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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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 Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 05:32
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Hi All,
Last saturday i went to liverpool exhaust and asked for a 2" mandrel system from the cat back with a straight through stainless steel muffler. 
I asked for it be as quiet as possible. They said they could do it. but... 
When it was done, i thought, yeah..it's not too bad. I was wrong, it's SOOOO loud that when i accelerate, the sound pressure from the cabin gives people in the car a headache. 
But, i've been pulled over and told to change it, because it's OVER the limit.
Should i have to pay to get this changed to what i REALLY wanted?
Has anyone had any experience with Liverpool exhaust?
I went to Windsor exhaust after and got a new resonator and hotdog to make it quieter, didn't do much and is still over the limit. That's another $80.00 bucks of waste.
What can i do about this????????????????
Please help, i already forked out $530, and don't want to pay more for what they did wrong in the first place.
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanx.
[Updated on: Wed, 16 July 2003 05:35]
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 05:39
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I know how you feel. I just spent $480 on crappy King springs fitted and it looks and drives like crap. 
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 05:56
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xtigerx
I understand how you feel mate, but if you told Liverpool Exhaust that you didn't want it too loud and they gave you something that you were not happy with then you should not have taken the car or paid for it and asked them to put the stock system back on.
To be totally honest with you most exhaust systems / sports systems (other than standard) when put onto cars are all above the legal limit.
If you wanted it quiet and below the legal limit you should have kept the stock system on there.
You can put hotdogs on there and alike but it won't make much difference as you mentioned.
Best to go down there and confront them direct, but be nice about it. Over the phone people have more excuses not to speak to you or palm you off.
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Location:
c'town, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 06:00
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just out of curiosity what car/engine is it?
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 06:07
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If there's enough room put another straight through muffler in the system somewhere. I had a resonator and a big shiney N1 style muffler which was absolutely too loud. Droned quite badly too. I got the resonator cut out and a proper muffler put in. Now my car is very quiet, well until I put the boot in but thats due to the throttles. Quads are a glorious sound.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 06:53
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You've told them how you want it and then said "make it quiet".
Like saying:
I want a cake made from flour, lemons and oranges. But it MUST TASTE LIKE CHOCOLATE.
If you give them a recipe, then you can't complain about the end result.
Did you ask them "If I get a 2in mandrel bent system with a straight through muffler, will it be quiet?".
If you said you needed a "new system that was quiet" and thats what they put on, then you have grounds to sue them for the cost of the exhaust and the fine you copped.
Sorry mate, but to me you sound like a whining idiot. And they'd probably tell you the same thing.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
sydney.au
Registered:
August 2002
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 07:38
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resonators are put in to quieten the exhaust down.
I'd typically avoid them in favour of a 2-muffler system
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Location:
c'town, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 08:10
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i agree with Pete tho i'd be a little more tactful 
anyways the guys at liverpool exhaust are professionals, they well know that cat back exhausts are not for performance purposes but for noise/pose/bling factor only so they would have assumed u wanted it loud.
If you wanted a quiet exhaust u should have got a standard replacement cause a cat back 2" isnt going to do u any good..... unless u wanted it loud...
im sorry to hear that u got burned, but unfortunatley u went about this whole situation the wrong way...
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I supported Toymods
Location:
sydney.au
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 08:16
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guys
for an ae86
whats the best setup for 100% performance and 0% bling/rice/drone
twin muffler? does the pics above fit the bill?
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Club Member
Location:
Sydney, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 10:42
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My car was done at Liverpool exhaust... It is the dodgiest piece of crap that I have EVER seen and everyone that knows my car would know the horrible noise that it makes...
Thankfully the previous owner wasted his money on it and not me...
When I get the courage to spend the money, I'll be going to Hi Tech mufflers and getting a 2" Mandrel system, legal sound level and stainless for around $1000 with a 10 year warranty of everything...
My bro got the same and he and I are very happy with the work they did and how it looks and sounds...
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 10:45
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It's on a 2002 Corolla. 1.8 VVTi.
So, HKSPete, you're saying that it's impossible to get a reasonably quiet high flow system????
No way, i've spoken to some exhust places and they've said it is possible. IT depends on the quality of the muffler. If you get a cheap "made in China" with minimal to no sound absorbent material then of course you'll get an excessively loud exhaust. Magnaflow is a highflow but quiet exhaust. Remus is a high flow but quiet exhaust. HKSPete...well?
Unfortunately, I didn't specify the type of brand. All i specified is a high flow but quiet exhaust. Being liverpool exhaust and all, i assumed they were very professional and because of their reputation i presumed, "Yeah, they know exactly what i want and they know how to do it".
Wouldn't you expect the same?
I was only told later that it was a "cheap" muffler.
I'm going there tomorrow and hopefully they'll rectify the situation without charging me.
Liverpool Exhaust does a very good job in terms of workmanship, don't get me WRONG. Unfortunately, i didn't get what i asked for. So, hopefully it'll all go well tomorrow. 
Has anyone else had similar experiences?
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 11:04
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i think it also depends on your definition of "loud" and the exhaust shop guys definition of "loud".
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 11:29
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| HKSPete wrote on Wed, 16 July 2003 16:53 |
You've told them how you want it and then said "make it quiet".
Like saying:
I want a cake made from flour, lemons and oranges. But it MUST TASTE LIKE CHOCOLATE.
If you give them a recipe, then you can't complain about the end result.
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but if the "cook" said ok to it, then he's at fault, it's called basic decency to the customer
like rightprice exhaust in brissy, if u dont like the sound it makes they'll change the exhaust to suit for free {parts excluding of course}
thats service
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Location:
Sydeny
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 11:30
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I went there today and asked about an exhaust for my GZE AE92 sedan from the cat back. They suggested a 2.25 or 2.5 inch mandrel bent for $350. I then told him that it was going to the engineer to get the new motor etc passed and he then suggested that I come back after it gets passed. I told him I wanted it to be legal and his reply, It would be a waist as it would be to restrictive and quiet.
Went on to say that my 2 inch (not madrel) thats on it now from the cat back, would probably not pass a Decibel test and I think its pretty quiet and want more sound.
I was going to ask if anyone new some places that actually have experience with 4AG motors. So if you can help, please reply. Maybe I'll ring Hi Tech mufflers in the morning and have a word to them and stay away from L/Pool exhaust. Thanks, Kevin
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Location:
blacktown
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Wed, 16 July 2003 13:29
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i had an exhaust very similiar to the first pic in ae86drift`s
post. it sounded awesome, but had the tendecy to get caught on
the diff when going around left handers and it rattled underneath
the car like crazy.
I got it fixed to go over the diff by some exhaust shop, and the guy must of got his son to do it as there was huge bits of weld everywhere and the bends where a total joke, but you get what you pay for i suppose
i forgot where i was going with this, oh yeah  , ae86drift
unless you can get some short throw shocks for the back and avoid speed humps, try to avoid under diff exhausts like the ones in the picture ( i really miss mine though!)
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 17 July 2003 03:40
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By the sound of this latest post, you know some stuff about exhausts and mufflers (probably more than me). So I'll try not to treat you like an idiot.
My previous post above (which was quite harsh), was based on your original post.
I'll try to answer your questions as best I can. And I'll try and be more tactful.
| xtigerx wrote on Wed, 16 July 2003 20:45 |
So, HKSPete, you're saying that it's impossible to get a reasonably quiet high flow system????
No way, i've spoken to some exhust places and they've said it is possible. IT depends on the quality of the muffler. If you get a cheap "made in China" with minimal to no sound absorbent material then of course you'll get an excessively loud exhaust. Magnaflow is a highflow but quiet exhaust. Remus is a high flow but quiet exhaust. HKSPete...well?
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My car has a 3in mandrell system with cat, 2 mufflers (non straight through). It has passed emmissions test and noise test (89.7 dB). This to my knowledge is the best flow for noise for my car, so I DO believe you can get a resonably quiet (ie. legal), but high flow system. My own system could be better flow and more quiet if I use some expensive mufflers too. I might enquire about this with an exhaust guy.
I personally don't believe you can put a 2in system that you described above to be under 90 dB (legal limit). By all means a more expensive muffler could bring the noise down, but my knowledge of exhausts are that if you bring down the noise, then you decrease the performance/flow. The more expensive mufflers may use different material however which could keep similar flow (or better) but be quieter.
| xtigerx wrote on Wed, 16 July 2003 15:32 |
I went to Windsor exhaust after and got a new resonator and hotdog to make it quieter, didn't do much and is still over the limit. That's another $80.00 bucks of waste.
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Why didn't you get the place at Windsor to put on one of the more expensive mufflers if it would've brought it under the legal limit? Instead you changed your original design by putting in a new resonator and hotdog.
| xtigerx wrote on Wed, 16 July 2003 20:45 |
Liverpool Exhaust does a very good job in terms of workmanship, don't get me WRONG. Unfortunately, i didn't get what i asked for.
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Again mate, it sounds like you got what you asked for, but they put on their usual muffler instead of a high-priced muffler. I totally agree with you that they should've told you that if you wanted it quiet, then there is an option of a more expensive muffler.
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 17 July 2003 04:21
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Ahh exhausts and 4age engines... I've tried to shut mine up and it seems impossible. Should have just kept the original exhaust on.
2inch with 2 mufflers, resonator, cat and still is very loud and drones. It's imbarrassing to give the car a bootfull as sounds like a buzz box.
Maybe the trick is expensive mufflers..
Anyway this is quite an informative post cheers
Joel
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 17 July 2003 07:30
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I cant believe you guys are having such troubles
I've got a full 3" system with a single muffler. no cat and no resonators, and it's a good noise level.
but I've heard turbo engines tend to be a lot quieter (plus the 1jz being a lot newer)
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 17 July 2003 13:11
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Went to liverpool exhaust today.
they want to charge me another $100 for a 2nd muffler to replace the resonator i just put in. Yeah right!
guess i'll have to drive around with the silencer on and fully closed. so much for high flow.
*the end*
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 17 July 2003 22:45
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| draven wrote on Thu, 17 July 2003 17:30 |
I cant believe you guys are having such troubles
I've got a full 3" system with a single muffler. no cat and no resonators, and it's a good noise level.
but I've heard turbo engines tend to be a lot quieter (plus the 1jz being a lot newer)
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I got a 3" mandrel bent from them... not very loud as it s a turbo engine.. i am happy...
though if u get a system, it will 99% of the time be loud my friend ...
hard to get a soft exhaust system !
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 17 July 2003 23:28
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Yeah I think with a turbo it is a whole different ball game.
My 3t-gte I started once with only a dump pipe and even then the noise level was almost acceptable.. Whereas the 4AGE with only a dump pipe will have people a block away hearing it.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 17 July 2003 23:29
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Turbos quieten the exhaust down about the equivalent of a muffler and a half. (I recon)
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Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 02:24
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There is a total conflict of interests in an N/A exhaust system
Do you want max flow/power?
Do you want noise/note?
| Quote: |
Last saturday i went to liverpool exhaust and asked for a 2" mandrel system from the cat back with a straight through stainless steel muffler.
I asked for it be as quiet as possible. They said they could do it. but...
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To me you want a note, and yes you have specified a system for them to install. Remember, the factory system is always a compromise between power, emmisions and noise limits.
My exhaust was 89.8db on my MA61 and that is loud, but legal, you seriously don't need more noise than that, but i specified 'maximise flow and minimise noise' and yes they installed a magnaflow muffler, the whole system straight through.
Its all about compromise, if you want a note, swap the muffler, if you are after power, swap the whole exhaust, not cat back.
And if you want increased power with minimal noise you will have to look at a compromised setup, perhaps look at 'turbo mufflers' which bend back on themselves internally to reduce noise levels.
hope that helps
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 02:54
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Given that most of the performance gains from an exhaust occur in the first metre, it's always 'interesting' to see this sort of discussion.
Cat backs are perfect for Hyundais and Lancers.
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Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 03:12
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 04:00
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from experience... hyundais and lancers DO NOT need a full exhaust system !!!
however if u have something worth doing up .. i.e. twin cam, vtec, turbo, supercharged then yeh go for broke and whack a full system on... otherwise, just put a friggin milo tip on in ! hahaha
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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 Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 04:32
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I think some of you guys need to hang around 4As to truly understand the plight of 4A owners.
I've helped stick all kinds of exhausts behind 4As and all of them have ended up LOUD.
Haven't heard a quiet one apart from David Kaing's who got fed up with it all and stuck his stocker on (behind his 4A-GZE...  ).
4As are loud. Full stop. Don't know why, but they are.
My car without a muffler was only barely noiser than Pete20V's car...
As for the 1ZZ, I've seen a few with exhausts on and haven't noticed that they're very loud...
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 05:12
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| Nark wrote on Fri, 18 July 2003 14:32 |
My car without a muffler was only barely noiser than Pete20V's car...
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Interestingly (side note), turbos many years ago were sold as 'mufflers' and 'fire retardants'.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
melbourne.victoria.austra...
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 08:25
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my lancer had a different rear resonator, made it go a hell of a lot better but shit it droned.
the exhaust shop i used these days lets you try different resonators - with my vt2 thats what i got and i got a better note and no drone. i know its not a 4AGE
stick with good quality resonators and mufflers. don't dodgy yourself on cheaper shit coz you will end up with drone/boom.
and yes turbo cars and much quieter than NA cars.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Fri, 18 July 2003 23:18
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speaking of most gains made in the first meter...
was talking to an engineer from turbo excess yesterday (apparently they're a very cool performance company, but I've only heard of them once or twice)
he was saying even their 450bhp rexies only run a 2.5" system.
the important bit is the 4" dump pipe.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Sat, 19 July 2003 13:40
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man i havent seen pete and his 20v for ages!
so is it impossible to get a good and totally legal sports system
or is it just too expensive? does pipe material affect the db level? stainless, mild steel, titanium etc...
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Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Mon, 21 July 2003 01:12
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Sadly Pete and the 20V have gone their separate ways. He now drives an S13.
As for the exhaust, it's pretty hard to have a legal exhaust that flows well. I heard a rumour that Falcons out of the factory don't even get under the 93dB (or whatever that mark is).
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Mon, 21 July 2003 06:43
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| Nark wrote on Fri, 18 July 2003 14:32 |
I think some of you guys need to hang around 4As to truly understand the plight of 4A owners.
I've helped stick all kinds of exhausts behind 4As and all of them have ended up LOUD.
Haven't heard a quiet one apart from David Kaing's who got fed up with it all and stuck his stocker on (behind his 4A-GZE... ).
4As are loud. Full stop. Don't know why, but they are.
My car without a muffler was only barely noiser than Pete20V's car...
As for the 1ZZ, I've seen a few with exhausts on and haven't noticed that they're very loud...
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...Depends on the exhaust, IMHO.
Mine, for example, runs a 4-2-1 extractor (header?) system, into a 2.5" full exhaust system, with 4000cc cat, 1 muffler and 1 resonator. Yes, it CAN be heard, but it isn't "blatty" or overly loud like some others I've heard going around...
Goes alright though!
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Location:
Carlingford, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Liverpool Exhaust
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Thu, 24 July 2003 00:13
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| Quote: |
guess i'll have to drive around with the silencer on and fully closed. so much for high flow.
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it sounds like you have a rice (cannon) muffler on the back
these thing do nothing but make it louder anyway
i havent heard a car with 1 that sounded good
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