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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 03:07
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hello im seriously considering going the CA18det route in my ae86, but i just want to clear up a few things.
1)how hard is the conversion?
2)what needs to be modified, replaced etc
3)are there any know hard areas in the conversion?
4)what is the approximate cost of the conversion?
5)where is a cheap place in NSW to get 1/2 cuts?
thanks
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 03:48
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1. its way too hard
2. everything
3. yes, everything
4. arm and a leg
5. no where
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Location:
Perth
Registered:
August 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 06:12
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Location:
Perth
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 06:15
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| ae95 wrote on Wed, 01 December 2004 11:48 |
1. its way too hard
2. everything
3. yes, everything
4. arm and a leg
5. no where
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That's not very helpful at all.... 
If you do have useful information on this topic I am also keen to hear it.
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Location:
yeppoon Qld
Registered:
November 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 07:10
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im considering this conversion too.
I dont know why people are laughing at the idea, infact i know a few sprinters with ca18 det's.
when i get some info i'll post it here
Cheers kevin
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Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 07:13
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talk to simon-ae86 - hes recently done it to his dorifto machine
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Location:
yeppoon Qld
Registered:
November 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 07:22
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im tryin to find out where i can get hold of him at??
ive been told ca18 silvia half cut for around 1k
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Location:
Perth
Registered:
August 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 09:22
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Although Im not a big fan of the CA18 conversion I think to sat that its way to hard is a bit rough....
Its been done successfully manny times and I believe that a kit was made for this very conversion at one stage....
But for my money stick with a toyota powerplant 
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 10:25
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geezus, is the CA18det into ae86 the new 4age into ae86?? everyones doing it!
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Location:
NSW, Sydney
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 10:51
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simon, who cares?
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 10:53
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| pr1nce wrote on Wed, 01 December 2004 20:51 |
simon, who cares?
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my mummy does!
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
August 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 11:56
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go for an sr20 unless u can get a ca halfcut at a really cheap price. ca's are gettin old, doesn't mean i think they're not good tho 
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 14:46
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jesus people,
i didn't ask for everybody to say dont do it, or show their own opinion.
simon, if your able to can you please pm me with some info about this conversion.
"ca's are gettin old"-and 4age's aren't???
if i can find a motor that will go in without much of a problem, and makes more power than a 4age, is already turbo and has a gearbox that can actullay handle turbo power, then i'll do the conversion. i dont really care if it's toyota or not, and simon's drifts mighty hard!
go the matt black!!!!
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 15:25
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Motor, box and loom with computer ,will set you back about $1800 from sss automotive in sydney with warranty. And the rest is up to you!
I have one in my sprinter and it goes pretty f#8King good on stock boost and 3 inch exhaust!
Look at the Big picture.
Aftermarket goodies are cheap!
Box is a shit load stronger than a t50 and can accept bigger clutch assemblies!
And if you blow an engine there are plenty around.
I would have loved to put a 12a turbo in the car but $$ were short and the ca just fit the bill, got the stuff i needed from a mate at the right price!
mick!
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 15:43
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i'd like to see photos of peoples custom mounts for the CA18DET if anyone has them
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 01 December 2004 23:25
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gtmick - thats the stuff im talking about
did you do the conversion yourself???
any information you can give me on it?
hello simon???
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Registered:
February 2003
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Location:
Toronto, Downtown
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 02:58
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Going for a nissan ca18 you might aswell go for the big daddy nissan 4cly the sr20. There are heaps more aftermarket parts for them they are all alloy so they would wigh the same as the ca and have more torque to boot.
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 04:04
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Yeah but SR you end up with rocker arms still and timing chain 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 04:17
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and more weight
and twice the price
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Location:
Toronto, Downtown
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 04:21
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aaahhhh twice the weight hello all alloy block its only marginally heavier than a 4agze and rocker arms and chain driven camshafts.
Well for startes you dont have to replace timing belts and who cares about rocker arms when you can run over 300rwkw reliably on stock internals.
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 04:26
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IMHO I think the SR20 is inferior to the CA18. But anyhow thats besides the point and not on topic with this thread
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Location:
Toronto, Downtown
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 04:45
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[quote title=ae95 wrote on Thu, 02 December 2004 15:30]| 4agte wrote on Thu, 02 December 2004 12:21 |
where did i say twice the weight hello?!
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I apolagise my mistake i misread that part.
My point of view is that if your gonna look past a 4agze and go for bigger cubes in the form of a ca18det which i would assume would be more difficult and costly than a 4agze conversion you might aswel go for big cubes. It only makes sense to me that you would spend what 800 - 1000 buks more to get an sr20 instead so that you have more potential. I mean you have a bigger turbo for starters.
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Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 08:01
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you wouldnt want to run 200 KW thru a Sr20 anyway with those stock rocker arms ..
I believe they have a tendancy to shatter at higher than stock loads, due to em being hollow
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 10:02
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yep
rocker stopper conversion is fairly common in high revving sr's
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 10:27
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In a sprinter, i'd take a CA18 over an SR20 any day,
in my opinion SR20's sound as bas as a wet fart.
i'd say that a CA18 would be one of the easiest engines to put in an AE86 besides a 4A of course. similar size etc...
i'd be budgeting a couple of g on top of the cost of the engine/halfcut.
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Thu, 02 December 2004 12:43
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CAE86's rock
i miss mine soo much, cant wait til its running again.
just fitted a stronger box, new clucth and rebuilt engine with new loom.
should be a better car 
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Location:
Toronto, Downtown
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Fri, 03 December 2004 02:53
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| Classique71 wrote on Thu, 02 December 2004 19:01 |
you wouldnt want to run 200 KW thru a Sr20 anyway with those stock rocker arms ..
I believe they have a tendancy to shatter at higher than stock loads, due to em being hollow
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Holding stock sr20's together when making big power is like any stock motor you dont rev it past the factory red line and make sure you have the proper support systems and good tuning. Just have a look at jms that were running well over 300rkw on stock internals. They did melt the motor in the end but this was only when they turned the boost controller up as far as it would go.
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Location:
u.s.a. south
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Fri, 03 December 2004 11:14
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I've done quite a few rolla swaps, but I haven't any details on swapping in a ca18det... Yet! I'll get around to it simply because it makes so much sense, that I have to do one... and it'll be ez for me.
Why bother upgrading the motor when u can make enough power reliably from stock internals & ecu, to scare u out of your mind - screw the aftermarket, u won't need 'em to screw u. Freshen the rod bearing tho.
An s13 has gone 12.2 on a ca18det +16g turbo. Will do 11s in a rolla.
I know of a ca powered rolla runs 12.0 using microtech + t3/4 @12psi.
The ca picks up where the 4ag gets off... I see it as nothing more than a bigger displacement, improved 4agte.
I own both a ca18 s13 and a b13 sr20det. SR is 'ok', but gimme the ca.
Seen stock internal ca do 400hp. Another made 471 ft-lbs tq using a 20gtd06. Either would be frightening in a rolla
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Fri, 03 December 2004 11:58
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you WONT make 300rwkw reliably on an internally stock SR20. The lower end tends to lose rods around 300rwkw, and the "lash adjusters" die around 220-250rwkw.
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Fri, 03 December 2004 16:01
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AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhh
i diddn't ask if i should choose a CA or an SR block, or how much power they can handle.
if you want to post 30 replys over something that i dont care about, then please make a new thread. BUT if anyone has any information about the CA18DET engine conversion into an AE86 then please help me.
simon i know you've done it-can you please give me some information about the conversion
| Quote: |
Its been done successfully manny times and I believe that a kit was made for this very conversion at one stage....
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who makes this conversion kit and how can i contact them?
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Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Fri, 03 December 2004 17:34
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I make a kit. After a big problem here with some cars I have fulfilled two orders and have made two extra sets as well.
Here's a pic. They work with CA box or RB box (shifter further forward)
They are $300 + GST including two new urethane engine mounts to suit (DONT USE THE CA MOUNTS WITH THESE BRACKETS)
The CA18DET is arguably the best value for money swap you can do for an 86, as long as keeping it original doesnt phase you. Just make sure you get a good one.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
January 2003
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I supported Toymods
Location:
sydney.au
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Sat, 04 December 2004 05:49
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kellam. u need an online shop and a website to boot.
contact me bro.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Sat, 04 December 2004 05:59
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| TurboRA28 wrote on Thu, 02 December 2004 15:26 |
IMHO I think the SR20 is inferior to the CA18. But anyhow thats besides the point and not on topic with this thread
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I disagree.
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Location:
u.s.a. south
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Sat, 04 December 2004 10:15
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I understand the rb20 gbox has the shifter in a more foward position than the ca box... probably what he means
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Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Sat, 04 December 2004 11:24
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The motor placement, as in any involved conversion is a compromise. But the motor position worked out very well really. It sits low engouh that you have to shave the top off the RHS steering rack bracket and give the sump a few taps (theres sure to be a WST for this). But this is a small price to pay for a low motor (and hence better handling etc)
As for the shifter, if you use the CA box, then you need to cut away a small part of the brace that runs across the floor. (The brace the front holes of the sets bolt to).
If you use the RB20 box, its shifter is about 45 mm further forward. You still have to extend the factory shifter hole backwards a bit, but the brace is well clear.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Sat, 04 December 2004 12:32
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So the engine could still hit the steering bracket ? would the engineer still pass a steering rack bracket with the metal removed ? . So if thats the case it will not work with a sr , since the sump is larger and alloy {no hitting with a hammer there} is the stock subframe being used ? is this modified ? wouldn't the engine sit on angle towards the rear of the car ? causing oil delivery problem {wheres statts?} Also this make the gearbox angled , causing incorrect tailshaft to diff alignment ?
Sorry for the questions , just i moved my engine into my coversion 10 or more times for postion check , and have since moved it three times . I was wondering if someone worked it out correctly first time , if so that would be great for the guys down here starting there sr projects .
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Sat, 04 December 2004 15:32
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this is the kind of helpful info im looking for!
so say i have the half cut, and this conversion kit, just roughly in point form, what else needs to be done to make the motor fit?
is this the same kit simon used???
thanks!
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Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Sun, 05 December 2004 01:32
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The engine barely touches when static, the mods are really to give a solid 10mm or so clearance. The mounts I use with the kit are a 37mm urethane mounts with 10mm studs. The kelpro book says they suit Ford, Rover. They are very stiff and are a good generic count for oddball conversion work so I use them a lot.
I don't see how an engineer could fail the car because of 3 mm steel removed from a bracket. If this was an issue then I guess the sump could be moved a few mm further.
SR20 will not work with these mounts as they have different boss layout on the block... very different.
The engine/gearbos angle is close to perfect (hence the sump mods). The factory tilt of the CA is retained. I don't see oil supply being a problem.
I had the first one I did in and out many times too. But I was very happy with the result so decided it was worth offering a kit. I may do one for SR20 as well.
45aken, I'm not sure what simon used. I think he bought the motor already set up for AE86. A little too involved to go into eveything required. I may doa webpage soon to support the kit, and will try and put some guidelines up there. As with anything like this, it's the fiddly stuff that takes the time and hence costs the money. The idea of the kit is that if you have half an idea how to do the fiddly stuff, then with this the motor is bolted in and that's a big start. If you can't do the little stuff (source/fit suitable radiator, move battery, plumb intercooler, upgrade fuel system, throttle cable, measure/order tail shaft etc. etc) then you have no choice but to pay someone or hope you have capable friends
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Mon, 06 December 2004 01:45
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i can do all the little things involved in a conversion, was just wondering if there were any "catches" about the conversion.
so basically to get the motor in you just need to shave 3-5mm off the RHS steering rack bracket. (and move battery etc)is there any problems withthe shifter position inside the car?
thanks.
looks like it's time to source a CA front cut.
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Mon, 06 December 2004 13:44
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Well that is funny did'nt have to shave anyhting off the rack mount or touch the sump! the transmission tunnel will have to be modified because the shifter sits about 100mm further back. ive heard about the rb20 box thing but the bolt pattern for the ca bellhousing aint the same! you will need a new tailshaft which is very short. go for one piece and if you have the bucks which i don't, get an aluminium shaft.
I did most of the work myself at a mates workshop!
I cant give you pics for i have no camera but am more than willing to give you as much info as i can.
mick!
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Location:
Toronto, Downtown
Registered:
September 2004
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Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Mon, 06 December 2004 14:03
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Um I think you missed my point GTMick. I can also make the engine fit without modifying anything if I wanted to. The idea of shaving the bracket is to make the engine position better by getting the centre of gravity lower.
As for the RB box, the bolt pattern is different youre right. TGhats why you have to put the RB rear section (with internals) on a CA18 bell housing.
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 03:22
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thanks alot GTmick.
where abouts are you?
guess i'll be talking to you soon!
also what diff did you use? (im guessing the standard one cant handle that kind of power)
thanks
Ps. 4agte -who cares, make you own thread about this.
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Registered:
December 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 07:20
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ur in brissie arnt u anthony? if so i'd be interested in one of those kits if there still available? got a ae71 lined up for it
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 11:29
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i used rb20 engine mounts, a grinder and a welder and made my own mounts, it sits low and fat back and misses the rack by 1.5 mm, the turbo also misses the frame by fuck all also.
just got the engine running again, fresh rebuild and its bloody awesome. spins 4th gear NO worries on 1 bar of boost with an rb20 roller turbo.
if you need info on what wires to connect to sprinter loom, pm me or steve-ae86
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 11:30
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i use a T series diff with TRD 2 way. no issues there
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 13:12
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Hey simon what clutch master and slave combo did you use?
And on the t series thing how many have you gone through? the reason im asking this is that the t series is an open wheeler and im not sure to lay out the $$$ for a trd unit or mod a f series and go the detroit true trac path.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 13:14
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T series + Aftermarket LSD = proven winner
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 13:33
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Yeah, i understand the trd unit is a good thing but if you are using the car everyday and have well lets say over the 160rwkw on tap and drive it like you hate it. i wanna know before i shell out over $1000 dollars for a lsd centre.
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 14:10
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what kind of price am i looking at for the tailshaft???
4th gear no worries huh? 
i was just going to throw a bigger turbo, got a front mount already, EBC and obsivously a 3"exh.
i'll call for the wiring diagram when the time comes, thanks alot for the help. also is there any problems with the instruments (speed/tacho etc) with the CA18det?
whats the advantages of using the RB series gearbox???
4th gear no worries.............there's my ambition!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 14:47
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how fun will it be with 160rwkw and a single spinner though?
you'll just paint a line on the road everytime you wanna race someone
dont be a stinge and fork out some money for a lsd
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Tue, 07 December 2004 14:55
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tacho and speedo wont work
i know for sure the CA box uses a electrical signal and the RB box probably does too. im pretty sure an instrument shop can fix i up for you with a box with electrical drive to run the stock speedo
the tacho wont work because it runs coilpacks. easy fix with an aftermarket tacho or you could try getting the stock one to work with some electronics.
rb box is stronger and shifter position is slightly more forward so you dont have to cut into the cross brace (as you would with a CA box)
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 08 December 2004 01:10
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man of course im going to get new diff and a LSD, but getting the motor etc in the car and running is a first.
if i start with a CA gearbox, cut the cross brace, but then 3months down the track blow the box, can i still fit an RB box? (im pretty sure i'd be able too right?)
thanks
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 08 December 2004 03:56
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the yokes are the same between the ca and rb boxes
you might have a problem with the length though
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Registered:
July 2002
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 08 December 2004 04:48
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Tail shaft length will be the same. Also, most RB boxes have mechanical speedo drive and guess what... its the same thread and drive shape as AE86.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 08 December 2004 08:43
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ah k cool
how about the input shaft length?
im pretty sure the rb box has a longer shaft and would potrude out too far with a ca bellhousing?
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Location:
NSW.south coast.Drifting
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: CA18DET+AE86 help!
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Wed, 08 December 2004 08:52
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sounds ok then.
will the shifter position inside the cabin be any hassle? eg. too close to the dash etc.
simon-how much of a difference is there with the RB30 turbo and what is your approximate power output at the wheels?
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