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Location:
Northwestern Sydney
Registered:
August 2002
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Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Sun, 06 April 2003 12:23
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I know this has been asked before, and I know that eventually someone will say "Do a Search"
I've done a search, several actually and all the threads end with "Do a Search" or the ones that have info seem to go nowhere.
I've considered doing this mod after reading Tim Frosts Article on his 2t. and wondered if it could be done to an 18r-geu. If so what setups could be used besides lowering comp. and attaching the s/c in the first place.
More to the point has anyone done it, seen it or know about it? and if so what are you running? and what sort of power figures are you getting?
Cheers 
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Sun, 06 April 2003 13:24
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Yes it can be done to an 18R-GEU; hell, it can be done to any engine. As for specific details of how to set it up, you're pretty much on your own there - not many people modify these engines any more, and those that do tend to go for N/A mods or turbocharging. That said, the 18R-GEU is an engine like any other engine so all the same principles apply.
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Location:
Northwestern Sydney
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Sun, 06 April 2003 14:01
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Thanks Norbie, I think I need to re aim the question a little
Obviously its an engine and in theory any engine can be s/c'ed or turbo'ed. By basic principles I guess you mean:-
Lowering Compression (if required)
strengthening bottom end
and for more power handling things like:-
bigger injectors
aftermarket emc
better spark
etc,etc,etc
I think I've done as much to the n/a engine as I can in terms of small (and by that I mean cheap) mods to get more power now I need to look into new injectors, after market ecu and all the things that cost loads of money. This will all happen in time however in the short term, for more power I was looking at running a supercharger at low boost for extra power.
I'm not power hungry...well I am but...I'm aiming to get about 120Kw at the wheels and I thing running an s/c would push me over the mark. I'm hoping to get to the dyno day to see what she has now (hopefully 90+)
I want to see if anyone has run the stock ecu with a s/c as I beleive in theory that with some work to the AFM the standard ecu could possibly cope up to a point with the boost. I may be wrong!!! but I would like to know if anyone has tried and succeeded before I try and fail.
this would give me extra power untill I get computers, injectors etc.
Any Comments??
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Location:
Rocky Mountains, Canada
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Sun, 06 April 2003 16:05
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It depends what compression your running at the moment if youll need to lower the compression ratio to run a SC14.
If you havnt altered the compression ratio from stock, then youll probably be ok. If it starts pinging you could try retarding the ignition and adding a little more fuel. If that doesnt help, then youll need to look at getting a copper head gasket made up.
Bottom end will be fine... dont need to worry about that.
An aftermarket ECU is always a good thing, no matter how modified the engine is. Try running with the stock ECU to begin with and see how you go. If it starts leaning out in particular areas, then consider getting an aftermarket unit.
Better spark... dont bother. Stock single coil igntion systems are good for up to around 8000 RPM.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Oyster bay NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Sun, 06 April 2003 23:48
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as M.W.P said
"Bottom end will be fine...
An aftermarket ECU is always a good thing...
Better spark... dont bother...."
For pulleys to drive the blower get a set of a 2Y hilux motor, has ribbed belt. mounts for blower you can use the aircon bracket on the side on the head, or try and mount it low else were. The throttle body will have to be put in the intake of the blower.
Motor should be fine up to 5psi if you have a low comp 18RGUE. and that should give you your 120RWKW.
You will have to fit a Higher pressure pump (VL turbo) and a fuel reg that will handle boost pressure, so your injectors still work fine.
If you go over 5psi you will need to change injectors and Definitely get and after market ECU.
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Location:
Northwestern Sydney
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 01:52
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At the moment the engine isn't really stock and I have no idea of it's comp. ratio.
Speaking to the guy that owned the engine before me.
The work done on it at the moment:- (alot doesn't make sense)
Heads ported and polished
Cams have been re ground
Hilux pistons (22re??)
Hilux rods (22re??)
Engine has been balanced
BMW M3 fuel pump from Surge tank
Lifter pump from tank
High pressure regulator (I don't think it does however)
I don't know about the bottom end.
He tells me it could rev to 11000 rpm (which I find hard to beleive) but I have seen it at 9000 Rpm (with alot of valve noise) personally I rarely push it past 7500.
He also tells me the comp. ratio is about 10:1 and that the engine was built to handle forced induction 
I am going to speak to the bloke who built the engine to find out more. In the mean time I am going to look at puting TRD or similar valve springs in.
The last time it was in the car it was out running v6 dunnydores
and worrying a few SS drivers mind you the car hadn't been properly tuned. I'm after a setup that will consistantly out run Gen 3 V8's.
I will be looking at a 1G conversion down the track, but that will be after I get a company car and can get the car off the road to do a full rebuild.
If these specs are correct can anyone work out what the comp ratio would be?? and if the power figure is near correct?
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 02:56
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We can't tell you the compression ratio without knowing the exact bore diameter and the combustion chamber volume. If the previous owner told you it's 10:1, that's probably what it is! Unless you have a specific reason not to believe him?
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Location:
Madrid - Spain
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 03:22
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If the cams have been reground and retimed to provide more overlap, you will be pushing a lot of fuel into the exhaust. Might be worth talking to the engine builder about the cam specs.
The 18R-G should respond nicely to some forced induction though. Have a look at some of the engine importers, You might be able to pick up one of a 1G or 4A - GZE.
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Location:
Northwestern Sydney
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 03:56
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Norbie, He tells me it revs to 11000 RPM, It's been bored out to 2380cc, the comp is 10:1 and it is built to suit forced induction. I was lead to beleive that one would lower the compression to apply forced induction and still have a steetable car?
Is that specific enough to not beleive everything he is telling me??
I'll hopefully speak to the builder later this week to find out more.
Crostek , What is the theory behind locating the throttle body on the intake of the blower??
Quoting from a previous thread on the subject:-
AFM = airflow meter.
But I think they measure this by how much the flap is open.
Now, pressure builds as soon as you have a restriction, so... at 1psi the AFM will be wide open, whearas in NA, this probably wouldn't happen until 6000rpm or so.
Soooo, if you can make the AFM stiffer, so that it only opens full at 7psi or so.... then you'll have some degree in variability of fuel in relation to boost.
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Me again, My theory (let me know if there is a flaw in my plan)
would be to run the blower in front of the AFM therefore the AFM would be in the pressurized area but would still be reading the amount of air that passes to the cylinders. there would need to be some valves from one side of the AFM to the other to regulate the boost, but wouldn't this fool the stock ECU into thinking that it is N/A and not s/c if the supercharger was running from the vacuum hose and not controlled but the ECU (as in a 4agze)?
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 04:01
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| Lambolica wrote on Mon, 07 April 2003 13:56 |
......the comp is 10:1and it is built to suit forced induction.
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Mutually exclusive.
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Location:
Northwestern Sydney
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 14:03
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another one, Can a supercharger (off a 1g or 4a) be run with out connecting to the ecu, I've tried to look at Tim Frosts site on what he did to his but the tech sheet isn't on there yet.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 14:07
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The factory ECU can handle modest amounts of boost with a bit of bodging, it that's what you mean.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Northwestern Sydney
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 14:09
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Define Bodging??
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 14:19
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Bodging = screwing with the airflow meter spring pressure, rising rate fuel pressure regulator, retarded base ignition timing, that sort of thing. You can make it work but it's not ideal! Obviously the best way to do it is to buy programmable injection and get it tuned properly.
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Toymods Social Secretary
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 16:00
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would a fuel only computer be sufficient for looking after the fuel/air side of things? Leaving igntion to remain dizzy controlled of course.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Mon, 07 April 2003 23:58
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Yeah you can get away with it, but again it's not ideal. If you're going to all the trouble of putting an aftermarket ECU in, you might as well go all the way and get a fuel/ignition controller.
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Location:
Rocky Mountains, Canada
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Tue, 08 April 2003 05:29
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| Norbie wrote on Tue, 08 April 2003 09:28 |
Yeah you can get away with it, but again it's not ideal. If you're going to all the trouble of putting an aftermarket ECU in, you might as well go all the way and get a fuel/ignition controller.
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If your going commercial, then yeh, getting a ignition+fuel over just fuel is worth the extra few $$s.
But when you have somthing like the MegaSquirt avalible, you have to rethink that as the MegaSquirt is CHEAP and covers all the functions of a commercial fuel computer besides seq injection.
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Location:
Northwestern Sydney
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Tue, 08 April 2003 05:36
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What do you guys recommend for aftermarket EMS Grim_1 was telling me about an Autronic?? EMS which I've never heard of.
and what is the cost of the system itself (if I were to install it myself) One that can be tuned via Laptop.
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Toymods Social Secretary
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Supercharging an 18R-GEU
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Tue, 08 April 2003 05:37
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thats the lines of which i was thinking!
cheap is good!
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