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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 03:20
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OK.
Main question is above, Do I get a "new" imported 7MGTE ($1800 from SSS Automotive, with full wiring loom/computer).
OR Do I rebuild my current one?
At the moment I'm not sure if mine has a. forged pistons, b. metal head gasket (MHG) (been told it has).
If it has forged pistons I think I'd try to keep them, to keep the price down.
How much would a rebuild cost roughly? What should I get done?
The reason why is because my no. 6 cylinder is leaking 74%. and compression throughout is a bit dodgy. I'm switching my computer to a Delco either way (got someone to tune it as the guys at BD4s cost me $400 for a pressure test and a leak test. Both of which I didn't ask for. And they didn't know what a wastegate venting to atmosphere sounds like "The car was pinging" stupid idiots.)
If I can spend around the $2,000 for a bottom end rebuild (keeping the forged pistons in) including a 2mm stopper HKS MHG (about $700).
Sorry about the life story, but needed to get the right answers.
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Location:
U.S.A
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 03:36
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It all depends on the age of your current motor. If itt's pretty old (high milage) then I think it'll be best to get a new used motor with low milage. Because rebuilding the one you have will cost as much or even more than the new used motor. 
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 04:59
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80k on the clock.
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Location:
Lost in the K hole
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 06:07
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what do you mean by rebuild the bottom end exactly?? i mean if youre planning on including a bore/hone, its unlikely that you'd be able to reuse the pistons as you'd obviously need the next size up. then theres the problem of if its been bored already during its last build (when the forgies went in), as to whether or not the cyl can take another bore (MAX is 85.5mm, and acl only do a 40thou over (84mm) piston anyway).
all depends on the bore cond i guess, but if its in the slightest bit dodgy, id bore em. hell if the engines out, why not.
then you'd be looking at a possible crank grind, full balance, bearings, rod re-bush, oil pump (perhaps), seals, welch (sic) plugs, rings, block deck. then head: valve seats, grind, seals, face. and thers the possibility that your cam journals/bearings are dead which means at least a new cam, perhaps a new head.
if it all goes to hell and you end up not going for the rebuild, depending on size/condition of pistons, i know someone how would be very interested in buying them 
cheers
ed
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 06:41
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All that sounds very expensive. I might end up just getting an import.
How much are the pistons worth IF they are forged? I'm gonna bring those injectors over, and keep the current turbo/exhaust manifold. But probably sell the rest (if I can) and also sell the old wiring harness, new wiring harness (off the import), the prc f-con that is piggybacking the factory computer. Probably the HKS electronic boost controller too. So I might end up having a fire sale.
For sale:
HKS electronic boost controller (can't remember the model number, will post it tomorrow) and manual.
2 Wiring harnesses for 7MGTE
HKS PRC F-CON fuel computer
engine leaking in 6th cyl (did 172kW at dyno meet @ 8psi)
HKS exhaust temp guage (orange on black)
(possible) HKS boost guage (orange on black, 2 bar)
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 07:57
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I looked into this a while ago when I was thinking about putting a 7M-GTE into my MA61. I had a 7M that needed a rebuild, so I did the maths and came to the conclusion that an import engine would be considerably cheaper than a rebuild. Then I realised a 1JZ wouldn't cost much more than a 7M... then I found a 2JZ that wasn't much more than a 1JZ... and the rest is history.
Anyway, I have a friend who blew up his 7M, and he came to the same conclusion I did - a rebuild isn't worth it. He bought an import 7M and swapped it in, and the thing was like new. Unfortunately he neglected to re-torque the head and blew the headgasket, but that has since been fixed and it's running great now.
The moral of the story: get an import engine, and torque it down before you start it!
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 08:24
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Throw it away !!
get a 1J
Matt
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 08:32
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Depending on who you got to do your pistons, anywhere from 1100-1500 for 6 forgies. Add that to the cost of a good rebuild. Not a good idea unless you are looking for some serious horsepower.
Get a 'new' 7M, redo head gasket with a MHG (remember to deck the block as well as the head), plug in and play.
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Location:
Canada
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 10:42
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Gianttomato has it right.
If you decide not to rebuild,
fixing the H/G right before it goes in the car is the only way to go.
If you go to that length, you may want to disassemble your motor first to find out what it needs.
You said the Comp. test was done without your auth?
Why not get it double checked elsewhere first.
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Location:
North Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 11:26
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Personally i'd go an import 7mgte, without the comp. and loom which should be cheaper. Somewhere around $1400
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Location:
Lost in the K hole
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Tue, 06 August 2002 12:29
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where abouts are you in syd??
i wouldnt mind having a look at the block if you decide not to rebuild it. depending on whether or not its been bored out in the past, and what the condition of things are like, i could be very interested in it.
cheers
ed
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Wed, 07 August 2002 00:23
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Problem is I don't know whats in my current engine, and there is no way of knowing unless I open it up is there? If I open it, I don't know if I'll be able to put it back together and drive it to work the next day.
.. what does "deck the block" mean?
A different engine (like the 2JZ, wouldn't do the 1JZ) isn't really an option, as I'm on a budget, want to keep the current turbo (T04E, rebuilt 2 months ago), and a gearbox change is out of budget.
How much would just changing the rings and putting in a new MHG (with a small shave to get it even)?
Am in SW sydney.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Wed, 07 August 2002 01:49
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Decking the block is where the top surface of the block (where the head gasket sits) is machined flat, just like the head. This will require complete dismantling of the engine so the engine machinist can work on a bare block. The actual machining costs the same amount, but clearly there is a large component of labour involved with dismantling the engine (which you can save if you do it yourself). That said, it is worth doing if you are interested in longevity/reliability, particularly in non standard applications. Often this step is missed (for obvious reasons), resulting in recurrence of the BHG problem.
Personally if I were pulling it apart, I'd check tolerances and consider freshening it up with new bearings and rings. So either way you won't get out of it ultra cheaply.
Cheers Dave.
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Location:
Canada
Registered:
August 2002
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Location:
North Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Thu, 08 August 2002 03:00
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Fuck off ED!!!! I've already sent him a PM about the block,etc i knew it wouldn't be long before you asked for his old one.
You couldn't resist could you, what are you after every 7mgte block in Australia. What do you need it for??? Your building a NA 7MGTE and you already have that 7MGTE block you got off Allan while i was in hospital!
Are you under some sort of idea we will be invaded by 7MGTE munching aliens and your stock piling in your 7MGTE Bomb Shelter?????????? How much stuff have you got in there!
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Location:
Lost in the K hole
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Thu, 08 August 2002 04:01
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paul, settle!!
i dont actually have that much stuff. and that 7mgte block i just got off allan left my hands practically the day i got it. I just wanted the head off allan's one to get the springs, valves and bits off. the rest i gave to you remember
the only reason im after another 7mgte block is so that i can grab the crank and rods out of it, so i can grace my na-mobile with oil squirters! thats all!!
anyone have a 7mgte crank and rods they wanna sell me??
cheers
ed
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Thu, 08 August 2002 04:33
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My supra is a GT model, so its got a digital dash, does anyone know if this is going to be a problem with changing the computer?
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Location:
North Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Fri, 09 August 2002 14:13
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What comp are you going to change it too? Is there a need?
Chech your PM's Pete i just sent you the ultimate plan.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Sun, 11 August 2002 23:16
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I'm putting in a Delco as I know a guy that tunes them. I got the wiring loom out of a JE Camira last weekend, my tuner has checked it to be ok except for a distributer modifying that he's looking forward to converting with the direct fire plugs.
I'm currently thinking of just rebuilding my current engine, will save a lot of time and hassle, might cost another grand, but I'll keep the forgies and injectors etc.
Nothing is final yet though. Once he works out how to convert the distributer over then it'll be off the road for at least a weekend, then I'll start looking at getting a new engine, etc.
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Location:
North Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Mon, 12 August 2002 01:08
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Personally i'd be whacking a microtech on it. $1095 takes about 5 hours from start to drive to wire it, it can be tuned anywhere even by yourself. So you dont have to go back to him everytime you want it tuned. Has inbuilt igniters also:)
Also i've never seen a distributer on a 7mgte? Where is it located?
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Mon, 12 August 2002 02:01
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It doesn't have a distributer, thats the problem, its got a little thing, that has the insides of a distributer (in that it connects to the same part of the engine), runs at half the speed of the engine, and has only one lobe. This lobe tells the computer when its at the no. 1 cylinder. This is how the standard computer knows which cylinder to play with.
As for the location of this device, which I'm not sure of the name. its just on the side of the first cylinder, has 4 wires coming out of the plug (red/green/black/white i think).
It can be modified to act like a distributer if some of the internal lobes (below the single one) are taken out, as there are roughly 16 lobes on it. problem is 16 doesn't divide by 6. The guy putting the computer in is currently playing with one off a 1G engine (same part) to work with the direct fire plugs of the 7M (don't know/care if the 1G has direct fire)
Reason for going delco is: both my brothers are running delcos, one with a 73 corolla with a 3TGTE, other one with a sprinter and a 4AG. The guy doing the tuning has a 3TGTE with stock internals (never opened it at all) and is running 24 psi boost as it is properly tuned. If I've got a MHG and forged pistons and a Garret T04E on the side I'm hoping to run some stupid boost, and this guy is gonna help me keep my engine in one peice.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Mon, 12 August 2002 02:41
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The thing you refer to is the cam angle sensor. You could use a 7MGE dizzy if push came to shove. I thought Toyotas had 24 teeth (which makes life easy) but I haven't ever seen the insides of a CAS.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: New 7MGTE, or rebuild current one?
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Mon, 12 August 2002 03:37
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yeah 24 would be good. I can't count over 16 on my fingers/toes/? as I need one hand to do the pointing 
anyone got a dizzy off a 7MGE lying round?
I could rip it off my '86 model, but I sold it yesterday (happy boy!! - 9 grand!) so don't think I should pull stuff off it.
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