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I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Northern Beaches
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 14 June 2002 14:47
 
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rev it up and drop the clutch 
I have found the best launch is when u get enough wheel spin to keep ur revs up there once the clutch is droped so u don't bog down. But u don't want too much as with wheel spin u don't go too far hehe
This is just what I have found is best
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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 Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 14 June 2002 16:05
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The best launch will be when there is a little wheelspin. This keeps the engine spinning while you accelerate.
You can either dump the clutch (bad for diff and various other components of the drivetrain) or slip the clutch (bad for clutch).
I launch by slipping the clutch. I've found that I have more control over the launch using that method, plus I can build boost more smoothly.
For an auto, just stall it up (step on both accelerator and brake) to the point that the wheels are about to spin, then just let go of the brake when the light turns green.
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 14 June 2002 16:15
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I'd have to agree with Nark and Ribbo. Best FWD manual launches involve a fair bit of wheelspin to keep the revs up but are a balancing act between bogging down and smokin em up...
Clutch slipping is probably more consistent, easier on the car, and easier to get right.
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 14 June 2002 22:03
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| Nark wrote on Sat, 15 June 2002 2:05 AM |
For an auto, just stall it up (step on both accelerator and brake) to the point that the wheels are about to spin, then just let go of the brake when the light turns green.
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That would be fine though wouldn't it since 1st gear is already engaged?
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sat, 15 June 2002 07:53
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quote]
That would be fine though wouldn't it since 1st gear is already engaged?[/quote]
yeah but to a certain extent
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sat, 15 June 2002 08:22
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well i think i got a good one last night..?
i was driving around one of those richy areas where you see nothing lower then 2 story houses and the typical lake =p
came to a round about.. friend goes hey man.. some boys infront of their civic hanging around at the front of the house, i look.. toyota lights?! what the hell altezza civic?.. anyway i decided to be an idiot =p.. i drove around and entered the begning of that street.. was gonna go into the lake parking but i stopped in the middle of a nice straight round with a bend to the rounabout were we saw them 
stopped right in the middle.. i revved it to about 2.5/3k i think it was and i think i sliped the clutched progressively.. (the didnt hear or feel wheel spin but but it did jump abit?) anyway came down the street with the good old 4age motor screaming at 5k  ( you guys know how loud that thing is hehehe, and the induction noise got to the point were it sounded like turbo as Joel knows when he touched the throttle ) shifted to 2nd becuase i had approached the bend.. and wanted to be hard  looked at them asian boys saw their civic
slowed down since it was the round about.. dropped to about 10k's shifted to 1st and just went down the road screaming =p
anyway whats a good rev range for launching?
im pretty sure i gave it ago near the 3k mark.. is it better to go rev more higher or what? hehe
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sat, 15 June 2002 14:19
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300000gal of rocket fuel
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I supported Toymods
Location:
South of Wollongong
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sat, 15 June 2002 14:26
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Im good mates with Oz_Craig...him and me have raced couple of times... 
i'm sorry to say that out of the 3 times we have had a go i have lost....i think it could be because i get too much wheel spin.
I even lost when he had slicks on..... 
What is the go with this clutch slipping technique??
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I supported Toymods
Location:
South of Wollongong
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sat, 15 June 2002 14:29
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What i mean by he had slicks on, is that he had no tread left on his tires after his burnouts! 
Yeah
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Location:
Sydney Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 00:24
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LEft foot on brake .. right foot on the floor... watch the boost guage, 1..2..3..4..5 (wheels start to churp slowly) Release Brake.. BANG 11psi instantly and your away as quick as a 4wd!
LOVE THE AUTO!!
Luke
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 04:07
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| thunderbird1 wrote on Sun, 16 June 2002 10:24 AM |
LEft foot on brake .. right foot on the floor... watch the boost guage, 1..2..3..4..5 (wheels start to churp slowly) Release Brake.. BANG 11psi instantly and your away as quick as a 4wd!
LOVE THE AUTO!!
Luke
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I still want to know though, what is taking all that stress as you rev it up? I still assume it's in first gear when you stop and idle, and the gears are spinning.
The manual has the clutch as the failing point, there has to be something similar in the auto.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 04:12
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I'm pretty sure it's the gearbox fluid.. but you it just gets hotter.
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 04:14
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Ok, cool.
I'm actually considering getting a seperate oil cooler for the auto. More a preservation thing than anything else.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
South of Wollongong
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 05:51
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Just on that topic of gearbox fluid....just wondering if i replace mine, would it stop a cyncro miss i have... 
i get a crunch changing down gears...mainly into 3rd and into 2nd...what do ya guys think 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 11:04
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Nark, doesn't the wheelspin take most of the shock when you dump the clutch? Thats the only way the 21R-C gets off the line without bogging down majorly, especially with the new tyres
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Banned member
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 11:21
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no dumping the clutch puts pressure on everything even the clutch and relted components
consistently dumping the clutch will result in warped pressure plate/bent, broken, twisted clutch springs (believe me i have fucked many)
think off all you components....engine, flywheel, gearbox, driveshaft, diff... then you rev the motor and dump the clutch, that is putting a hell of a lot of power/stress(as in more than a normal takeoff) through everything, dosnt matter what car you are driving, some cars will handle it better than others, some wont
before i got my current clutch, heavy duty rpm centreforce brass button (clutch spins faster with the revs, reduce wear in clutch) i went through four stock clutches in a year before i decided either i have to change to a stronger clutch or change my driving habits....
in the ra65 i usually rev to about 1500rpm then dump the clutch theres minor wheelspin but the front of the car lifts up and shes away
but in the ta22 (2tg, different clutch) i rev to about 3000rpm and slightly ride the clutch to get the bitch going, as there is no low down torque, i guess it comes down to what car you are driving and where the power lies
best bet would be to get it down the quarter mile on a test and tune day (cost about $10) try a few different techniques then make a decision based on your results
cheers
wayne
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 12:02
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| St3ve_AE92 wrote on Sun, 16 June 2002 3:51 PM |
Just on that topic of gearbox fluid....just wondering if i replace mine, would it stop a cyncro miss i have...
i get a crunch changing down gears...mainly into 3rd and into 2nd...what do ya guys think
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Has the oil changed colour?
If so it may be too late. But try a change anyway. You may want to change the filter in it too while you are at it. And give the magnets a clean too.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
South of Wollongong
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 15:03
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Apollo, not sure if the colour has changed. haven't checked 
What colour should it be? and what colour shouldn't it be??
Thanks for the tips anyhow...
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Location:
Sydney Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 16:21
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the brakes...??? ... basically its like driving along, in gear with your foot on the brake.. but your not moving!
The gearbox is in 1st, it is engaged and trying to spin. In the end your rear tires give way and they will bag up and cause you to do a BIG burnout  Also if the clutch packs in your Auto are stuffed, it will slip just like a clutch on a manual.
Luke
PS... correct me if i'm wrong.
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 16 June 2002 22:01
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| St3ve_AE92 wrote on Mon, 17 June 2002 1:03 AM |
Apollo, not sure if the colour has changed. haven't checked
What colour should it be? and what colour shouldn't it be??
Thanks for the tips anyhow...
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Should be dark red IIRC. If it's brown it's no good.
But how long has it been since it was changed?
Should be done every 50,000 or 2 years. But I think yearly would be best. Be very careful changing it too. It can get hotter than engine oil. 150c+
| Quote: |
Also if the clutch packs in your Auto are stuffed, it will slip just like a clutch on a manual.
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That can also mean you don't have enough fluid in the transmission.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
South of Wollongong
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Mon, 17 June 2002 02:51
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[quote title=Apollo wrote on Mon, 17 June 2002 8:01 AM][Should be dark red IIRC. If it's brown it's no good.
But how long has it been since it was changed?
Should be done every 50,000 or 2 years. But I think yearly would be best. Be very careful changing it too. It can get hotter than engine oil. 150c+
Yer, i'm not sure when it was last changed. only bought the car about 1 month ago. will definately get it checked out but...
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Location:
Sydney Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Mon, 17 June 2002 03:01
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my auto fluid stays red for about a day ... it is always brown! i have to sort out a big arse cooler for it cause it always boils on a hard run.
Luke
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Mon, 17 June 2002 03:49
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| thunderbird1 wrote on Mon, 17 June 2002 1:01 PM |
my auto fluid stays red for about a day ... it is always brown! i have to sort out a big arse cooler for it cause it always boils on a hard run.
Luke
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Gee..... I wonder why.....
Yea, I reckon an oil cooler for it is the way to go. I'm very seriously considering getting one.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth WA
Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Mon, 17 June 2002 12:36
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What do you do if your clutch packs (in your auto) are stuffed?
Can you replace them, if so how much?
(my box was leaking some fluid for a while so I think something is stuffed......urgh)
Cheers
Wilbo
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Mon, 17 June 2002 22:34
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Coolers:
What to look for is size, and how the hoses hook up. Don't get the cheap plastic hookup things that are only held on by a clip on the hose. A screw in is better with metal lines.
That's just my opinion and what I'll be looking for.
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Location:
Adelaide, SA
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Tue, 18 June 2002 09:19
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I had a look at putting an the 7M engine oil cooler back in the MA70 when the 1jz went in. There is not much room under the bonnet, but I have thought about mounting it behind the passenger side spotlight. Of course it means taking the spotties out, but then the drivers side can be ducted into the airbox.
In the High Performance Imports Toyota Special there is a WA based JZA with an oil cooler mounted in place of the spotlight. The empty spot looks pretty daggy though (and the cut out for the intercooler looks absolutely shit). If you want to keep it stock looking I have no idea where you can mount it!
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Tue, 18 June 2002 22:44
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I've got absolutly craploads of room under my bonnet and infront of the radiator to mount stuff so it can stay stock looking.
Even enough room for a powersteering cooler if I so desired.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Wed, 19 June 2002 08:48
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i was wondering how i should try launch in my rav (constant 4wd remember. i dont think mum will appreciate me holding 6 grand and side stepping the clutch . any advice.
BTW.. i won my first drag against a HQ ute  . im sitting pretty at one from one in the camel mobile 
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Wed, 19 June 2002 14:27
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Well I killed my AE92's 3sp Auto by manually downshifting too much. One day i was just driving down a street with my friend, car infront brakes suddenly, so I just slipped it back to 2nd slow down nice and smoothly, and there was a loud grating noise...
no drive to the wheels, shutoff motor, into park. started after 30secs of cranking. All ok, goto drive, very stuttery, vibrations aswell. Made it to the movies!
Drove it for another week and then going down a hill out to a job and it makes the noise by itself  . But when i pushed the gas it slipped in with a thud... then it did this everytime i slowed down from over 60km/h downhill, then 40km/h on a flat surface and downhill, then anytime I slowed down . Got it home...
OK, lets check the gearbox oil shall we, dip stick out, still a nice red colour. Look at rag I wiped it on, SILVER. DAMN.
Very costly experience, needless to say it now stays in D and is babied, ready to be sold .
Oh, I also used to blip the accellerator when it was changin, so this prolly helped kill it...
[Updated on: Fri, 21 June 2002 15:11]
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Thu, 20 June 2002 03:18
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We all should know to never manually downshift in an auto. But thanks to the story above we know what actually happens.
But startin off in 2nd, revving it out to 6k (redline at 6300 for me) in 1st then again in 2nd then shifting it into drive seems ok from my experiences so far. The only side effect would be a very hot transbox. Use it sparingly.
I found something strange though. Starting off with the shifter in 2nd actually starts off in first then shifts to 2nd. But as I've read around it seems to hold true that then while it's in 2nd it won't shift to 3rd, only when you put it into D it will go to 3rd.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Thu, 20 June 2002 09:28
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i got an auto ta22
in the book it says u can downshift to assist in braking.
is this cause they didnt know back then it fucks shit up ??
or could it be it has been designed for it, so it doesnt do any damage ??
hmm...
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Thu, 20 June 2002 11:18
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Sure it was specifically for an auto and not a manual outlined in the manual?
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Thu, 20 June 2002 12:36
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yep
heres a direct quote from the book under "driving with auto transmission"
"when reducing speeds, use downshifting to utilize breaking affect. You can downshift from D to L. First you must downshift to 2, then proceed to L." blah blah and so on.
However i think it says not to accelerate at the same time.
so same question as b4....u rekcon they didnt know it was fucking shit p back then ....or perhaps it was designed for it ??
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Thu, 20 June 2002 21:30
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My only thought is that they wern't as finely engineered back then as they are today and they had some tolerances.
Just think ak47 vs styer. You can drag an ak through water/mud and it will still work due to the 'loose' parts. As with a styer it's finely made and can't handle dirty combat conditions (It gets clogged up because it's too well made).
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 21 June 2002 05:17
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My Nova/Rolla's manual has the exact same quoute dude. .
So take the advice given and leave it in Drive unless you are at a dead stop. Chances are that in a full braking stop our lil motors won't help much at all .
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 21 June 2002 06:11
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hmm...k kool ..ta for the advice
i need my 2t for another 6 months or so b4 i get my conversion
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 21 June 2002 06:24
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Nah, torque converters arn't that good at engine braking.
It's cheaper to just run through a set of pads earlier.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 21 June 2002 15:14
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Yeah,
Well dude, if my car had held out till November, I'd have put a GZE in there... Now I have seen the light hehehe, sure would have been nice, but I now see how much of a prick it would be to work on when compared relatively to a RWD car such as the MA61 I hope to get at the end of the year .
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Toymods Board Member
I supported Toymods
Location:
Turramurra, Sydney.
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Fri, 21 June 2002 16:09
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I dunno, me and my brother both went through our Ls and our Ps on my mums auto pintara, and we thrashed the crap out of it. Great car. We hardly took the g'box out of 2nd.
I still remember the day my brother told me about keeping it in 2nd, from then on, I've always used the 2nd in an auto. 1st I don't waist my time with, as keeping your foot planted through first is hardly gonna get you over the speed limit, but keeping it in 2nd gives you the power to keep going up hills (plus there's alot of them in my area) and keeps you from rolling over the speed limit. Of course, when you get to hills 'n that, you shift to drive & use the brakes, but I reckon its changing gears in an auto that wears it out. At least it does the auto fluid.
The overdrive button is the same thing, your control over 4th gear in a 4spd auto, it's the people that drive around with overdrive on and in drive, that wear out their g'boxs with constant gearchanging, and slow us down when they try to stay in 3rd or 4th when they get to hills.
But my original point being, my mums old nissan pintara and her current 4A-FE corolla have put up with plenty of engine braking, and the pintara in particular, as it copped the worst thrashing (you know what P platers get up too, well times that by 2) never showed a hint of trouble with the g'box.
[Updated on: Fri, 21 June 2002 16:10]
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Location:
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sat, 22 June 2002 00:05
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Yes the constant gear changing does wear it out, I always turn off the overdrive when I hit a hilly area that would just be changing the gear back to 3rd all the time. The actual wear is really the fluid getting hotter from the extra gear changes.
It's not good to do daily driving just in 2nd though. It really does rev it's tits off, which equals a hot trans box yet again plus extra engine wear.
As for going down hills, overdrive all the way. It's really easy to get over 80kmph (in 60 zone) when just letting the car free-wheel down in overdrive, it's almost like neutral in a manual. All I gotta do is steer.
Actually, with cars slowing you down, I find it's manual cars that slow me down, because they have engine braking they don't have as near as good free wheel as me and I've always got to brake because of them.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: tips on launching techniques
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Sun, 21 July 2002 02:54
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re an earlier post....
1500rpm for a launch in an RA65?
I get mine up to 3000 at the very least ... you want your revs between 2500 and 4500 in that baby, at all times (if you want power)
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tips on launching techniques
