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Registered: December 2004
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Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 11:47
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I have recently purchased a nice black NA JDM SW20 MR2. Since my purchase, I have become increasingly interested in the inner working of cars. I have done an insane amount of reading, mainly on the Internet, on pretty much anything to do with cars. I have read a lot of work logs, and other web sites (using my common sense to quickly disregard the non-credible ones) and have found the Toyota engines to be the most interesting to me (obviously bias comes in to play here but there seems to be very few car manufacturers that make such elegant engines, at a - comparatively - acceptable price.)
Anyway, being a geek at heart, my thirst for information cannot stop at reading about how other people do it. I want to do it myself! Now, the problem with this is I have near zero practical experience on any kind of car maintenance or modification. I also have no tools, and at the moment next to no money (In fact, at the moment, even if we forget about my car loan, I still owe money )
So, how does one quench ones thirst for said knowledge, without diving further into debt? Well, I visited a wreckers the other day with my father. He was going to get a couple of bits for my sisters car, and I came along to have a poke about. While we were there, he gave me this idea. Why don't I buy a shoddy engine from a wreckers (one that would most definitely be unusable in its current condition) for next to nothing, sit it in my garage and go crazy with it. Take it apart, see how everything works, and then put it back together.
Now, I know it won't work when I put it back together – an operational engine is 'phase two' of my master plan. The purpose of this exercise is simply to learn about the inside of an engine first hand – without the risk of ruining a decent one
Would this exercise be beneficial to me? My long term goal (when I am financially able to do so) is to buy an older corolla (probably an ae82) and strip it back completely, rebuilding it from the ground up with a 4age, doing as much of the work myself as is humanly possible. The advantage to this whole exercise is that I could probably get a 16v 4age (and at the very least a 4afe) from the wreckers, meaning that when I come to rebuild the 4age that I actually want to use in a car, it is familiar to me.
My long term goal came about because it seems that there is a hell of a lot more information out there on the 4age than any other engine of its type. I initially started out looking for information on my engine (3sge) and found next to none. I figure the 4age is a good engine for me to start with because of this abundance of information.
Whilst my long term goal may alter slightly in that it may turn out to be an aw11 that wraps itself around my 4age, I don't think the engine will ever change – at least for this first project. From all I have read it seems to be one hell of an elegant engine, and for some reason appeals to me a hell of a lot more than any other.
So, what do you all think? Is taking apart a shot engine worth my time and money? Can a newbie such as myself complete a project like the one defined by my 'long term goal'? Or, am I just dreaming?
Does anyone have any other suggestions?
Thanks for your time
[Updated on: Mon, 31 January 2005 12:08]
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I supported Toymods
Location: Epping, Sydney
Registered: May 2002
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 11:58
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absolutely!
you can learn a suprising amount with an engine manual and just stripping the thing down. depending on the age of the engine, you'll learn different things.
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Registered: December 2004
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 12:10
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draven wrote on Mon, 31 January 2005 22:58 | absolutely!
you can learn a suprising amount with an engine manual and just stripping the thing down. depending on the age of the engine, you'll learn different things.
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Excellent!!!
Is there 4age specific manuals or would say an ae82 twincam workshop manual give me enough information to completely understand what it is that I just removed from the engine?
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Registered: May 2003
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 13:23
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Hey Muzzi,
Much much respect dude! Glad to see you wanting to learn more about cars. I wish I could too but hardly any support and most of my car mates are rich would pay mechanics to do most things for them except taking wheels of.
But hopefully soon in the future I will start going to cruises or just meets since i hate crusing with fully SICK cars to meet some more toymodders and ask for some help.
All the best
Eddy
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Location: Potts Point, Sydney
Registered: October 2003
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 13:29
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Definitely do it dude...helps alot to do it 1st hand
Im pretty sure there's a wreck out there somewhere. You could try rebuild the engine if you wanna take the risk, but all new parts, take it apart and put it back together with the good stuff
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I supported Toymods
Location: Epping, Sydney
Registered: May 2002
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 13:33
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dimmy - that's a project best left for when he knows what he's doing... you dont want to do a full engine rebuild as your very first mechanical project
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Location: Castle Hill, Sydney
Registered: February 2004
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Location: Melbourne
Registered: May 2002
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 23:08
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Ahh tools... the hidden cost of the conversion, that the mind says "I can re-use them, that justifies the expense!"
I guess a good quality 1/2" drive socket would be an excellent start. I decided to go with a Kincrome 39pce metric + af.
Engine Stands are around $80-100 for a basic one.
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Location: Epping, Sydney
Registered: April 2003
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Mon, 31 January 2005 23:37
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I have a 3SGE you can have for $50
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Registered: May 2002
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Tue, 01 February 2005 00:06
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You will learn a heap rebuilding an engine, just take your time with it
First thing I ever did with cars was to do a full rebuild on a 2TG and fit it to my KE38 corolla. My rebuild consisted of new 40 thou OS pistons, o-rings, gaskets, bearings seals, timing chain etc etc. All surfaces were machined and the head was reconditioned.
The whole engine was cleaned, painted, polished and when finished it looked awesome sitting in the engine stand
The most satisfying moment though is when it fires to life and actually works!
My first engine rebuild was pretty successful, I owned the engine for nearly 100 000km and it never missed a beat, never leaked a drop of coolant or oil and sounded tough (twin 40mm sidedraft carbies). It has since been sold and is still going strong in a celica.
I am keen to do another engine rebuild when time and money permit (or if something ever dies and a rebuild is forced upon me).
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Location: Tassie
Registered: October 2003
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Tue, 01 February 2005 01:28
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I know it's not a toyota but i was given a 253 V8 block and worked on that by myself geting as much info as i could then threw it into a 1968 landcruiser and drove that around untill we moved house.
this was all when i was 13/14.
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Location: Toronto, Downtown
Registered: September 2004
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Tue, 01 February 2005 02:01
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inertia wrote on Tue, 01 February 2005 10:08 | Ahh tools... the hidden cost of the conversion, that the mind says "I can re-use them, that justifies the expense!"
I guess a good quality 1/2" drive socket would be an excellent start. I decided to go with a Kincrome 39pce metric + af.
Engine Stands are around $80-100 for a basic one.
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agreed tools are an investment u pay for them once and use them many times.
I have a kinchrome 1/2 and 1/4 drive set they are a great budget socket set they have taken countless abuse from me including kicking jumping stomping on th rachet to remove bolts.
I dont beleive you could get much better value for money although you could get snap on but ud have to sell your first born for some of their stuff.
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Location: Victoria
Registered: May 2002
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Tue, 01 February 2005 03:39
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My first (and only so far) engine rebuilding experience was my motorbike engine, i did a top end rebuild inc piston/rings/overbore and a general head cleap up with all new gaskets and valve stem seals
Best way is to just do it :0 i got a copy of a factory workshop manual which was practically "the idiots step by step guide to rebuilding ur engine"
If you want to lean about cars i suggest look around for a shitter to play with and use ur MR2 as a daily u can get some realy cheap cars if u look hard enough and willing to do some work on the engine to get em going
A for learning how an engine works and whats in there, as much as u read, most of it will never make proper sence untill u start pulling shit apart and seeing it for real (as opposed to diagrams)
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Location: c'town, NSW
Registered: May 2002
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Tue, 01 February 2005 04:33
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another suggestion.
dont just stop at the edge of your driveway.
come out to toymods meetings, talk to people and maybe help out with other peoples projects. Lend a hand and you'll learn heaps!
the majority of toymods club members are do-it-yourself-ers and once you start networking it wont take long before your confident doing all sorts of things to the car. Not to mention any tips and tricks u pick up along the way.
i feel that toymods promoting the idea of DIY as part of being a toyota enthusiast has been one of the reasons for the success of the club.
dont underestimate the power of other peoples enthusiasm to inspire you...... Well i hope its our enthusiasm.....unless we have some sort of kissing disease ......you'll probably wake up one day a die hard toyota fanatic looking to do all sorts of crazy toyota projects.
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Registered: December 2004
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Tue, 01 February 2005 20:28
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Hi All,
Thanks for all your responses!
RobST162, I am interested, I will send you a PM soon Great start!
What would I be looking at for tools? Like I don't want to buy a cheap set that is going to be letting me down every 5 minutes. But at the same time, I don't want to spend a fortune! What tools do I need to complete this task?
Everyone on this forum seems to think that the pre-engine rebuild rebuild is a good thing However, there is one person on another forum (who I have a great deal of respect for) that says I may gain a false sense of confidence rebuilding an engine that I cannot see working. He says that there is no way of checking that everything was put back together properly, and this may give me a false sense of confidence for when I do the real thing. I may do the same thing wrong things with my proper engine and mess the whole thing up! He sees it as a waste of time and money and told me to jump in head first with the real thing.
Comments?
Rob_RA40 - I have already been to one toymods meet, although I was late too it and didn't take much of an active role I was just an observer at the time. I love cruising too, and plan on attending every toymods cruise starting now
inertia - how much would a 'Kincrome 39pce' set cost me?
Anyway, thanks for all your comments and suggestions
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Location: c'town, NSW
Registered: May 2002
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Re: Newbie Engine Rebuild
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Tue, 01 February 2005 21:28
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seeing as tho u can pull apart 90% of ANY toyota with a
8mm 10mm 12mm 14mm 17mm 19mm spanner/socket
an ok spanner and socket set is a good start.
by ok i mean a cheapie one made in japan/china and has a lifetime garauntee so if u break it u can have it replaced no questions asked.
then a couple of screw drivers and pliers.
then u can supplament the socket set with extension bars, uni joints, long sockets as u need them
ohh and take a trip down to your local scrap metal place and find yourself a good long fat arse glen the dong poo-hymenating steel pole/bar.
also engine stands are cheap $50 - $80 check ebay
HTH
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