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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Fri, 25 July 2003 07:28
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Lately I have seen a couple of people saying they have blown there torsen diffs. Do you guys know what oil you put in the diff? No so much what brand but the type.
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Fri, 25 July 2003 10:45
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well since its a torsen it doesnt need any special diff poil that a clutch pack LSD would... so you could get away with any of the name brand oils
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Fri, 25 July 2003 12:21
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Thanks Simon...
Anyway what I was trying to ask was if the guys that have wreaked torsens were putting in LSD oil instead of the proper regular oil and this might be who they blew..
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 28 July 2003 02:04
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i doubt it would cause it to BLOW as such... it may wear out quicker or it may loose some its ability to transfer torque (not 100%) but i doubt it would cause distruction of it.
I'd say the reason people are blowing them is that they are a diff designed for circut racing type work.. not on the limiter with slicks drag stip work!
if thats the application in mind.. ppl would be better off fitting a Spool.
i havent however heard of ppl blowing torsens on the street tho..
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 28 July 2003 09:34
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I am guilty of that, lsd oil in a Torsen LSD. For a long time I didnt know that i had a torsen LSD, as i couldnt identify the diff codes and my model was not sposed to have one as far as i could tell. There is no external difference either.
I was running the oil put in by my gearbox mechanic who Probably just looked up the code for an MA-71.
It was only recently that I found info to confirm my diff center was Torsen, but since it had worked quietly and problem free for nearly two years of hard driving I didnt rush to change it.
The way it failed was no small incident. The hemisphere collapsed catastrophically, actually broke in half releasing all the small gears inside. it destroyed the outercase as well and broke an axle.
when we took the (broken ) case cover off there was nothing to unbolt just a few wacks with a copper hammer to unlock some jammed peices and the rest fell out.
I miss it though
i have a clutch type lsd now and it sux in comparison.
looking at air lockers 
Matt
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 28 July 2003 11:45
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an air locker is a bit extreme for a street car isnt it? its either locker or it isnt! what about if you want some slip limiting on a windy road? u cant!
what about an aftermarket LSD such as a TRD Torsen diff, these would be much stronger then the factory type torsen.
i note you smashed the housing tho.. so even if u went an air locker in this housing whats so say you wont smash it again?
i would look at either modding an existing housing for strength, cross bracing and so on or doing a larger diff upgrade!
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 28 July 2003 11:56
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I dont want any slip action at all.
I either want a locker or I want it to freewheel when i am commuting or the missus is driving in the wet.
I am actually also very close to just getting a full spool made up for it. Only the tyre wear is holding me back.
A full locked diff is the ONLY effective option on a race/drift track.
I dont think case strength would really come into it as mine only broke when impacted by the rest of the diff internals.
Does anyone know if a jza80 diff would fit
guts only or case and all ??
i actually have one on hand.
Matt
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 28 July 2003 12:22
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Simon, TRD only make a clutch type LSD for the G Series diff.
A friend has one.
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 28 July 2003 22:32
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Im pretty sure they make a torsen as well...
or am i thinking of the JZA80?
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 28 July 2003 23:57
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| Yojimbo wrote on Mon, 28 July 2003 21:56 |
A full locked diff is the ONLY effective option on a race/drift track.
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Drift? Sure. Race? Bollocks! Sliding all over the place is never the fastest way around a corner (unless you're on dirt).
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 00:15
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| Simon-MrRx7 wrote on Tue, 29 July 2003 08:32 |
Im pretty sure they make a torsen as well...
or am i thinking of the JZA80?
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Nope. All Clutch packs for both the A70 and A80 diffs.
A80 Diff Part number 00602-31201-010 US$737.31
A70 Diff Part number 00602-31201-011 US$560.41
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 00:57
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drift? i said drift? i meant drag what was i thinking!
btw... most race cars run spools..
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 02:49
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I think you'l find most track cars do not run LSD's, but intstead run welded diffs or spools (same effect - no slip action). I have in the last 4 weeks driven identical cars with the three different diff setups, Torsen (mine), Clutch LSD (mine) and GIG locker (Andy's) and on the circuit the CIG had better grip in all situations better drive out of corners and better handling all round. The clutch type was the worst by far, and the torsen was nice around town and the trafic light gp, however obviously not strong enough for comeptition.
Evey race car I have known of has had a welded diff or locked (spool) diff. And there has been more than a few, hillclimb cars and circuit cars alike, not all small budget stuff either.
Locked diff is definately the best competition option by far.
Matt
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 05:27
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The clutch type LSD that you drove may not have had enough preload tensioned into it, this would give the feeling of openness and poor locking up/limiting slip effect.
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 05:47
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Oh yeah it is rooted!! that is why i am investigating options for a replacement.
I still stand by my statement about Fully locked diffs, it was surreal the amount of grip provided by this setup. And yes i drove the same car beofre and after the modification.
Matt
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 06:21
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Perhaps you should try driving a car with a well setup LSD... you might be surprised to find they have lots of grip also, without tearing your tyres to shreds and/or snapping axles!
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 07:39
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Can you try putting a tighter spring in your current clutch one? I don't know much about diffs, but I've heard that if you put a bigger/tighter spring in then the clutch will grip closer to a locker.
Problem is, it would require dropping it and stuffing around with it again.
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 07:49
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To R&R the diff is no big deal if it is only once more , i need a solution that wont break the axles or the bank EVER again.
And it has to Limo whatever abuse i give it.
At this stage I am probably gunna just get the clutch type recoed, as 1600 or so for an air locker is too much, but i have to find a diff rebuilder who wont build in the idiot factor . too many of these diffs (owned by friends) go single spinner after a few months of abuse (no burnouts).
Matt
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
March 2003
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 07:51
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| HKSPete wrote on Tue, 29 July 2003 17:39 |
Can you try putting a tighter spring in your current clutch one? I don't know much about diffs, but I've heard that if you put a bigger/tighter spring in then the clutch will grip closer to a locker.
Problem is, it would require dropping it and stuffing around with it again.
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They use thicker shims to tighten up a clutch LSD - there isn't any springs
Norbie is spot on, get 1 rebuilt properly and it'll be very effective.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
March 2003
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 07:57
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| Yojimbo wrote on Tue, 29 July 2003 17:49 |
To R&R the diff is no big deal if it is only once more , i need a solution that wont break the axles or the bank EVER again.
And it has to Limo whatever abuse i give it.
At this stage I am probably gunna just get the clutch type recoed, as 1600 or so for an air locker is too much, but i have to find a diff rebuilder who wont build in the idiot factor . too many of these diffs (owned by friends) go single spinner after a few months of abuse (no burnouts).
Matt
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Well they can't be that bad, a good friend in Adelaide has run over 60 or so passes (12.01 @ 113mph) with slicks in his Supra without busting the diff (I *think* he's busted 1 axle though, will have to check on that). The diff had been rebuilt with thicker shims and is still going strong.....it'll be tested just how strong it is soon though
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Location:
On your mum!
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 07:58
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Yojimbo is absolutely correct when stating that a locked diff is the only type to have for all out competition (V8 supercars all use full spool centres not to mention go karts have no form of diff centres last time I looked).
The only thing that I have against locked diffs is that when used in conjunction with radial tyres, broken axles are somewhere in the near future.
Yojimbo if you reckon that the clutch type sux then spare a thought for those of us currently using cone type LSD 
Good news, we can replace horrid cone type items with detroit lockers  yay
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Location:
On your mum!
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 08:05
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P.S call me an idiot if you will.
The LSD additive from Holden (Liverpool - Mc Grath? stock it)
Shits all over the standard type "LSD" oil when used in conjunction with a clutch type limo.
Much punishment was dealt to a 12 bolt GM using this additive to the limo oil - no problemo. Lit two every time - sideways at will, in a 2 tonne car.
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Tue, 29 July 2003 10:11
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Music to my ears Jason !!
All I want is an indestructable, cheap, Full on competition setup that isnt difficult or illiegal to drive everyday and in the rain by anyone ....
Is that too much to ask ?
Matt
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Location:
Osama's hideout
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Wed, 30 July 2003 02:44
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Matt,
i have just changed over my diff from my brothers grande as it had had less abuse and was much tighter than mine. when i spoke to my old mate erin at toyota he did investigate and apparently these clutch type LSD's can be shimmed up to make it as tight as you want.
he does have the part numbers for the job
hope this helps
shane
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Wed, 30 July 2003 04:05
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Nothing is indestructable you have to remember that.
But there is nothing wrong with a well built and pre loaded clutch type LSD.. If you're breaking other parts of the diff (such as C&P or casing) you need a beefier unit.
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Wed, 30 July 2003 07:50
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| Yojimbo wrote on Tue, 29 July 2003 20:11 |
All I want is an indestructable, cheap, Full on competition setup that isnt difficult or illiegal to drive everyday and in the rain by anyone ....
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Cheap, Reliable, Performance.
Pick any 2. You usually cannot get all three.
Toyota's are never cheap.
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 04 August 2003 00:33
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Wastegate, you say others have reported blowing torsen lsd's...
Do you know how they blew or under what conditions ?
I strongly suspect my failure was the result of a bearing failure during the prelim burnout at the creek, made worse by inadequate lubrication from the incorrect oil. As well as previous abuse - it used to whine like an old woman (duck for cover).
All things considered, I am going to try another toyota torsen unit, reco'd and the correct oil, I hope it holds togther.
Any thoughts ??
Matt
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
March 2003
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 04 August 2003 04:44
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I suppose the Torsen in the *A70 is the same as the JZA80 Torsen?? How much power with street tyres would the diff handle? Would it be able to handle 400rwhp??? You guystalk about rebuilding the diff, is this a costly exercise?
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Location:
On your mum!
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 04 August 2003 08:46
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Yojimbo - do you reckon that the oil really had anything to do with the failure? I personally wouldn't have thought so as you still gear an extreme pressure oil (even if it has additives).
Can any one say for sure if the limited slip additives actually reduce the oils ability to lubricate?
We are probably all familiar with the term "oils aint oils" but how that applies in this scenario I am unsure.
Looking at the photos supplied, it looks more like a material failure/defect in the actual hemisphere.
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Banned user
Location:
ADELAIDE - The Drift City
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 04 August 2003 09:03
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yes im inclined to agree... for one thing torsens dont need a special LSD oil unlike a clutch plate LSD does.. and if you put the wrong oil in a clutch plate LSD it wont explode.. it just will wear out at a much quicker rate with also the polibility of it not operating properly.
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Mon, 04 August 2003 09:24
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Not sure if the oil was much of a factor, its lubrication qualities must be different though, considering lsd oils intended purpose, perhapps these just do not suit the requirments of the highly mechanical torsen unit...
In anycase I think I will take a chance and install a good condition torsen with new bearings and the right oil, + hope for the best.
Really only clutching at straws, my tyres are just about shagged so i am considering playing with a CIG locker till they are completely dead, and then just use it for competition and putin the torsen for the street, its not a huge job to change it.
The torsen is the superior unit though compared to everything else I have driven, it is good everywhere.
Matt
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Registered:
March 2003
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Location:
Newcastle
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Thu, 09 September 2004 13:19
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OLD THREAD
does anyone know where I can get some LSD additive for my AW11 Clutch type LSD??
Thanks Guys!!!
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Thu, 09 September 2004 23:32
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LSD additive? Why not just use LSD oil?
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
November 2004
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 Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Fri, 04 March 2005 13:49
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anyone have any bits left over from there busted torsen diffs?pm me...im after the worm gears..
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
November 2004
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Sun, 06 March 2005 00:03
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Location:
tas
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Sun, 06 March 2005 11:28
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i Highly DON'T recomend castrol LSD oil. MAJOR clutch chatter at low speed while cornering.
What can someone recomend me for a good oil for a cluth type G aeries LSD?
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Registered:
March 2003
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Re: Question for JZA70 Owners with blown torsen diffs.
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Sun, 06 March 2005 17:44
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I love my Torsen!
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