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Location:
Rosanna, Melb
Registered:
June 2002
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4efte into Paseo
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Fri, 02 April 2004 16:51
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Has anyone got any info on this conversion. Is it a straight bolt-up out of a half-cut? Does any of the new hardware foul the body?
Also can you use the 5e bottom end or possibly the 4e rods/pistons on the 5e crank to build a 5e-fte?
Just researching now and can't find much solid info. Any help or direction appreciated.
thanks
Hen
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Location:
NSW, East Coast
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Sat, 03 April 2004 01:06
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Ive heard that the 4efte is a straight swap, but as for the rest, no idea.
You probably find it hard to access info because there are more popular engine swaps.
No doubt your theories have merit, but finding someone who's done it already can be quite hard sometimes.
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Tue, 20 July 2004 01:30
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I'm thinking of the same thing for my Paseo. Take a look at:
http://www.paseopimp.com/main.php
and here's a paste from the site:
It is physically a direct bolt in. The seo halfshafts will work, the seo trans will work. It's best to use the 4e ecu also, but that means a custom harness so the rest of your car's electricals still work. You also need the 4e harness, ignitor, map sensor, and coil. These are the only components not directly connected to the engine that you should also have for a less painful swap. If you have an auto and wanna switch to a manual then, you either need a hella good electrician, or you need a manual trans cowl (under dash) harness for your seo also. These are very expensive from the dealer (early 92-650ish, late 92-95 900ish). This makes the painful wiring easier. I'm not sure about the 2g harnesses. If you have an auto and wanna keep it, you need a 4e computer from the ep91 starlet, as that's the only turbo version that was available with an auto trans. That would be 96 or newer starlet. The power steering pump is diff (fyi). The starlet trans has slightly different gear ratios than the seo (closer), and a 4.31 final drive as opposed to the seo's 3.9. The starlet trans also has a 212 mm pressure plate, seo 200mm. If you go with the starlet trans (recommended) you can use an aftermarket clutch for the celica. The sparkplug wires are the same, except if you get a set for the seo you won't get the cable from the distributor to the coil, as the seo coil is integrated.
The hardest part about the wiring is where the 4e harness goes to the underhood fuse box, and where the engine harness interfaces with the cowl harness. The plugs are different, the wire colors are different, and every starlet wiring diagram I have found only has the engine harness wiring, and not the cowl or fuse box wiring.
The ASP, or Diaboliqeracing underdrive crank pulley will work on the 4e. The 4e downpipe/o2 sensor housing will not bolt directly to the seo exhaust, but a coupler isn't hard to make.
The starlet has a hi/lo boost switch, but if you don't get a clip you won't get this switch. If you don't have it, you can wire your own, or just delete it. The car will stay on high boost, which is .65 BAR or about 9.5 psi. This is a good thing, but it means you can only use premium gas. The fuel mileage is still good, if you don't flat foot it everywhere you go. That was hard for the first few weeks. I had to get gas about every other day. LOL. If you gut the stock cat/downpipe/o2 sensor housing before installation the car will run better, but this is illegal (disclaimer). Or wicked eps sells a stainless downpipe/cat eliminator.
The computer fuel cut is at 14 psi, if you want to exceed this you will need a fuel cut defenser. HKS sells these for about 150, or check e bay. The paseo fuel pump will support the stock boost, not sure how much over stock it will support, but fuel is very important to turbo engines. FUEL AND FUEL RATION IS VERY VERY IMPORTANT TO TURBO ENGINES.
There are a multitude of tuning parts available for the starlet engine. Everything from fmic kits, to turbo upgrades, to bovs, to piggy back fuel computers and ecu replacements.
I plan on making a resource list of all of the starlet engine parts I have found, and where to get them.
If you plan on doing the 4e-5e hybrid the crank will end up being the weak link, the 5e crank is not as strong as the 4e crank. I don't have any specifics on this as to how much.
I plan on boosting my 4e to 12-13 psi with the help of a turbo xs standard boost controller and apexi safc. Although the fuel cut is at 14 psi, and you can go even higher with proper fueling, I have heard that about 12 psi is about the top of the efficiency curve for the stock ct9 turbo. After that it's just an industrial strength heat gun.
This is all that I can think of right now, it's gettin late.
If you guys like this, sticky it, if not dump it. It just seems we answer the same questions over and over again. Well that's my editorial. Peace Pimps. Oh, and get booooooooosssssssssssttttttttt.
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Hope this all helps
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
March 2003
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Tue, 20 July 2004 13:36
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i have wired afew 4eftes
one was in a paseo
not difficult just time consuming
cause the std car has alot of wires that run thru the engine loom but dont goto the engine
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Location:
cambo
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Wed, 21 July 2004 11:21
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im supposed to be doing this conversion for someone soonish. i was HOPING the looms would be the same so i could just plug in the ECU but alas this is never the case 
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
March 2003
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Wed, 21 July 2004 12:40
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no way the looms are way different
its a prick of a job
have done afew but takes a full day to do
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Location:
NSW, Blacktown region
Registered:
October 2003
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Wed, 21 July 2004 12:41
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straight swap into starlet,paseo,sera
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Wed, 21 July 2004 12:50
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Got any more details on the 4efte into Paseo. Was wondering how I would go engineering wise. If there are any other things that need to be done? Would love to talk with someone who has done this swap.
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Location:
cambo
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Thu, 22 July 2004 09:42
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well if i do get the job might have to get sideshow to do the wiring  i cant be stuffed with shit like that.
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Thu, 22 July 2004 10:54
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Thinking of maybe going for the 20v 4age now. Any thoughts on that to fit in the Paseo? More horses with no Turbo.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Thu, 22 July 2004 14:55
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The 4EFTE is a far superior performer to the 4AG 20v in my opinon.
I am basing this off the fact that a mate's 20v Sprinter has run a best of 16.3 at the drags. However, I was chopped at the drags in my Supra by a GT Starlet one day - on that same pass I ran 13.7!!
Add to this that the 20v is probably bigger, heavier, and a MUGH harder conversion, and you're crazy!
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Location:
Parramatta
Registered:
July 2002
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Fri, 23 July 2004 01:04
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I would have thought that the 20V would have been the better option as I get more stock HP without a Turbo. Even though it may be a little more mucking around to fit in it can't be that hard. Better for insurance too. And If I wanted to go the whole deal I can always put on a Turbo later. Any more thoughts.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
August 2003
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Fri, 23 July 2004 04:07
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Don't believe the stock hp figures for the 20v. They're significantly less in real life.
Also, for insurance purposes, either way it's going to be hard to get someone to insure you. It's still considered a heavily modified car since you've put an engine in a car that was never designed for it.
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Location:
Syndey
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Fri, 23 July 2004 05:11
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4efte's are awesome engines, with a few bolt ons will make 200hp at the wheels pretty easy,
stock they are pretty much the same, the 20v makes about 90kw with ecu and exhaust and the 4efte makes 90-100 with a little boost, ecu and exhaust,
the 4efte will out torque a 20v by a long way, in a race the 20v would not stand a chance,
the conversion into a paseo is easy, just bolt the 4efte straight in, the stock 5efe and 4efte dizzys are totally different, if you use a after market ecu you dont have to worry about all that as the dizzy wiring is not required,
dale
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Fri, 23 July 2004 10:34
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Thanks Dale. I'm starting to lean more toward the 4efte now, sounds like a lot less headaches. Have you done the swap before? Does this mean I can leave the Paseo wiring in but just change the ecu, or should I change the whole wiring as well. Are there any more things I need to change? How do I get more out of the 4efte, I'm going to buy the engine and take my time with it, clean up the casting marks and match all the manifold ports, are there any areas that need extra strength, like replacing the conrod bolts and so on? What about putting a different intercooler on, want to do this more for looks than anything as I don't like the standard one covering the rocker cover. Will hid all the pretty stuff once I'm done, so I hope to put a smallish external intercooler on. Maybe even a watercooled unit.
Any thoughts?
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Location:
Rosanna, Melb
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Fri, 23 July 2004 14:51
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So in three months I got one reply. And now this is running hot. I was just interested on a friend's behalf but mainly out of curiosity.
I've now seen that one of the guys at option1garage has done this conversion so may be a good help.
My money is on the 4efte over the 20v. The 20v is basically almost at its peak performance already whereas getting much more power out of the 4e isn't too hard. They can make silly power if built right.
Hen
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Location:
Castlemaine Vic
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Fri, 23 July 2004 23:47
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theres a guy in shepparton (vic) that has done the swap, was talking to to him ages ago while i was up there and when i had the gze 82`. have since seen him in bendigo a few times, sounds/looks like it good pretty good.
i'll see if i can get in contact with him through a few mates from shepp
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Location:
Syndey
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Sat, 24 July 2004 03:03
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i have some info on the wiring,
you can leave the factory ecu in there if you run a aftermarket,
just got back from the dyno tuning a starlet, made 174hp at the wheels with microtech, crappy nissan turbo, stock injectors (maxed out), malpassi etc,
with one of our td04l kits you will make 200hp at the wheels with a injector upgrade, FMIC, microtech and a good clutch,
i run a water to air cooler on my misses stock 4efe with a td04 on it, works a treat, ill get some pics over the weekend and post them up
Dale
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Location:
u.s.a. south
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Sun, 25 July 2004 12:26
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if you have a healthy 5E in your paseo, turbocharge it.
I have an issue of Turbo magazine (usa) that featured a custom turbo paseo way back in '97.
The bone stock 5E had 96,000 miles on it when it was turbocharged. 20k miles after they did the article.
Tuning via; adjustable rising rate fuel pressure reg and a msd btm for timing retard. Modified stock cast iron manifold, silvia turbo, 2.5" exhaust, fmic/pipes, bosch pump and get this, STOCK injectors but they upgraded the entire fuel line/feed.
Full weight airconditioned, it ran 12.57s on slicks!
You should do even better with standalone.
The guy that put the turbosystem together had lotsa experience with speed, and he owns this business
http://www.turborepair.com/
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Location:
Syndey
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Sun, 25 July 2004 22:08
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we have a turbo kit that bolts straight onto the 4e and 5e motors, it uses a TD04L off a 98-current wrx,
that is what i have on my misses starlet with a bone stock 4efe, it makes 139hp at the wheels, 7mge injectors, microtech LT8, stock fuel pump/regulator, motor has 137,000km on it, 30,000 since being turbo, never misses a beat,
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Mon, 26 July 2004 22:02
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Ok then so what if I fix up the 5efe and put a turbo on it, FMI and water spray kit.
What about all the talk of a weak bottom end? IS this true, can it be strengthened?
Would I replace the injectors, if so what with?
What would I need to do to the standard ECU?
Is the 4etfe head better than the 5efe, if so why?
What about the cams, must be some work needed there?
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Location:
Syndey
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Mon, 26 July 2004 23:01
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dont waste your time with a water sprayer, they do nothing,
the 4efe and 5efe are very very similer, the cams, head, inlet manafold, ignition system are only good for about 140hp at the wheels, if you want any more than this you should fit a 4efte head/cams, upgrade the ign system with a 4efte dizzy and coil,
the sotck coil in the dizzy sucks, i have the charge it to 4ms to stop blowing out the spark on my misses car, i have heard that the igniter is not a good thing and i will change it for a bosch one shortly,
you will need some 7mge, 4agze injectors, after market ecu etc,
stock fuel pumps are fine for over 140hp at the wheels,
it all depends on how much power you are chasing, the stock 5efe with one of our td04l turbo kits will make more power than a stock 4efte, but a 4efte with one of our kits will make a lot more power than the 5efe,.
tell me how much power you want and ill tell you whats the best way to do it,
our turbo kits for a 5efe start a $1600 and go up from there depending on what you want with it,
for $1600 you get
Manafold
gaskets,
braided oil feed and adaptors
oil drain and fittings for sump, clamps etc
water lines, adaptors and clamps
remote oil filter (speedflow hose and fittings)
dump pipe flange
K&N air filter
or for $3000
everything above
Microtech LT8s
Malpassi regulator
fuel hose
vacuum hose
you will need to supply turbo and injectors,
install for the turbo kit is around the $500 mark, install for microtech is $450, intercooler pipes in stainless around $550, custom intercooler $900
this just gives you a indication on how much everything is worth,
Dale
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Location:
u.s.a. south
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Tue, 27 July 2004 04:13
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>>"cams, head, inlet manafold, ignition system are only good for about 140hp at the wheels, "
hmmmm. These items can't *all* bottleneck at 140hp to the wheels, can they ? Which item is it ? Looks like the ignition system, eh.
I'd think the stock 5E, full wt. paseo I mentioned above had a good bit over 140whp to run mid 12s. The MSD used is a CDI in addition to boost-retard, so spark was not a problem.
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Location:
Syndey
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Tue, 27 July 2004 04:29
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ign is the number 1, is really struggles at anything over 10psi boost, inlet manafold is a killer at anything over 14psi, cams just dont lift enough full stop, head might be alright,
as i said i have upped the charge time on the coil and it fixes the ign problems to a certian extent (not having any break down on 14psi now), now the cams are killing it, a 4efte will make power to 7800rpm with a td04 on it, the 4efe will only make power 5500rpm.
i have spend hours and hours on the dyno tuning these motors, i know what makes them tick and what dosent make them tick, i have people flying me all around the country to come and tune there 4efte's,
we have a range of parts that makes them go, we can supply you with what ever you want to make anything from 130hp to 250hp ATW.
our new inlet manafolds are ready to go and can be supplied with in one week of deposit being taken, you can choose weather you want 4 extra injectors or not,
a 4efte with TD04L turbo kit, microtech, 8 stock injectors, inlet manafold, upgrade fuel pump/regulator, good intercooler, 3in exhuast, will make 220hp at the wheels all day long.
fit a gt style garrett turbo rated at 450hp and it will make well over that, we are aiming at 300+ hp at the wheels with a 4efte on race gas and 30psi boost, 220hp will be daily driving on 18psi, this same engine made 200hp atw on 19psi before it got a lot of good bits inside the engine.
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Thu, 29 July 2004 21:39
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Is there such a thing as heavy duty bearings for the 5efe crankshaft?
This is where everyone thinks the engine is week, is this correct?
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Location:
Syndey
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Thu, 29 July 2004 21:53
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as long as the tune is good and you use the correct oil you wont have a problem with the bearings,
Dale
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Wed, 18 August 2004 05:03
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Does anyone know much about the 5E-FHE engine. What difference is there from the 5EFE, is it any better. If I was to use this engine can I use my wiring and ECU?
And where could I get my hands on one?
----------------------------------
BTW got my X-Racing body kit fitted last week, my Paseo looks great. Turning heads now.
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Location:
geelong
Registered:
September 2003
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Mon, 10 January 2005 09:17
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hi, has anyone done or seen a rwd 4efte and what box did you/they use.  steve.
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Location:
Nowra
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Mon, 10 January 2005 22:30
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Take a look here
http://www.billzilla.org/mycars.htm
It says something about a New Zealand Toyota Starlet, a 1984 KP-61 rear wheel drive model.
Ddon't know if it has the 4efe, but I'd say it does.
Why do you want to go rear wheel drive?
If you are going to all that trouble think of picking another engine at the same time, maybe a 4age or something.
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Location:
Gympie Qld
Registered:
December 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Tue, 11 January 2005 08:18
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The Rwd 4EFTE is also a conversion I wanted to look at as it would be ideal for my little MG Midget and also a little different.
That EP61 Starlet on the billzilla site is an old model that was RWD so it's no use for info.
The top left bolt hole and dowel for the bellhousing is the same as 4AGE (FWD) and the T50 (RWD) boxes. I've checked that far, just haven't had time to check those in relation to the input shaft. There's nto a huge difference but enough to stop me buying teh motor without fully checking.
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
March 2003
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Tue, 11 January 2005 12:02
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no i havnt seen a rwd 4efte but i have seen a
4efe rwd into a ride on lawn mover
at 1800 revs it cuts throw any length of grass hehe
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Location:
geelong
Registered:
September 2003
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Location:
Darwin, NT
Registered:
May 2004
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Sat, 11 June 2005 06:10
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has anyone got the wiring diagrams for this conversion?
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4efte into Paseo
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Sun, 12 June 2005 11:21
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| Enrage wrote on Sat, 11 June 2005 16:10 |
has anyone got the wiring diagrams for this conversion?
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What, the mower? 
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