| Author | Topic |
|---|
Location:
Laverton, Vic
Registered:
July 2003
|
 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Mon, 21 July 2003 03:21
|
 |
I'm getting either one of these engines, both at the same price, so it's just a matter of choice really. here's the deal. I'm getting either the 100kw 4age 20v or the 100kw age 16v. What's the difference apart from the number of valves of course, and which would be better?
It's going into a KE-20 Corolla, gutted for racing and minimum road use (in other words it'll be registered in Vic). Damn light car. It'll be a RWD, I'm also probably going to throw a turbo on, 4 wheel discs, bigger diff, and possibly Gear box if need be. any suggestions on these parts would be good as well.
So really I need to know what the difference between the two is, and Which one would be easier to work on, and repair with out having to take it back to a mechanic all the time because of computer issues.
Cos it'll be used for sprint racing, I want to be able to fine tune, and repair most things my self.
Please let me know what you think.
|
|
|
Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Mon, 21 July 2003 04:08
|
|
You really sure it's a 20V?
The 20V makes about 114kW or so from memory... Also the rocker cover is pretty unmistakable... Looks much nicer than any other 4A.
This is what a 20V looks like:
|
|
|
Location:
Laverton, Vic
Registered:
July 2003
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Mon, 21 July 2003 04:10
|
|
|
not really sure on the K/w's but i am sure on the 20v or a 16v engine, I know it's not the lesser power ones (about 86kw)
|
|
|
Location:
Cabramatta, NSW
Registered:
May 2002
|
 Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Mon, 21 July 2003 05:02
|
|
If they're the same price, go for the 20V! That's a no brainer...
Unless the 20V was in really bad condition...
|
|
|
Location:
brisbane queensland
Registered:
January 2003
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Mon, 21 July 2003 07:47
|
|
i think it really just depends on how meny k's each of them ahve done and what comes with it. i.e. loom, ecu, gearbox.
but if they are identical then i would definatly go with the 20v. 
|
|
|
Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Wed, 23 July 2003 04:21
|
|
You also need to think about what you are prepared to do to the car. To fit the 20V in a KE20, you have to decide if you're going to keep the original dizzy and thermostat setup and chop the firewall (OK since it's a race car) or do what I did (see pdf document in gallery). If you use the factory computer remember it runs an AFM so you need to mod the plenum to face the right way etc. If you use aftermarket computer you can chuck the AFM and dizzy and kill a bird and a half with one stone (still have thermostat probs).
The 100Kw motor is probably the easier option. The only real mod you need is the plenum reversed, the other stuff you can source from the RWD 4AGE's. If you are definately going turbo you will probably want to do something about the gearbox too since a T50 is on the limit with a ZE.
Hint: ask around here for who NOT to get a conversion bellhousing from.
Post up here when you decide and let us know how the results go. Mine should be fired up in a week or so (FINALLY!!!!)
|
|
|
Location:
Laverton, Vic
Registered:
July 2003
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Wed, 23 July 2003 05:40
|
|
|
So in a KE 20 I'll have to move the Dizzy and the plenum (what is the plenum?) the thermostat is still going to be a problem hey? well to put some more info down, the KE-20 i have is a from scratch build, literally. at the moment it's a shell with wheels axles, a steering wheel, and that's it. no wiring at all so stuff like the computer and that is no prob as there is nothing in there at the moment. um what's AFM? so I'll need to change the gearbox for something bigger obviously. i wasn't sure about that I was considering if I was to change it to through a Supra gearbox and diff on. I also want 4 wheel disc's what are some suggestions for that? the car is to be built from nothing, so stuff like that are good to know now so I can do it straight away. also I got told that the dizzy was going to be a prob if I turbo the 20v with this whole computer change will that in turn make it easier?
|
|
|
Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
|
I supported Toymods
Location:
sydney.au
Registered:
August 2002
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Wed, 23 July 2003 12:38
|
|
|
ive heard the 20v doesnt get as much raw power but apparent the torque curve is more useful
|
|
|
Location:
Sydney, OZ
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Thu, 24 July 2003 05:04
|
|
|
Dave loftus runs a 20V starlet in IP racing, and using a fairly standard bottom, 150Kw@wheels was acheived, the new one, using some very serious gear is hope to see way over this figure and a 12K redline! Have seen a 16V do that yet... That why that AWD rolla at the dyno day is believable... and I have a fair Idea on what's been done....
|
|
|
Club Member
Location:
sydney
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Fri, 25 July 2003 10:32
|
|
Hey John, hows he keeping the crank and rods together at 12K?
I would have to guess custom rods and crank??
I doubt the 20V stock would handle that for too long?
|
|
|
Location:
Sydney, OZ
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Sun, 27 July 2003 02:44
|
|
|
Well, the rod's are custom, but the crank is suppost to be a standard 4A forged item... but he is using the taller 7A block, that's main secret. From that Micheal I'm sure you know how he's doing it!
|
|
|
Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
May 2002
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Mon, 28 July 2003 11:53
|
|
OK, the plenum in the big chamber on the intake manifold (I think "plenum" is latin for pressure). On FWD cars it usually faces towards the gearbox (except in GTi swifts) which, when you mount it RWD, means it goes right up against the firewall. On my car, which sounds exactly like yours, (ie. unfinished KE20 with a 20V conversion) I am using an aftermarket computer with a crank angle sensor. This means I have chucked the dizzy and airflow meter (AFM) and will simply have trumpets and socks on the throttles. The thermostat housing was the bigest headache, as I mentioned, check out the gallery section on this site. It has a PDF file that youngy made of my conversion, mostly just the tricky plumbing. If you are serious about a turbo I would probably recommend looking at a CA-18DET. I know its not a toyota engine but the cost of doing a decent RWD turbo 4AGE will be far greater if you take into account the stuffing around fitting a supra box (or even a quaife sequential six speed). But if it MUST be a toyota engine and you want to go turbo I'd stick to the smallport, the 20V will be more hassle than it's probably worth.
So if the engine is to remain stock the 20V would be the go, if you're game to take on the hassles of fitting it. But if you want a turbo, go smallport (or nissan), or even better, start with the supecharged motor. But you can see the problem with building a turbo 4AGE, is that you need to buy parts from 3 or 4 different engines to build one decent one, plus stuffing around getting it all put together and tuned properly...
In the end it's up to you though. And if you want more detailed info on the 20V swap email me.
|
|
|
Location:
Melbourne - NthSubs
Registered:
January 2004
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Thu, 08 July 2004 04:59
|
|
|
any one know the weight diffence betweens a 16v n a 20v????
|
|
|
Location:
Melbourne - NthSubs
Registered:
January 2004
|
|
Re: 4AGE 20v or 4AGE 16v????
|
Thu, 08 July 2004 04:59
|
|
|
and yes i know this is 1 year old but i didnt want 2 make a new thread
|
|
|
Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
July 2002
|
|
|
