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NAMDAMAMI
Occasional Poster


Location:
England
Registered:
November 2004
AE86 into TA22 Mon, 17 January 2005 18:08 Go to next message
Hi,

This follows on from a previous topic regarding fitment of rack & pinion steering to a Celca TA22 (and the KE70 conversion for an RA28).

It seems to me there is a striking similarity between an AE86 chassis and a TA22 chassis.

I know from my contacts over here that I can use AE86 stub-axels to give me an easy vented disc conversion. I'm guessing from this there must be very little difference (if any) with the steering knuckles and track control arms.

I also understand that an AE86 rear axel will bolt straight into a TA22 to give me LSD and rear discs.

AE86 uprated poly bushes for the rear upper & lower lateral rods fit a TA22.

Whiteline Suspensions' Roll Centre Adjust Kit & Adjustable Panhard Rod quote the same part numbers for both models.

I have read the Todd Stevens "4AG into TA22" article and he states -

"Oh, and the sump? the stock sprinter sump clears the cross member beautifully, as if it was made to be there. This may be due to there being very little change in the suspension setup on these early RWD Toyota coupes"

and -

"The mounts on the factory TA22 cross member bolt up directly to the T50 Sprinter Gearbox and when bolted to the engine, we made it so that the stock TA22 cross member holding the T50 gearbox lined up with a set of bolt holes already in place in the chassis"

and -

"For the speedo drive, the existing TA22 speedo drive is a direct swap into the later model Sprinter T50 gearbox".

I recently had my head under an AE86 and noticed that the steering column comes through the bulkhead at the same low position as my TA22.

So I'm thinking -

If I can make the AE86 engine cross-member fit my TA22, I'm sure I could marry the existing steering column to the rack and pinion without too much difficuly.
The 4AG bolts straight in (hopefully matching those existing holes for the gearbox) and voila ! easy conversion ??

OK, reality trip here. I know nothing is THAT easy, but it does seem like a bloody good idea.

I've been offered a rot-box AE86, so all the parts I need are waiting for me.

You seem like a knowledgeable bunch, so would apprieciate your comments.

Has this been done before ? Any reason why it wouldn't work ? Am I dreaming ?

Thanks in advance, Rob Smile
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ae95
Forums Junkie


I supported Toymods

Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
Re: AE86 into TA22 Mon, 17 January 2005 20:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
im fairly certain the ae86 disc rear end will not bolt into the ta22. different mounting points.
altho i know you can bolt the carrier into your T series to give you an lsd

the ta22 and ae86 chassis' arent THAT similar
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ozboy
Regular


Location:
Sydney
Registered:
February 2004
Re: AE86 into TA22 Tue, 18 January 2005 02:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the ae86 diff does bolt it

Im after a rack and pinion setup for my ta22 also ill be keeping my eyes on this thread cheers
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munki
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
October 2002
Re: AE86 into TA22 Tue, 18 January 2005 02:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
there is a noticable difference between the knuckles of early toyota cars. I have had an ta22 ra23 ke 30 coupe, ke 70 all next to each other and they are all different.

however the bolt spacing between these (exc except for the ke30 i cant remember) were the same so thats probably what you mean in regards to an easy vented disc conversion. perhaps a xA6x model celica however they are too long for the corolla.

in regards with the urethane bushing part numbers just because they have the same part number doesnt mean the rear end will bolt up. Several rear wheel drive toyotas use the exact same bushes which is something i found out when i went to purchase mine.

in regards to the 4age into ta22 just because the have the same sump configuration doesnt mean that they will have the same crossmember. they may be a similar shape but have fun making it fit.

the gearbox is going to bolt up because they are both t50 gearboxes. Im not exactly sure but i would presume that the a style belhousing would bolt to the celica t50 gearbox. However maybe they have different input/output splines so u need a sprinter box

without having seen a sprinter crossmember i can make an educated guess that they will not fit without a great deal of work and it would be easier to adapt a rack onto your existing crossmember.

Hope this helps

Daniel
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NAMDAMAMI
Occasional Poster


Location:
England
Registered:
November 2004
Re: AE86 into TA22 Tue, 18 January 2005 07:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
munki wrote on Tue, 18 January 2005 13:52

there is a noticable difference between the knuckles of early toyota cars. I have had an ta22 ra23 ke 30 coupe, ke 70 all next to each other and they are all different.

however the bolt spacing between these (exc except for the ke30 i cant remember) were the same so thats probably what you mean in regards to an easy vented disc conversion. perhaps a xA6x model celica however they are too long for the corolla.


Yes, I'm talking about using the whole front strut assembly but changing the top mount. Therefore the hub, disc rotor and calliper is all AE86. Same wheel fitment, so no problem there either - I will be doing this regardless.

munki wrote on Tue, 18 January 2005 13:52

in regards with the urethane bushing part numbers just because they have the same part number doesnt mean the rear end will bolt up. Several rear wheel drive toyotas use the exact same bushes which is something i found out when i went to purchase mine.


The part numbers were in reference to the Whiteline Products, an example of some commonality. The bushing is something I have done on a friends car, I am not suggesting this means the AE86 rear will bolt straight in; that is information I have been given by UK owners which I understand to be correct, and so far, judgeing by the replys, something still to be debated.

munki wrote on Tue, 18 January 2005 13:52

in regards to the 4age into ta22 just because the have the same sump configuration doesnt mean that they will have the same crossmember. they may be a similar shape but have fun making it fit.


Again, I am not suggesting they have the same crossmember. I was just pointing out Todd's comment that this may be due to there being very little change in the suspension setup on these early RWD Toyota coupes. However, I am hoping the width across the chassis rails will be similar. The standard dimension of the TA22 engine cross-member, according to my Toyota chassis repair manual shows 726.6mm between the bolt holes.

munki wrote on Tue, 18 January 2005 13:52

the gearbox is going to bolt up because they are both t50 gearboxes. Im not exactly sure but i would presume that the a style belhousing would bolt to the celica t50 gearbox. However maybe they have different input/output splines so u need a sprinter box


Thanks, my intention would be to use the AE86 gearbox. Even though I have a 5 speed fitted in my 22; it's pretty shagged.

munki wrote on Tue, 18 January 2005 13:52

without having seen a sprinter crossmember i can make an educated guess that they will not fit without a great deal of work and it would be easier to adapt a rack onto your existing crossmember.


I guess this is the main question. Can any one tell me the standard dimension of the AE86 engine cross-member between the bolt holes.

munki wrote on Tue, 18 January 2005 13:52

Hope this helps
Daniel


Thanks very much Smile

[Updated on: Wed, 19 January 2005 23:50]

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vin91
Regular


Location:
Darwin
Registered:
August 2003
Re: AE86 into TA22 Fri, 21 January 2005 09:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Just interested

What would be required to fit aE86 Front Disks to a TA22 Celica as stated, Using the whole Strut?

What is the Real Benifit's of These Disks
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NAMDAMAMI
Occasional Poster


Location:
England
Registered:
November 2004
Re: AE86 into TA22 Fri, 21 January 2005 14:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
vin91 wrote on Fri, 21 January 2005 20:23


What would be required to fit aE86 Front Disks to a TA22 Celica as stated, Using the whole Strut?


The whole strut but retaining the TA22 top mount. This bolts directly to the 22's steering knuckle. Use stock AE86 hub, disc rotor and caliper. You can then use AE86 damper inserts too. I'll be building mine with coil overs.

vin91 wrote on Fri, 21 January 2005 20:23

What is the Real Benifit's of These Disks


Vented disc and better pad material choice (in this country)
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vin91
Regular


Location:
Darwin
Registered:
August 2003
Re: AE86 into TA22 Sat, 22 January 2005 01:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Talk about Impossible. Just went around all the wreckers in Darwin and Found Only 1 wrecker that has them and He wants $700.

I spouse I will still get them just have to save a Lot Longer
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Hodgie
Regular


Location:
brisbane
Registered:
February 2004
Re: AE86 into TA22 Sat, 22 January 2005 12:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sorry for this useless post. Just want to keep tabs on this thread.
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silly
Occasional Poster


Location:
s.a
Registered:
May 2004
icon7.gif  Re: AE86 into TA22 Sun, 23 January 2005 06:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
i brought a ae86 4ageu jdm halfcut and did the engine conversion into a ta22 myself. pm me if interested. i also have front struts left over if ure interested and other sprinter bits.
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NAMDAMAMI
Occasional Poster


Location:
England
Registered:
November 2004
Re: AE86 into TA22 Fri, 03 June 2005 16:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hi,

Thought I'd update on this matter.

The guy with the rot box AE86 vanished off the face of the earth so it's taken me a while to source the parts I need.

I now have the AE86 engine cross-member, steering rack and T50 gearbox.

Cross-member measurements as follows:

Transverse distance between rear chassis leg bolt holes =
AE86 760mm / TA22 705mm (27.5mm out either side)

Transverse distance between front chassis leg bolt holes =
AE86 775mm / TA22 726.6 (24.3mm out either side)

Longitudinal distance between front & rear holes =
AE86 140mm / TA22 114mm (13mm out)

Note that TA22 measurments taken from Toyota repair manual, AE86 measurments taken by me with tape (so approximate).

So it won't bolt in (well I knew it wouldn't really, wishful thinking on my part), but could it be possible to make it fit? It would mean the AE86 item would overhang into the inner wheel well and may cause clearance issues. I'm also concerned about where the track control arm pick up is positioned in relation to the TA22 item. It's likely the track control arm will also be pushed out and then I'll have problems getting the anti-roll bar to fit.

I need a spare TA22 cross-member for comparison, but now am thinking its a better idea to make one cross-member from the two. Chatted this idea through with an engineer friend of mine and he reckons it shouldn't be too difficult.

The steering rack from the AE86 is probably a bit wide too, but I should be able to shorten the track rod ends. I'm not sure what effect this will have on the steering wheel lock though.

Thoughts and comments welcome.


PS - This will be a slow burner project. All effort this summer is trying to get my 260 back on the road. Cheers.




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Purple_Beasty
Regular


Location:
New Zealand
Registered:
May 2002
Re: AE86 into TA22 Sat, 04 June 2005 06:07 Go to previous message
I would think the AE86 crossmember would be very difficult to adapt to the 22. I transplanted a TA63 Carina crossmember to my KP60 Starlet but the measurements were a lot closer (less then 5mm front rear and less then 10mm per side left to right). Still took a bit of work and a couple of spacers for the nuts to sit flat, very surprisingly the steering column bolted straight to the rack with the Starlet end attached.

Callum
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