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Location:
Calgary Alberta Canada
Registered:
December 2002
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Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 17 January 2003 07:34
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Hello from Canada.
I have a 1984 Celica GT-S Convertible with a 22-RE. Here is a pic of the engine bay.
http://ebay3.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_EBAY_51cdde6a4 312115ad5c249759ee9a3d8/i-6_B_L.JPG
Here is a pic of the car.
http://ebay3.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_EBAY_51cdde6a4 312115ad5c249759ee9a3d8/i-1_B_L.JPG
I'm planning to order a 1/2 cut and get it sent over here. I have a few questions and I hope someone could send me the right way.
I've been reading all I can on the swaps and such. I know what will be involved for the most part. I have seen the 1G-GTE and the 1JZ-GTE swapped into pretty well any model Celica from 2x to 6x and up.
My questions are: (in no particular order)
1. If I am swapping an engine should I go for the most hp? The 1JZ-GTE would be my choice. If I'm doing a swap I mine as well make it worthwhile.
2. I'm confused about gearboxes and crossmembers. If I buy a 1/2 cut from a Soarer I think you get a frontsump pan(?). Is that what I would need. Which ones come with a mid or rear sump? All this talk about 3 different pans confuses me. Which one should I use?
3. As for the crossmember would I use my existing one? I have the 22-RE in it. I'm thinking I either use my existing crossmember and mounts or I use the crossmember and mounts from the 1JZ. Or is a combination of both?
It's hard to picture things without a 1/2 cut next to me. I'm sure I can figure it out once it's here. I just want to order the right things prior to shipping that's all. If anyone has the right combination of things I should look for that would be great.
I know I have to change the PS over and the A/C and the odd lines here and there. Wiring too. I just want to make sure I have everything so I don't get nickel and dimed having a part or two shipped over that I might have forgotten or could have chosen differently.
I'm really looking forward to the results of the swap. You guys with the swaps must have a blast driving them.
What is a good place to get a decent 1/2 cut? I just go by what I see on a webpage. I figure you guys would have a good idea of who to stay away from. I don't mind spending more for quality. If I'm going through all this trouble I would like a good 1/2 cut and a good price.
I'm sure I'll have more questions sooner or later.
I thank you guys for a great site and look forward to your thoughts.
Dan in Canada.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 18 January 2003 01:44
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general consensus (sp?) is to go for the 1G-GTE
I had an RA65, and badly wanted a 1jz.. and in the end my best option was to sell it and but a mk2 supra (which I did).
if you go the 1G, you use your factory crossmember, but will need some custom engine mounts to hold the 1G in place.
Apparently air-con is a real bitch to get working.
if you go the 1JZ, apart from having a lead arrow you'll need the chaser 1JZ. This one has a front sump, which is what you need for clearance on the crossmember (you may even need a custom crossmember for the celica, I'm not sure).
bear in mind chaser half cuts are quite rare.
one other thing to consider is... do you really want 300bhp running through your celica's drivetrain? It has no LSD (or most don't), so you're going to be helplessly wheelspinning whenever those lovely turbos kick in.
and as for gearboxes... I recommend the w58 (found in mk2 supras, and mk3 & 4 n/a supras) it weighs 10kg less than the 1jz gearbox (I think most 1G-gte's had the w58 behind them)
just my 2 cents of course, but I've been there and looked at all the options. Hopefully max will post here, he's done the RA6x 1G-GTE conversion, and can offer some hands-on knowledge
[Updated on: Sat, 18 January 2003 01:47]
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Banned member
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 18 January 2003 07:05
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most ra65s have w58's dude...well all the ones i have bought for myself anyway i hear they are supposed to be quite rare so i must be the lucky one
if you can get one you may as well go the 1uzfe lexus v8 option as they weigh just as much as a 22re as they are all alloy but would kick shit all over a 1g-gte, IMHO 1g-gte are way overrated and it is going to cost just as much to get a 1uzfe put in so why fuck around with an inferior motor ???
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 18 January 2003 07:18
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'cause it puts out less power, so he's less likely to mince his diff.
I forgot abouit the 1uz, that is an even better option. the 1jz is a *tight* squeeze into an ra65 engine bay, but the 1uz (being shorter) would fit better (I assume)
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Location:
Calgary Alberta Canada
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 18 January 2003 08:44
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Thanks guys. This is the type of information and input I need. The car that I use for the swap isn't going to change. It will be the Celica Convertible I bought. I'm not 100% sure of it's gearbox yet. I'm assuming it will be a W58. It is a Celica GT-S with IRS and 4 wheel disc.
Is the rearend the same as the Supra? I will check when I get it on a hoist. I know they have a 6.7" and 7.5". I'm hoping mine will be the 7.5". If not then I will swap in the Supra rear. That I can handle no problem. Same thing with a LSD. If it doesn't have one it will get one. I've got a rear locker in the rear and a LSD in the front of my Cherokee so putting one in the Celica will be easy.
As for the engine I will look into the 1UZFE. I want the most hp for the $ if I do a swap. If the amount of work will be about the same then I want the most hp I can get.
Here in Canada it's starting to be a HP war on the sport compact scene. The Neon SRT-4 has around 220hp and 250 ft/lbs. Suburu WRX 200+, The RSX and Celicas have around 180-200. These are the ones I'm aiming for. I need to have at least 200hp as reliable as I can get.
As soon as I read up on the 1UZFE and compare it to the 1GT and the 1JZ I'll probabaly make some decision.
Do all 3 engines use the the W58? Or should I say can I use it with the right bellhousing or should I stick with what gearbox comes in the package.
The V8 would be unique here for sure.
Once again thank you for any of your input. It is greatly appreciated.
Dan in Canada.
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Banned member
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 18 January 2003 10:02
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dude the 1uz comes out as 300hp stock as a rock, problem is it was only released as an auto, do a bit of research and im sure you can find a bellhousing in your area to help along the conversion otherwise find a good contact over here in australia as there is a few places which DO make the w58 ---> 1uz bellhousing neccesary for your conversion
i am doing a 1uzfe conversion into a ta22 at the moment but am also considering a sister project of a 1uz into a ra65 or sa63 COUPE, i hate the liftbacks they dont look sporty to me at all, just my opinion millions would disagree, but as soon as i find one in good nick let the frankenstein mayhem begin !
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 18 January 2003 13:58
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the 1uz puts out around the same HP stock as the 1jz (300 or so), the only problem being you cant just wind up the boost on a 1uz for easy HP gains. you could always look at turbocharging your 1uz (as a few guys in this club have), but taht my be more money and hp than you were looking at.
generally, the w58 is the gearbox of choice. especially with the 1jz and 1g, as it's a very simple bolt-up (I have no idea on the 1uz)
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sun, 19 January 2003 03:04
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I thought that the reason that the 1UZ wasn't used as much was because of the high cost of converting it to manual (bell housing is apparently $1000 and thats not including clutch, and then don't you have to run an aftermarket computer? If so that would hurt the bank as well)
Cheers
Wilbo
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Banned member
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sun, 19 January 2003 04:01
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bellhousing is around 500 from dellows
i was thinking today...there would be no point in converting a ra6x to 1g-gte when you could just go and buy a supra which looks better has electric everything ... even if it is a little heavier you cant justify that sort of money for such a dopey motor, i would look at 1jz-gte or 1uzfe
my two cents
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sun, 19 January 2003 05:56
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Celica convertible = bugger-all structural rigidity. I'd advise against installing big-hp engines like the 1UZ or 1JZ. I reckon a 1G-GTE is the most sensible option, and also by far the easiest! Both the 1UZ and 1JZ are big engines, and it won't be easy shoe-horning them into a Celica engine bay. The 1G is much smaller by comparison.
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Location:
Calgary Alberta Canada
Registered:
December 2002
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sun, 19 January 2003 11:07
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if you're talking in terms of physical size, the 1jz is about the same length as the 7m. The 7m-gte would be a good option if that's a readily availble engine in your area.. taken care of properly, they're a reliable big HP engine (SUPRAGTE is planning to make 300rwkw with his set-up, which should be ready in a few weeks)
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Location:
Calgary Alberta Canada
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sun, 19 January 2003 19:08
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7M-GTE area available here. I just thought that being a 3.0 it would be too big for the bay. That's why I was leaning towards the 1GE or the AJZ being smaller in displacement than the 7M.
Are they really that close in size? I don't know if you have read on the net about Reg Reimer and his Supra. I guess he was one of the first to do a 7MGTE swap in a early Supra. He lives in Calgary as well. We've had our cars right next to each other at a few car shows so he could help me out if I needed anything I'm sure.
Now this has got me thinking for sure. The 7M-GTE is common here and parts are readily available both new, used and aftermarket.
Now I'm thinking of 1UZ or 7M-GTE. Choices, choices.
Dan In Calgary
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Mon, 20 January 2003 00:19
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just remember, generally speaking the more hp you want the harder the swap is going to be. I looked at the 1G initially for my celica, but I wanted more power. I then looked at the 3s-gte (gt-4/all-trac engine), but converting that to rwd was *expensive*.
so that left 1jz (I was turned away from the 1uz because I love turbocharged cars) ... and that just wasn't worth it into a celica.. engine bay is too small, wheel base is shorter .. it's just not designed for that much weight at the front.
now you can slightly alleviate these problems. Move the battery to the boot, get a fibreglass bonnet (and fibreglass 1/4 panels if you're really desperate) also you can "modify" (ie cut holes in) the front intrusion bar, which is really heavy, and provides more protection than is sensible
just some options if you're determined to go the big hp route.
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Location:
Calgary Alberta Canada
Registered:
December 2002
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Banned member
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Mon, 20 January 2003 07:58
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the 1UZFE weighs just as much as the stock 22RE it may even be a touch lighter thanks to the ALL ALLOY design, this would be the most unique swap as i havnt heard of anyone who has done it yet, but there are a heap of people with 1ggte in their ra6x why would you bother when it is going to cost the same and produce a lesser powerful car at the end of the day for a manual conversion it would cost a bit more, i think it would be worth it even driving the auto for a bit and then save for the manual
i had a ra65 coupe and then sold it but as i get closer to finishing my ta22 1uzfe conversion i miss her and am looking for another to put in the v8 !..
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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 Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 01:19
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| dan_boucher wrote on Fri, 17 January 2003 18:34 |
1. If I am swapping an engine should I go for the most hp? The 1JZ-GTE would be my choice. If I'm doing a swap I mine as well make it worthwhile.
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No, some engines are just too large and will ruin your handling. The JZ and M engines will fit (with a big shoehorn) but you won't want to go around corners with them in...
The 1G-GTE will give you the biggest bang for the buck. It's an easy conversion and the engines are cheap.
If you want more hp and are willing to spend the money, then go for the 1UZ-FE or 3S-GTE but they have a lot of problems associated with each swap.
The 1UZ-FE has a host of electronic gimickry that you will have to fool in order to put it into your car, especially if you want a manual. Common consensus is to go for an early 1UZ (89-93 I think) since this has the least electronic shit to deal with.
On a side note, my stock 1G-GTE puts out roughly the same power as a 1UZ-FE on the dyno. I haven't even bothered upping the boost....
The 3S-GTE swap is pretty well documented.
Check this thread out:
http://www.toymods.org.au/msgboard/index.php?t=msg &th=2590#msg_num_6
| dan_boucher wrote on Fri, 17 January 2003 18:34 |
2. I'm confused about gearboxes and crossmembers. If I buy a 1/2 cut from a Soarer I think you get a frontsump pan(?). Is that what I would need. Which ones come with a mid or rear sump? All this talk about 3 different pans confuses me. Which one should I use?
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You'll want a front sump. This can be found in 1G-GEs, 1G-GZEs, and gen 1 1G-GTEs.
Check our tech articles section for how to tell the different 1G-GTE generations.
| dan_boucher wrote on Fri, 17 January 2003 18:34 |
3. As for the crossmember would I use my existing one? I have the 22-RE in it. I'm thinking I either use my existing crossmember and mounts or I use the crossmember and mounts from the 1JZ. Or is a combination of both?
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Yeah, you use the standard crossmember and make custom mounts.
P.S.: Here is an email from GaryM on the Old Celica Club list who's researching the 1UZ-FE swap. This will give you an idea of what's involved in the 1UZ-FE swap....
| GaryM wrote on 15/01/2003 1:33 PM |
Okay, I got the ECU wiring diagrams for the 92 and 98 1UZFE engines in Lexus LS and SC cars. As far as Mitchell on Demand computer data shows, the V8 only came with an auto trans ni the US. SO... all 1UZ ECU's are programmed to operate a transmissions as well as the engine. The "problem" is that it reads the speed of the trans input shaft after the torque convertor and the trans output shaft to control the solonoid valves to shift the trans. The ECU will reduce engine power and set an error if it thinks the trans is slipping. I think I figured a way around this, but it certainly won't be easy. I will tell the ECU that the shifter is either in park (when the hand brake is on) or in manual low gear, (when the parking handbrake is off) This way the drive ratio will always be tha same, so I can use a frequency generator off of the engine crank with the correct pulse rates as if the car was rolling under light load in first gear. Trnas shafts will be at 0 rpm while in park, and the correct vehicle spend when out of park, even if the clutch is in and the car is stopped. The ECU will report that it is rolling, but it should not matter.
The ECU also has ABS inputs, but I will just tie those as if the wheels are never slipping. So far, no big deal. Here comes the FUN ones. Most of these cars also have traction control. I may need to connect the wheel speed sensors to my fake trans shaft speed detector. Once again, make sure it never sees any wheel slippage. That should work. WELL, at least on the 92 motor... On the 98 and up VVTi version, things get very crazy. The throttle is drive by wire, no throttle cable. It has dual TPS sensors on both the pedal and the throttle, and a motor to open the actual throttle. This also could be setup and use the electronic system, I could even have my old cruise control operate the pedal TPS sensor so it should work. But I need to satisfy alot more sensors to make sure it does not set an error code, AND the ECU uses a transponder key system for theft deterent. SO I would need the original Lexus Key mounted close to the reciever in the car so it thinks I have the correct key in the ignition or it will never start. This is getting crazy, and I am not even to the emissions controls yet.
So 93 or older it is. Now I need some specs on the pulses per revolution and the error windows in the ECU to make a box to create the right pulses. This may take some time. The 3SGTE is certainly going to be easier since it uses a much dumber ECU.
Gary M.
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 01:28
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| celicamad85 wrote on Mon, 20 January 2003 18:58 |
there are a heap of people with 1ggte in their ra6x why would you bother when it is going to cost the same and produce a lesser powerful car at the end of the day
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I think a 1UZ-FE alone would probably cost the same as an entire 1G-GTE engine conversion. And it's been proven on our dyno days that the 3rd gen 1G-GTE produces the same power as a 1UZ-FE (around 125kW).
Up the boost to 14psi using a $25 bleed valve and the 1G-GTE will produce 150+kW.
Getting a 1UZ-FE to make 150kW will cost a shitload more than an already expensive conversion.
The 1UZ-FE should only considered if you're thinking about making shitloads of power. The bottom end is near-bulletproof.
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Banned member
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 06:56
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nark show me one DIRECT comparision between a 1ggte and a 1uzfe in the same type of car, same transmission, same day, dame dyno
the 1ggte makes approx 210hp STOCK
the 1uzfe makes approx 300hp STOCK
why wouldnt you go the 1uz, oh thats right cos you already did another engine conversion, better keep telling yourself you did the right thing to justify it all
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:05
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[quote why wouldnt you go the 1uz, oh thats right cos you already did another engine conversion, better keep telling yourself you did the right thing to justify it all[/quote]
Ouch man, no need to have a go at the man, that is just his opinion, looking at the dyno figures I'd give the V8 maybe 145 at the wheels (a little more) but is the 1UZ worth that little extra when you can just up the boost of the smaller / lighter (not sure on that?) 1G which you can fit easily into the car. And by easily I mean it HAS been done many times before so the steps are already there for an easy conversion, also comes in manual to make tings even easier (how much does it cost to make a 1UZ manual?). With the same cost on both I think the 1G would go faster.
Oh and feel free to rip me too, this is just my opinion.
Cheers
Wilbo
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Location:
c'town, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:12
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celicamad i think u may be over quoting the 1UZ power figures
the 1UZ is more like 275 BHP (203kw)
if you were talking about the VVTi 4.3litre 3UZ then 300HP sounds about right
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I supported Toymods
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Epping, Sydney
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May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:13
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go easy! ok, the v8 is a superior engine, but you've either got to keep it as is or put some turbos on it, with very little in between.
Just have a look at the dyno day figures.. tina's 1g-gte made 144kw at the wheels, which is on par with the 1uz.
and I'm sure Phil (Traction_issues) will be getting a STACK more power out of his set-up
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:17
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As opposed to you? But then again, no one's ever accused you of an unbiased opinion. 
1UZ-FEs usually reside in cars that have newer and better drivetrains (Cressidas) than ones with 1G-GTEs (Celicas). Which means less drivetrain loss.
In the last two dyno days:
1UZ-FE: 124.8kW (MX83) and 122.3kW (UZZ30 Soarer)
1G-GTE: 124.8kW (My car) and 123.9kW (RA28)
I'm not talking about bias here. These are real, hard facts proven from the same dyno on the same day, not some figure that you pulled from somewhere.
P.S.: Another Soarer made 133.4kW on Sunday, but I can't verify if it was stock or not. Even if it's not, it still doesn't match a 1G-GTE at 14 psi (which is a $25 mod).
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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 Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:22
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| wilbo666 wrote on Tue, 21 January 2003 18:05 |
but is the 1UZ worth that little extra when you can just up the boost of the smaller / lighter (not sure on that?) 1G which you can fit easily into the car
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From the figures I've seen, both 1G-GTE and 1UZ-FE are identical in weight at 175kg.
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:23
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| draven wrote on Tue, 21 January 2003 18:13 |
Just have a look at the dyno day figures.. tina's 1g-gte made 144kw at the wheels, which is on par with the 1uz.
and I'm sure Phil (Traction_issues) will be getting a STACK more power out of his set-up
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Tina's car was running 14psi AFAIK. Phil's on 14psi put out 144kW too.
Darren's put out 151kW or so.
It'll be very interesting to see what Phil's car puts out now...
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I supported Toymods
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:24
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up to 1997, the 1uz never made more than 265 (quoted figures)
the 1997+ made 300
there were lots of 1uz's made in this time, and I just quoted the most powerful for the 2 time periods
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Banned member
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Brisbane
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I supported Toymods
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 07:37
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that's where I got them from
have a look at the years.
up to 1997, none made more than 265bhp
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I supported Toymods
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 08:06
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In fact, the vast majority that we are getting in halfcuts produce a 'paltry' 256 hp, and the US front clips are making 250. Also remember these are inflated Toyota numbers and the 'real' horsepower is more like 220-230.
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Banned member
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 08:39
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yeah true so that would make the inflated 210hp from a 1ggte more like 180 or so by your accounts but the difference is still the same and the potential of a 1uzfe dosnt compare to a 2litre, its all about the cubes
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Location:
Sydney
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 10:13
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ok my 3rd gen 1g with 3inch exhaust being the only mod! not even an air filter on it. put down 124rwKW and a (as far as I could tell) stock soarer put down 122rwKW.
So i have an exhaust but I still havent turned up the boost..
tinas was 11.5psi at the inlet afaik rod could confirm.
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Banned member
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 10:22
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and did any of these 1uz's have manual transmission ??
yeah the apple tastes like the orange if you hold your nose so you cant taste it
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
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May 2002
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Tue, 21 January 2003 23:07
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| celicamad85 wrote on Tue, 21 January 2003 19:39 |
yeah true so that would make the inflated 210hp from a 1ggte more like 180 or so by your accounts but the difference is still the same and the potential of a 1uzfe dosnt compare to a 2litre, its all about the cubes
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Why do you keep insisting the 1UZ-FE is more powerful when the dyno figures prove that they're the same?
Get your head out of websites stating power figures and look at real life dyno results from two separate dyno days.
Last year, Darren's MX83 (auto with twin 2 1/4" into single 3" exhaust) made exactly the same as my car (air filter and 2.5" exhaust). 124.8kW.
This year Bugman's car pulled slightly more than a stock UZZ30. 123.9 vs 122.3.
Your argument that the 1UZ-FE is more power is null and void. No matter what the factory quoted figures are.
Yes, the 1UZ-FE has more potential, but we're not comparing 600hp buildups here...
| celicamad85 wrote on Tue, 21 January 2003 21:22 |
and did any of these 1uz's have manual transmission ??
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AFAIK, an auto will articifially inflate a dyno figure since you can't hold it in 3rd (1:1) gear and do the run. They normally pop back to 2nd when the foot is planted...
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Club President
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 Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Wed, 22 January 2003 01:09
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Dan, There is alot of information on the Web and on Forums like this Unfortunatly there is always alot of Mis-information so you do need to be able to look and evaluate what is there to sort the fact from the fiction. You need to find the people who have done it themselves not people who read something somewhere and think they know. Unfortunatly this thread has been corrupted by someone who thinks he knows, But enough Rant and down to some Facts.
The 1UZ-FE is rated at weighing 175kg, it is a pretty good weight for an engine its size. Engine bay wize you will need a space of 700mm cube ! I had one, I have measured it and I have also assisted in 2 1UZ Conversions. The Bellhousing kit etc for a 1UZ to W58 from Dellows is $1000 Aus not the $500 quoted earlier. Remember you need a flywheel as well as the bellhousing !
After that your biggest installation hassels will be your rear most Exhaust port near the stearing box/rack. Oh and as Mention your Sump clearance could cause you some issues !
The 1JZ-GTE is a Great engine and also comes in several Sump options. I have fitted one of these to my brothers car and completely 100% stock with restrictive Exhaust it generated 140 RWKW, Yes its Auto ! By Comparison the Stock 1UZ as Fitted to an earlier model Soarer made 122 RWKW also an Auto and these two engine run basically the same Factory Auto ! This was one THE SAME DAY on the SAME DYNO. Please look over the figures For Sundays Dyno day held by our Club in the events section of the forums. Bugmans Gen 3 1GGTE in completely Factory trim turned 123.9 RWKW.
The 1G-GTE is IMHO the better option for your car, It will probably weight less than your Current 22-RE and be a much easier installation size wize. There are several versions of the 1G and you should look at Nark's comments to understand the one you need, IE a front sump Version. Nark has Done this exact conversion he is not going off something he thinks or read.
The earlier versions of the 1G-GTE run 7PSI boost from Factory, The Generation 3 Front Sump Version with the Grey ECU plugs and winged sump runs 11PSI factory. My wife Tina's car has just received this engine, it is an RA28 so size limitations are similar to yours. Her car has received the benefit of a Front Mount Intercooler and a 3" hi flow Exhaust. The engine is completely stock and runs the Factory ECU. Boost when completely untouched was 9.5 PSI at the intake. Using a bleed valve the boost was turned back up to 11.5 PSI. On Sunday it turned 142 RWKW thru a W55 Manual Transmission ! The Turbo's are supposedly happy at up to 14PSi so there is still as yet some untapped power should it be desired.
At the end of the day tho you need to decide what you are ultimatly trying to acheive. If its HUGE power the 1G is not for you, It is only a 2litre engine and will be limited by this in terms of acheiveable results. The 1UZ on the otherhand does have a near bullet proof bottom end and the 1J engine has been proven to respond well to larger Turbo/s and increased boost. ( Best modified 1JZ-GTE Result on the day was 212 RWKW)
If your after a near stock and cost effective power increase I'd personal lean to the 1G-GTE, you will have very respectable power and retain your handling. There is a reason they are so popular 
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Thu, 23 January 2003 06:43
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| thetoyman75 wrote on Wed, 22 January 2003 11:09 |
The Bellhousing kit etc for a 1UZ to W58 from Dellows is $1000 Aus not the $500 quoted earlier. Remember you need a flywheel as well as the bellhousing !
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$1000 !!...they saw you coming a mile away
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Thu, 23 January 2003 09:09
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that would be dellow$!
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 Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 00:24
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| celicamad85 wrote on Thu, 23 January 2003 17:43 |
| thetoyman75 wrote on Wed, 22 January 2003 11:09 |
The Bellhousing kit etc for a 1UZ to W58 from Dellows is $1000 Aus not the $500 quoted earlier. Remember you need a flywheel as well as the bellhousing !
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$1000 !!...they saw you coming a mile away
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Including the flywheel and shift fork right Rod? $1000 for the kit. Not just the bellhousing.
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 00:27
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Yep Thats right !
Good to see some of us can still master the powers of Comprehension ! 
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 00:48
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Just for good measure, if you wanted all the manual conversion parts from either the Castlemaine Rod Shop or Carbontech, you'd be looking around the same figure...
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 04:09
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no its obvious you dont master the powers of comprehension because i said $500 for the bellhousing and nothing else, you jackass
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 08:27
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Hmm...
Me thinks Celicamad is the fool.
Why say its only $500 for a bellhousing when you still need to pay the extra $500 for a flywheel and fork....its like advertising water for sale, but the bottle is extra =]
Here is my 5c.
If you want the car to handle well, and go quite quick out of the box, the 3SGTE is the way to go. Yes its not as an easy a conversion, BUT it is a lighter motor and even in standard ST185 JDM trim it makes 166kw and 304nm of torque...more than the 1GGTE. Now for a cheap conversion the 1G is the way to go, dollar for dollar you cant match it.
The 1UZFE is a nice motor, but its also a pain in the ass job to find and hook up, sure cubes are nice but whats the use unless you plan to turbocharge it...I think most will agree =]
Find a base turbo engine and work with that, its the most cost effective route..
Hell my 3SGTE made 148kW @ wheels on 14.5psi boost, not bad for a little 4 pot 1998cc motor eh? And think low to mid 13s out of the box for a RWD....now a 1GGTE WONT offer that and thats the truth =]
In a front wheel drive ive run a 14.07 @ 103mph..now time isnt that great, but the terminal speed is good for low 13s easy...and my car will weigh more than yours too.
Food for thought.
The fact remains the 1UZFE isnt quite suited for a Celica unless its purely drag duties =]
Regards,
Michael
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 08:46
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well why say its going to cost $1000 then what about the clutch, clutch master, clutch slave all hoses etc. etc.
some dude goes on about i am wrong because i said $500 for the bellhousing when it should have been $1000 which included extras and didnt even include all the other extras what is toyman trying to prove ?
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 08:49
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the general consensus with this forum is, lets follow the crowd
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 09:06
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mikey, I wonder what a standard 1g celica puts down for a 1/4 anyone got any gtechs?
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 09:30
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Bug,
Id have to say an easy low 14..
I raced max's car with my engine quite std, ie 9psi boost and 3/4 exhaust system (std dump pipe) and it was close.
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 09:48
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| [mikey |
wrote on Fri, 24 January 2003 19:27]Hmm...
Me thinks Celicamad is the fool.
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How's that twin turbo T04 22R going dude? Nearly done? Or hasn't it started spooling yet? Wonder why... 
Here is the Dellows pricelist (for the JZ motors) for what it's worth. The prices for the 1UZ are similar. You can do the arithmetic.
Remember if you buy a Dellows bit then implicit in that is that you have to buy the rest of the kit. You can get a bit clever and modify it, but otherwise it's the kit or bust.
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 10:26
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tomato i love you but where do you get your facts from
i DO have a 22re but there is no turbo and it is in pieces with no car to go to, maybe you are thinking of the 2tg/3tg hybrid t03/t04 turbo 48mm webbers
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 10:47
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GT, you have it wrong, sorry.
It was GT40's, not T04's.
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 12:03
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thanks nathan
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 12:50
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No probs Wayne 
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Fri, 24 January 2003 22:15
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Yo Ppl. whassup?
Dan! Dood! Greets to a fellow Canuck! lol.
Been a while, I'll try to get my 'facts' straight. heh Nark and other made some good points, but remember the 'scene' in Aus is a tad different!
22Rs are plentiful here (Canada) and often modded (now)
3Ss are less plentiful (as GTEs) but rock the strip
1Gs in ANY form are like free hookers. Not there.
1UZs are out, get a short block from Toyota Can and build it!
There are several other engines to choose from as well - check support from TRD-USA (TRD is in Can, but the website sux)for locally avail parts/repair items before choosing pls!
The ~M series engines basically sit like a 22R with the extra 2 cyls out front of it, and according to another fella looking at swapping the 1UZ into a Celi, the 1UZ sits (CofM) further back than even the 22R!!!
You doods are posting onandon about a different world! Reg Reimer has the same car as me (mine's MA47) and his swap is easy from M to MG.. hehe (So I found out from another MA owner - Damon) and YES (!!) the MGEs will so fit in an RA, you get pusher fans and do some dieting on the chassis. It fits. Been done. handles ok.
I myself recently parted with my RA65/TRD22RE/W58/F303 and I missssss it bad. The 'vert will weigh in about 3 bodies heavier, and needs the grunt to move it off the line. My MA scaled at 2760 LBS on full tank 'petrol', full stereo install, etc. No dieting for it. It would have been a damn dog without the size fo the 22R, the torque, and the bigass flywheel to help get off the line! The 1UZ will be more fiscally responsible as the 1Gs are not here. You want a 1GGTE? ok. Get about 3 for parts.
Just about any Toy engine is better off the hop than the 22R (well, the bigger ones/turbo ones) but I regularily chased 200HP V8's in my GTS, and often won. But then again I tend to avoid letting off the loud pedal ...
I am considering the V8 into my Ma, but have back burnered that until I get a ruling on the future of the 'pro 8' class for drag racing here - 'd rather stay in the 'High Tech' class - 6cyl, up to 3L, 2 power adders! Turbo nitrous 7M. lol.
But consider a mass power figure on just breathing and cams/tuning - THEN asdd a pair of T3's (cheap here) from .. maybe a 300ZXT? Wheeeeee (go broke on tires)
Anyway - with the increased curb weight, the 'vertible would benefit from a larger displacement engine, whatever series. The stuctural problems are easily solved with a drop-in rollcage kit avail from California. The differential is a non-issue since if it is open, he'll be swappin soon, and if it IS LSD, then no probs at all - I have 3 spares (up to the 4.30 set) sitting in Junkyards near here, the one in the car, and another on the bench getting rebuilt. They were common over here in the MkII's and no-one sees where they are... eheheh Might even be getting one for GaryM (the aforementioned OCC'er) And many of the canadian GTSs came (in 84/5) with the 7.5" set - check your axle code, then look it up on helene and Mattie's site (the MotorCity/pit site above)
Enough ranting. I'd love to see this done. If you think yer car could stand up to Nark's in my magazine, you can email me at webmaster@toyotatuner.dyndns.org and let me know what yer doin!
/FreaK -;)_
PS - hey Norbie! LTNS!
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 25 January 2003 03:10
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Im going to get this thread locked.....
Gtech with my old white (not pink max!!) celica, me and 100+kg passenger, on 13psi, did 0-100in 6.1 (second gear wheelspin sux!), and 1/4mile in 13.78sec. Before anyone starts telling me im a wanker, this was an average taken over 4 runs. I have NEVER come across a 4 banger, regardless of the make (including a modified st205) that could keep pace with a 1G in 3rd-5th gear!!! Sure in 1st and 2nd there is a poofteenth of difference, but as soon as boost in 3rd is at max, watch the tail lights f*** off into the distance boys......
I would really like to see a 1UZ keep pace with a 1G......(keeping jamies car out of this )......
Bang for your buck is the 1G by a fuggin LONG way.....
But do whatever you want..its your car mate!!!
Phill
Ps:- celicamad85, Content removed ......sounds like you REALLY know what your on about
Pss:- I know personal attacks arent allowed......but i did say i want the thread locked.....
Psss:- Calling a 1G shit and comparing it to a 1UZ, its like saying a JZA80 is shit, then comparing it to a fuggin Landcruiser. Both have there strengths and weaknesses.
[Updated on: Tue, 28 January 2003 00:00] by Moderator
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 25 January 2003 03:26
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Philster,
Once I get my license back in a few months and get my car finished, we'll have to have a little rolling run somenight!!! I am really curious to see how the corolla will go up against your celica, you'll probably be heaps quicker but you've hit my curious spot!
Michael
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 25 January 2003 04:41
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CM85, if it were just your opinion, no one would actually care. You are entitled to your opinion, no matter how wrong it might be. The problem is that you are a purveyor of unmitigated and unsubstantiated rubbish. You then present this drivel as fact. It also comes devoid of a spirit of friendly information sharing. This is generally known as misinformation.
The fact that you have presented to us all (on previous occasions) that your dream engine is a twin GT40 turboed 22RE illustrates to us all you haven't got a clue.
Toymods should present you with one of these:
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 25 January 2003 04:49
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honestly I thought the whole "lets stick a v8 in it" mentality went out of fashion a long time ago. sticking a V8 in a celica for anything other than dragging is just plain stupid IMHO.
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 25 January 2003 05:04
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I'll just add 2 things before this thread is lokced or turned into a sh*t slinging match.
1. The 1uz is just as heavy as the 22R, so wouldn't ruin handling too much (and it'll sit further back than the 1jz or even =1G). Not comparing quality of engine, just where they sit.
2. The 1G is *RARE* in USA/canada, which might make the conversion less attractive.
3. (ok, so I cant count) If someone posts an opinion that's wrong, or you think is wrong at least, it's nice to say "I don't think so" instead of "your head is up your arse" and then it just escalates.
we're all mates here (or should be), and lets try and act our ages ... or failing that for the young people, maturely.
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Re: Replacing 22-RE with 1JZ-GTE or 1G-GTE in RA6x
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Sat, 25 January 2003 05:05
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None of the engines mentioned here can be compared with each other for reasons i thought would be obvious.No one should say 1 is better than the other.
I think opinions should be banned on here `cause some people can`t handle other people`s views!....There are MANY narrow minded people here who can`t look outside the square,which doesn`t help matters!!!!
I guess you get that with 80% of this group being ricers
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