with those specs.
Do you just buy them from DPI?
I was hoping a good laptop could be had for $2k.
Looks like I'm going to have to take out a loan and the car won't be totally fixed for a long time
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Location:
Eskilstuna, Sweden
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Dream Machine (PC)
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Sat, 31 August 2002 09:33
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Hi Matt,
I'm a bit late to this thread but if your bro is going to put some nice sound/sequence type software on then those sound cards above will not cut shit. You will need to use something like a creamware card or better (and cheaper depending on spec) a breakout box like something by hoontech.
This is a good site for prices etc:
http://www.auspcmarket.com.au/index.php
I agree with rvrolla in that ASUS make some very nice boards for both Intel and AMD. whatever you do avoid MSI they suck shit and their support staff here have smoked more crack than princess Di.
Just shy of 2 cents
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