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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Wed, 12 November 2003 08:50
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so, anyone wanna tell me that Feral4mr2's piston was not ceramic coated??
the following are FIB (focussed ion beam) secondary electron images. the magnification and tilt are shown in the bar at the bottom.
overview of the coating.
close up of the coating. the coating varies between 8 and 15 microns in thickness.
as you can see in this pic, the surface is slightly rumpled, due to the variations in coating thickness.
last pic, you can easily see the chamfer that is on the outer edge of the piston crown, approx 45 degree angle, approximately 0.33mm in width and height.
i will be checking the composition of the coating on the new GZE piston....
Cya, Stewart
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Wed, 12 November 2003 09:02
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i can see what pic 3 and 4 are but what exactly am i looking at in pic 1 and 2
btw that a mighty fine digi cam there 
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Location:
Perth
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Wed, 12 November 2003 09:06
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To me it appears to be the piston coating. Pic 2 is zoomed in giving a better indication of thickness........
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Wed, 12 November 2003 23:48
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Stewart - There's definately a coating there, how can you tell that it is ceramic?
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Thu, 13 November 2003 02:21
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Heya,
sorry, the coating is the black layer. there is a bit of other crud on the surface which is lighter, and there is a second light phase which seems to be growing thru the ceramic layer in places as well...
btw, all of the surfaces you see in the images are tilted at about 45 degrees to vertical, so to measure the size of something, meaure it, multiply by 1.41 (square root of 2) then compare to the micron bar on the bottom right corner.
Gabe is right, the third pic is the crown of the piston and the 4th is the edge of the crown. the micron bar at the bottom of the 3rd and 4th pics os 200 microns = 0.2mm.
yup, not a bad digicam for 1/2 to 3/4 million  these are pretty compressed jpeg, so loses a fair bit of quality....
Ben, i cannot confirm that it is ceramic as yet, but i have a good feeling that it is. in the FIB, ceramics tend to have lower levels of electron emission when they are struck by the gallium ions. this is basically because the ceramic is made up of lighter elements like:
alumina = aluminium and oxygen
silica = silicon and oxygen... etc
also, i have recently been doing some consulting work on electronic chip modifications, where i was cutting thru both alumina and silica layers to get to tracks, and the response of those materials to the ion beam was very similar to the dark layer on the piston.
i will be testing the layer, when i cut up the new piston, with an X-ray diffraction machine, which has been optimised for layer characterisation. the results will tell me the size of the interatomic spacing of the layers in the crystal structure, and from that i can deduce what composition the layer is, since most materials have a unique combination of structure and spacing...
Cya, Stewart
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Thu, 13 November 2003 02:29
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| oldcorollas wrote on Thu, 13 November 2003 13:21 |
i will be testing the layer, when i cut up the new piston, with an X-ray diffraction machine, which has been optimised for layer characterisation. the results will tell me the size of the interatomic spacing of the layers in the crystal structure, and from that i can deduce what composition the layer is, since most materials have a unique combination of structure and spacing..
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I thought it would be something simple like that
I might just stick to the bite test from the other thread.....
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Toymods Social Secretary
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Thu, 13 November 2003 13:41
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yes - very scientific it is!
Here's a challenge Stewart - see if you can find the teeth marks!
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Location:
Montrose, VIC
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Thu, 13 November 2003 22:37
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I'd love to see what the busted end of my conrod looks like that close up! 
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Thu, 13 November 2003 23:12
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| THE WITZL wrote on Fri, 14 November 2003 00:41 |
yes - very scientific it is!
Here's a challenge Stewart - see if you can find the teeth marks!
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LOl, if you bit hard i will find them... i found fingernail marks the other day!!
MrShin, i'll have a look
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Sun, 23 November 2003 01:34
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stuart - I gotta ask, what do you work as, where, and please tell me it's not all as cool as it sounds from this brief overview 
jeez, and I thought playing with moderate strength lasers, thermite, and (accidentally) creating cyanide gas was fun
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Sun, 23 November 2003 04:42
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| draven wrote on Sun, 23 November 2003 12:34 |
stuart - I gotta ask, what do you work as, where, and please tell me it's not all as cool as it sounds from this brief overview
jeez, and I thought playing with moderate strength lasers, thermite, and (accidentally) creating cyanide gas was fun
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i work as a post-grad student (just have to finish writing up my PhD thesis.. almost done..) and i also do Post-Doctorate research at UNSW, in the Materials Science and Engineering school, and also the Electron Microscope Unit. so i do everything from high temperature oxidation of jet turbine blade alloy coatings, to metallography, to electron microscopy of coatings and oxidation products.
heh heh, i used to do the Thermite demonstrations at uni open days (before safety was more of a concern), and when i was doing Carbo-nitridation of heat resisting steels, i had saturated sodium hydroxide bubblers to scrub the cyanide produced during the reaction
basically, i play with expensive toys (the microscopes) react expensive alloys (most have around 50-80% platinum, with some rare earths chucked in for good measure), and generally try and look at things on the limits of the analysis techniques i use (ie nanometer oxides, 0.1 microgram resolution balances)
the piston stuff is something on the side that i'm doing because i can, and because it's interesting to use the toys for a practical application..
dunno, to some ppl it's interesting, but i think others would be bored shiteless sitting in a dark room for 12 hours at a time looking at a 6" diameter flourescent screen....
Cya, Stewart
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Broken 4AGZE piston analysis-part 2 (4 pics, so might be slow)
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Sun, 23 November 2003 04:49
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sounds great to me
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