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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Fri, 13 December 2002 13:08
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Hi all,
Gathering info for a 3K rebuild for a KE20 rally car. To stay within the CAMS guidelines we have to stay under 1400cc, while still retaining the standard block. I'd like to use a 4K crank and rod setup to get the extra 124cc from the crank stroke (3K: 1166cc v's 4k: 1290cc), Can anyone confirm that this will "bolt in" to the 3K block?
By using the 4K crank, my calculations lead me to believe that I could bore the block up to 120" to wind up with a displacement of 1396.999627cc (!). Not worried about pistons at the moment, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.
So how far has anyone ever bored the 3K out to? I don't assume I'll get all 120"(3.048mm on top of the standard 75mm bore), but then a 5K has a bore of 80.5mm, can anyone tell me if they share the same block as a 3K/4K just bored out, or are they a different block?
I'm not really interested in one off cranks, or expensive options - if the engine lunches itself (did two this year, fortunately they were stockers!), I want to come out with a respectable repair bill! Any other opinions or suggestions are warmly welcomed, also interested to hear other's thoughts on the whole displacement verses revability conundrum!
Will do all the given performance rebuild tricks (balancing, blueprinting, ...), more interested in determining the bore, stroke, crank, rod, combination with some thought to pistons.
Thanks, Clint!
[Updated on: Thu, 27 March 2003 10:01]
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Location:
Brisbane / Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Fri, 13 December 2002 21:27
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A 3K block can be bored 4mm or 0.160" - That's how far we went with our old race engine & the Tosco pistons.
I'm pretty sure that a 4K crank won't go into a 3K block though ... the rods will be too close to the skirts.
IF you use a 4K block, they're thinner walled and so not very strong. Everyone that tried using them in the Sports 1300 class had them crack around the expansion plug holes on the cam side.
If you use a 5K head gasket, that'll take the extra bore.
Have a look around for VW or motorbike pistons, there's plenty that fit.
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Toymods Social Secretary
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sat, 14 December 2002 14:59
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wow!! People worked a 3K... there's hope for me yet! 
i find this very interesting! Hows well does the boring improve power/torque?
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sat, 14 December 2002 17:41
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Thanks Bill,
Assume you mean the rods will hit the cylinder shirt not the piston skirt? Does anyone know if it is possible to modify the bottom of the cylinder lip to clear the 4K rods, or use another set of rods from a different motor? Or what the differences between the 3K and 4K blocks are besides the 4K being thinner?
How far can a 3K be bored before it will hit the water jacket (thinking about boring a stuffed block to find out unless anyone can supply the info)?
If we were to use a 3K and bore it 160", that still only gives us 1296.1cc, not that we're greedy but we want the extra 100cc at the moment!
Clint!
Ps: yes WITZL, some of us are bound by CAMS guidelines, so we make do with twin 40mm webered, cammed, comped, and balanced old stuff that regularly sees 8000rpm!!! Real pain when you brake the alternator mount though - at least the water's warm enough for a cuppa while you sit around for the rest of the day!
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Location:
New Zealand
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sat, 14 December 2002 20:43
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Just thinking a little laterally here.
What if you get a 5k block to start with for the big bore then offset grind a 4k or 3k crank to bring your capacity down to where you want. Getting most of your capacity through the bore rather than your stroke should allow it to really rev out. I always found the 3k motor revved heaps better than the 4k, due to its shorter stroke.
Callum
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Location:
Brisbane / Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sun, 15 December 2002 01:05
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WITZL - It was a pure race engine, so you couldn't compare it to a road engine. It made about 135hp and ran to nearly 9,000rpm though. Pretty flat below about 5700rpm!
Clint, no, the side of the block. We used Datsun 180B conrod bolts and had to beat out four little bumps in the sump to stop them hitting the sides of the 3K block. With a longer stroke 4K crank, I reckon it'd have to hit the sides of the block, let alone the sump. 
I'd be pretty newvous about going more than 4mm oversize on the K blocks. I don't know of anyone that's done it, but there's probably a good reason for it.
The reason we used the 3K crank and 4mm oversize was because the rules require a 1300cc maximum engine. If you want 1400cc max, then I'd go for a 4K and go as far as you have to with the pistons to make that.
But as Purple Beasty wrote, perhaps a 5K block would be a better thing as they're a lot stronger and the bore is pretty right for starters.
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Tue, 17 December 2002 12:54
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yeah me again  not at work now so i can type lots
i have a 3k with no head and a bare 4k block in my garage, between the bores is a 1/2" (12.5mm) at the thinnest point. the gap to the surrounding water jackets is 6/16" (9.5mm) and about 9.0mm (hard to tell, cheap shitty plastic measuring calipers) to the water passage between the pushrods and the bores
i'm going 60 thou over on my own 4k project, bigger valves and tosco-spec head, balanced and bulletproof everything. but this will be a street motor for my daily driver ke35. if i ever get a cams license and feel like driving to brisbane every month i might compete at some level but i doubt it, i just like learning and building
if you go to stewart ford's webpage - http://drive.to/oldcorollas - there is a copy of the TOSCO manual for 3k motors which tells you in great detail how to build a 1293cc (4mm overbore) racing motor using twin dellorto dhla40s (TOSCO were the predecessors to TRD. TOSCO stands for TOyota Sports COrner)
if you download the pdf (he has it in html as well) there are very specific head porting diagrams, as well as several camshaft grinds (see table 13). its a fair bet this is the best way to port the head. i'm not sure if it uses a bigport head or not (probably does), there's about 3mm difference between smallport and bigport, bigports are somewhat rare but not impossible to find. they come off 3K-B motors from Sprinters, usually they accompany twincarbs due to the water jackets in the twincarb manifold. smalls have a plate on the back of the head (sometimes a hose, sometimes blocked off) whereas bigs have a welsch plug
myself and some of the other members of oldcorollas have compiled a list of many cam grinds for K motors, you can find them in this folder in the oldcorollas yahoo group files - http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldcorollas/fi les/dyno/ - which i think should be accessible without a group login. if not, chuck me an email (jamie@superjamie.net) and i'll send them all over to you
the most powerful cam tested under dyno2000 was the wade 169. this made 180-odd bhp in the tosco 3k, and 141bhp in a stock 3k. these are somewhat optimistic figures (maybe it expects perfect air-fuel mixture and 100% volumetric efficiency) but give you a good indication of whats better than what else. none of the waggot or tighe cams have been put thru that software (i'm trying to get a copy to do it myself. i have a waggot 212 in my garage and i want to know if its any good for my 4k project)
stewart overported his first head and ruptured an exhaust port wall, so he cut the head up to see the wall thicknesses to prevent us all making the same mistake again. the photos are in the Engine section of his webpage. just click Engine and scroll way down in the right hand frame, very very useful stuff
at the moment stewart's got a 4k with 3k bigport head and jaycar hei in a ke15, its making 42.7kw at the wheels (his dyno sheet is in the yahoo group files as well, somewhere) which means roughly 100bhp. he's away in america at the moment, and is coming back with $333 worth of megasquirt gear (google it, its a diy efi kit) and will rig up something with camira pump, rails, sensors, etc when he gets back
he's using a weber idf 34/34 downdraft at the moment, main jets are 150/155. i'm using a 32/36 dfv, aka holley 5200, on my stock 3k - main jets 125/150, airs 165/150, needs to be 180/165 to stop mid-throttle stumble and backfire. the stock aisan carb has shitty shitty mixture qualities, make it the first thing you replace
another mate around here has ke30 with a balanced and blueprinted 60-thou 4k with smallport head and a single dellorto dhla40 running 5k electronic ignition (internal ignitor) and thermo fan, i dunno how much power its making (hes never dyno'd or run a quarter) but it could pull away from my old 105bhp bmw fairly fast
if you like, join the oldcorollas yahoo group, several of the guys there run hillclimb/autocross/motorkhana cars and lots of the people have been generally playing with K motors for years, its a nice friendly group with lots of good info and skill levels from beginner to expert. as one could guess from my signature, i compile the faq
need to stop typing and sleep now
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sat, 21 December 2002 06:22
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Thanks Guys.
Tending to lean towards using the 3K block as the CAMS guidelines are erroneous as to what we are and aren't allowed to do (and getting a straight answer out of them is asking Skase!). The car is also homologated with a 3K motor so that saves a bit of paperwork there too. Induction will be through a set of 40mm sidedraught Webers on one of the big port heads we have in the shed. Porting will be to restricted to what we are allowed as dictated by the homologation papers too.
Has anyone had much experience with the 5K electronic dizzy's in a performance application - will have it regraphed to suit the big revs if necessary?
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sat, 21 December 2002 08:45
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ONE of the bigport heads? does this mean you have more? particularly one that you are interested in selling to me? email me if so!!!
where are you getting the manifold and linkages for the webers for? i'm hunting for the same for my twin dellorto dhla40s, new they're about $350
you should be able to use the 5k elec dizzy just as it is, but there will definately be advantages to having it regraphed for your motor. go into toyota dealer service and ask to look at the factory service manuals for a lite-ace 5k or 7k, it should have some grahping tables in it somewhere, i know my corolla/starlet 3k toyota engine manual does
beware that there are 2 kinds of electric dizzy for K motors, one with internal ignitor (5k and 7K) and one that needs an external ignitor (4k-u)
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Tue, 07 January 2003 23:01
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Ok, quick update for those who have replied, are interested, or for the archive infomation!
We stripped both a 4K and a 3K last night, and had a fiddle! We took the 4K crank annd rods with pistons still attached, and threw the rest of the motor back in the shed. Next we put the 3K bare block on the work bench upside down (ie, with the sump on the top!). We placed the 4K crank in the 3K block to find some light binding on the original locating holes at the front and back of the block (used to mount the block into a jig to drill all the holes in the head of the block). This doesn't really concern us - it will be easily relieved to clear the crank.
Next we placed a 3K rod and piston on the 4K crank. In full standard form the piston skirt just fouled the counterweight on the crank. This could be avoided by machining the piston skirt, or reducing the mass of the counterweight (crank lightning, knife edging, ... anyone?!!!). Both the 3K and 4K were found to have a full floating style Gudgeon pin - we took the snap rings off and removed the pistons from both connecting rods.
We then placed the 3K rod back onto the 4K crank, and placed it in the bore as it would sweep during revolution. It was found to foul the bottom of the piston skirt on both sides (there was a factory relief cast into the block at both contact points). Next we placed the 4K rod on the 4K crank in the 3K block and again spun it through the crank sweep. Again it fouled but not as much as the 3K rod/4K crank combination. We will also have to ease the block around the sump mounting face as the connecting rod bolts only just clear. At this stage we pulled the 4K block out again and started looking for differences. Most noticable was the fact that the 4K block had a higher deck height of approx 10mm (will measure this properly unless anyone can give us the exact difference?). Also of note was the fact that both the 3K and 4K pistons were identical in visual appearance (the 3K were however a set of aftermarket pistons, can anyone confirm they are the same piston?).
So some block relieving to take place and some more in depth study into pistons, with revised gudgeon pin heights.
More on this later!
Clint!
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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Tue, 07 January 2003 23:33
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Yes the 3 & 4k pistons are exactly the same
I did measure the hieght difference in blocks once & i think it is 10mm
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Tue, 07 January 2003 23:48
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the gudgeon piston is offset 1mm towards the camshaft side
are you able to weigh the bare blocks? i need to find bellhousing bolts before i can strip my 3k, the local unhelpful bolt barn just said "whats a bellhousing? we wouldnt have anything like that". sure. spose i could always just turn it upsidedown with no head
this is great research, keep up the good work!!!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Thu, 09 January 2003 13:52
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Ok, more questions.
Bill: Why did you use the 180B conrod bolts? Were they easier to clearance than the standard K series bolts. We're tempted to put a set of ARP rod bolts in for their cheap insurance factor, however the consensus seem to be that the standard gear will happily see 8000rpm, and we don't intend on going any further.
Jamie: Tell me more about the Gudgeon pin offset and the effect it has in the motor, and how those factors will be affected by changing pistons to something not originally designed for a K motor? Will weigh the bare blocks for you on the weekend if I get a chance and let you know the 4K engine number so you might determine it's age. Tell me more about the different 4K blocks with and without the extra ribbing. It's on the inlet side right? describe it's location and appearance and I'll have a look for it on the 4K block we now have spare?! Go back to the bolt man and ask for metric fine thread bolts (think they'll be m10x1.5 or m12x1.5), in whatever length you need. Bellhousing bolts wont be long enough to go through the engine stand mount and have enough left to thread up safely. Take a sample to confirm the thread sizes.
Finally, for all those following the thread, also see "3K/4K Block Strength" thread in tech and conversions, by Superjamie. Does anyone know if we can link these two threads together as they relate to each other well?
Clint!
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Thu, 09 January 2003 14:35
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i've heard a fuckton of rumors that 350 chev stuff bolts straight into K motors - mostly rods and rod bolts. tonight i even heard that the valves are the same too! i did a quick google search but i cant find any specs, should ask a local hotrodder or something at the ballina car show on sunday
as far as i know, gudgeon pin offset allows the conrod to be more vertical (than with 0 offset) when the compression stroke is really putting the forces on it as it compresses air fuel mixture for ignition. this is why you bend rods when you blow a head gasket and your motor goes hydro
i'll go you one better and get photos of the 3k/4k/4k ribbing differences. they are in my automotive photo album at http://www.pbase.com/superjamie in "K motor parts". dont laugh at my budget 3k engine stand that motor's ribs would probably be more defined if i cleaned it
i'll get dirty on the weekend and have a look at the camshaft side of the motors too. i'll strip them all and weigh the blocks somehow. i spose the only real way to learn the internal thickness would be to get the bansaw into them. i know someone with a fucked 3k block, i'll ask them. i dont want the orange 4k block so i'll see what i can do in that dept too
i got some bellhousing bolts today from the wreckers, i would have taken samples to the bolt barn and gone "you give me hi-tensile these now" but i had none, i'll go tomorrow
i'm also taking my block in to get bored out 60 thou soon, and seeing what i can do about repairing my bigport head. the rocker bolt threads have only been stripped about 30 thousand times, there are helicoils inside helicoils. i've heard you can get the holes welded and retapped, surely this would come at a cost though :\
[Updated on: Thu, 09 January 2003 14:36]
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Location:
Canberra, ACT
Registered:
September 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Thu, 09 January 2003 15:56
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350 chev stuff? sounds suspicious, surely everything in those would be bigger. though... when i first laid eyes on a 3k bigport head i was quite shocked, the ports are indeed quite big! i visually compared them to my bigport 4age, and the exhaust ports looked nearly the same diameter! shocking!
jamie asked me to get my (dead) spare 3k block sliced up for research, and i've got no problems doing this. will do it when budget allows. any idea just how much i'm looking at? no, i can't be arsed doing it myself with a hacksaw 
j.
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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Fri, 10 January 2003 03:54
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Chev valves are way to big for k heads.
I have heard about rods & bolts being used though.
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Location:
Canberra, ACT
Registered:
September 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sat, 11 January 2003 08:39
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curious. no more detail than that?
j.
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sat, 11 January 2003 15:52
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ive got a mate with some SBC 283 rods in his shed having a look for me, and i have some traces on where i'd find 350 rods around town. i'll carry a 4K piston on a rod with me from now on
i'm looking into offset boring the block, the two siamese bores away from one another, to maintain center water jacket strength. need to measure clearance in the gudgeon pin slide and rod-to-crank clearance tho, a job for tomorrow. but it'll cost me another hundred bucks or so, i'll probably just get it bored straight, it is only 60 thou
cheers
Jamie
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Wed, 15 January 2003 15:03
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Found out a bit more about the offset gudgeon pin and it's reasoning. A trusted local engine reconditioner friend of mine has told me it is more for keeping pistons quiet in the bores than for any other reason (basically avoiding piston slap in the bores). He also stated that you could reverse the pistons so they became noisier, with the advantage of producing more power ("they go alot harder").
Also now hunting down pistons to suit the future bore, crank and rod sizes. At the moment I need a piston 78.048mm in bore with a revised pin height as the block will be smaller than the original 4K (by about 10mm). The original pin height for the 3K piston is 35.48mm, so we need a piston with a pin height of around 25.48mm. Will confirm the exact pin height when I can accurately measure up the block height differences between the two blocks. Gemini pistons go close at 78mm (oversize by 1mm) and a pin height of 28.2mm, with the same pin diametre of 18mm as the 3K/4K gudgeons, and they are a flat top piston like the original 3K/4K pistons. Still need to confirm a few things before I make the final selection.
On another point, I'll have a set of Repco Pistons to suit either 3K or 4K for sale. I'll confirm the bore size, but I think they are 60" over. Pistons still look to be in good order. I may also have a set of balanced rods from the 3K for sale too, if anyone is interested, let me know?!
Clint!
[Updated on: Wed, 15 January 2003 15:05]
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: How far can I bore a 3K out to?
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Sun, 19 January 2003 13:47
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Need a bit of help finding a piston, people! As stated earlier, I need a piston 78mm in bore (78.048mm to be exact - we're going to run 78's with 1.5" "clearance"!) with a pin height of approximately 25mm.
Pin height (also called compression height)is the distance from the centre of the gudgeon pin to the top of the piston, for those who don't understand, or want to know! Again as mentioned earlier, gemini pistons come close, but not close enough. So if anyone can supply any info on other pistons, I'd be greatly appreciative!!!
I've been through the ACL piston and ring catalogue (pp03), so any other suggestion please?
Would also like to stay with a flat top or domed piston at the moment for the sake of compression without having to shave the big port head, which are harder to find than a good woman (any hints on where to find one of them too, again would be greatly appreciated, the woman that is!!!).
Clint!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re:3K Performance Rebuild, How far can I bore a 3K?
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Tue, 04 February 2003 16:23
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More updates, if only for history! I can now confirm the 3K and 4K block heights differ by 10mm (ie, 4K is taller by 10mm), and have also found the sumps are not interchangable. Have ground the 3K block to accept the 4K crank and rod setup - Eased the block to clear the crank counterweights at the front and rear locating guides (as mentioned in an earlier post), and also enlarged the factory clearance reliefs on the underside of the block to clear the conrod bolts. The sump has also had a bit of modification needed. There are four small reliefs to clear the conrod bolts - these have been increased with with a ball pein hammer to clear the circulating assembly, and we also have to modify the sump's factory baffle as the crank hits it at the moment (will probably do this when we modify the sump to carry more oil).
Have also weighed the two blocks. On a set of scales with 500gram increments, the 3K block weighed 25Kgs, with the 4K block weighing the same - 25Kgs (this was however an "unwebbed" block so maybe that would alter weight in the later model blocks given the extra 10mm block height also).
On the piston front, Honda Accord (77-83) look like getting the nod! Still making a few "paper mistakes" compression wise (we only want to run 10-10.5:1), so will confirm the selection when we know for certain what head cc we will be running.
Have some goodies for sale too: 3K balanced rods and Repco pistons (will seperate the pistons), 3K twin carb setup, lots of spare general 3K/4K bits and pieces, plus other goodies if anyone is chasing something particular, let me know?!
Clint
[Updated on: Tue, 04 February 2003 16:27]
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Re:3K Performance Rebuild, How far can I bore a 3K?
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Tue, 04 February 2003 21:24
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there are two different sumps, one is for 3k and early 4k, one is for most 4k and all 5k. ive only ever heard of (never seen) a 3k-sumped 4k, but they do exist
one interesting thing we discovered last night - the 4k i have in getting machined is a ribbed block, it has these big tough rods (normal ones). i pulled apart the 40 thou unribbed 4k i have and the rods were TINY, like TOOTHPICKS almost (well you know). it was so wierd that Lucky then measured the stroke manually to make sure that motor hadn't been built with 1K gear (rev machine) as the crank actually had no 4k stamp, but it was 73mm alight. i weighed the crank and it was the same as a normal 4k crank. I'll get some photos soonly
repco pistons have a habit of cracking. i'm using ACLs, its all I could get. Wiseco offered to make me up a custom set of billet race pistons for a mere US$1000, I declined
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Re:3K Performance Rebuild, How far can I bore a 3K?
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Thu, 27 March 2003 09:58
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Can any one tell me where 3K's and 4K's let go when you go past their redline till something breaks please? Don't want to find out the hard way!
Clint!
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Location:
1st street on the right
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Thu, 27 March 2003 10:58
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Our stock 5k regularly went to 9k on dirt, the strangest (yet it seemed to work) suggestion I got was to shave the rocker posts so the valves opened further. The pistons had to be slightly dished where the valves scuffed but there was never any markings upon stripdowns. This was suggested by a fellow who built top fuel drag engines and he had the 5k pushing 150hp.
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On Probation
Location:
North East NSW
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Thu, 27 March 2003 20:53
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i've heard you run into problems revving past 8 grand, especially with unribbed 4k blocks
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Fri, 28 March 2003 01:20
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Thats a dead issue for me as I'll be using a modified ribbed 3K block. I want to know what lets go internally, more than anything???
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Fri, 28 March 2003 01:48
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Hey Clint,
I dont know if this is much help but..
In a 4k that was in a KE20 i damaged the rocker gear.
The bolts that hold the rocker shaft into the head stripped out.
I'm not sure if this was from over revving but i think so, i'm not sure what sort of rpm it saw, no tacho.
The motor may hve suffered more as after fixing the stripped holes (re coils) it never restarted.
The KE20 was pretty much written off so we threw it all away.
CamZH
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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Sat, 29 March 2003 06:48
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Ive never found anything to let go unless there are already problems.
They usually just end up with excessive blow by or cracked pistons.
Ive had the top of a piston come off but it was sum cheap piston.
also had a lifter colapse at high rpm but id say that was rare.
only ever thrown a rod after running at high rpm when i new the bearings were stuffed.
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Location:
Finland
Registered:
March 2005
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Fri, 25 March 2005 08:57
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Hello people! Somehow i bumped into your forum and looks nice  can't find similar forum in finnish.. So, about the 3k.
I have bored 1430cc 3k engine in my rallye starlet and it produces about 145bhp. max power @ 7250 rpm and torque is 175nm @ 5660 rpm.
engine is made with 3k crankshaft, 5k connecting rods and wiseco
79mm pistons. crank is balanced with clutch and flywheel, flywheel weights about 3.5 kg. It seems to be quite reliable engine, driven with this engine bout a year and only changed crank bearings once.
i use Castrol TWS engine oil and looks like it keeps the engine in good condition.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Fri, 25 March 2005 11:08
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dam people
my head hurts from reading all that in 1 sitting.
ok so CLG have u found out answer 2 all questions you were asking coz from what i was following questions were being answerd with questions.
haha wel good luck in your search of the most powerful n bulletproof 3K.
ill stick wit my toyoglide 5K.
cheers scott
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Location:
Sydney, OZ
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Fri, 25 March 2005 12:50
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| Quote: |
What if you get a 5k block to start with for the big bore then offset grind a 4k or 3k crank to bring your capacity down to where you want.
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Hmm.. Ok clint same issue I had til I got a few rules changed (7AFE vs 4AGE 20V in AE102's). Basically everyone the rules state that the orignal engine series block and head has to stay in the car, lucky for him the car fall under the pre-86 rules, which allows him to do what every he likes to the internals, manifolding, add injection, etc unlike mine, which was only allowed a 0.6mm boring. Now I'm not sure what engines were available for his car, but there is a nice new ruling brought in stating if you can produce an workshop manual showing and stating that different engines that were available in that shell, you can run that engine.... anyway clint, this reminds me of a good friend that was running a datto 1200 and managed to get the engine out to 1500cc, and it was dam quick!!
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Toymods Vice President
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Sat, 26 March 2005 07:06
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Just a reminder this thread was started in 2002.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Sun, 27 March 2005 08:54
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Yes true, but believe it or not - I still think about this project!!! I'm still happy to run with it as I hope I've worded the title appropriately to pull up in a thread search, and the area I'm talking about is really entry level, budget motorsport, so any free info is good info?!
A brief update for the thread - the engine was assembled with Honda pistons, using a 4K crank and rod set in a bored and clearanced 3K block. Compression was requested for 10.5:1, however abnormalities in the head (it looked like a shifted casting wgich gave four irregular combustion chambers when cc'd), saw me asking for another head to be used - this was rejected by the owner. A few other things that were not done at my request also saw the less than amicable seperation of partnership, after the owner detonated the engine 500Kms later on run in miles. He claimed he couldn't hear it pinging?!!!
A new motor was put together minus my input (albeit, he did finally change heads), but to the specifications I had used for the first engine, and it proved to be suitable to the job at hand - I've never been told the power and toque figures, but the statement that the owner could "make the car do anything I wanted now", led me to the conclusion it was a winning solution.
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On Probation
Location:
launceston tas
Registered:
March 2005
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Sun, 27 March 2005 08:57
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hey guys just wonderine how much a 3k large port head can be planed before its fucked
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Sun, 27 March 2005 11:21
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As much as you want - it all has it's consequences and extra costs involved though!
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On Probation
Location:
launceston tas
Registered:
March 2005
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Re: 3K Rally Motor Performance Rebuild to 1400cc
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Sun, 27 March 2005 12:13
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ok then my spare big port head has been planed 2mm so would it b any good
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