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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Thu, 19 February 2004 11:49
 
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ive found out that its the air valve
what do the 3 hoses usually connect too.
Also got a question about the hose conection on top of the throttle body.
Its got 1 labeled (C) i assume thats canister
And 1 labeled (N) where does this connect too?
Thanx
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Thu, 19 February 2004 12:46
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One of the one's on top of the throttle body connects to a/c idle up valve doesn't it? Can't remember other ones without looking and tracing them back.
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Club Member
Location:
sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Fri, 20 February 2004 06:16
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if your not running aircon block off the two at the top of the TB theyre for aircon idle control and charcoal cannister.
The two 10mm pipes out the bottom goto the coolant lines from the back of the water pump ( rwd pumps and lines) . they are the idle up temp lines
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Fri, 20 February 2004 06:20
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The one on the side of the throttle body was the a/c idle up - not top sorry
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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Sun, 22 February 2004 11:58
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The 3 hoses at the side of the throttle body(rocker cover side) are not connected to anything, what do these normally conect to?
Thanx for the help so far
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Sun, 22 February 2004 12:47
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Will take a pic and label them for you if I get a chance tommorow - I'll do my best in tracing the lines and finding out what they go to  . My 4age is in a standard AE82 and is a blue top (blue writing).
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Sun, 22 February 2004 15:00
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Awaiting labelled pic.
My 4age doesnt want to idle when its cold.
thanks heaps highrolla
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 00:04
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Here are some pics. I've got to go out now so will describe later just thought I'd get them up for you to have a look. SOmebody else may have better idea than me anyway! 
Below pic shows the line to A/C idle up valve - this line lets in more air if a/c on so to bump up the revs at idle. Connection is below the one that's blanked off (maybe the one blanked off for p/steer or something my car doesn't have)
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 05:22
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1st and last pics are showing what the top hoses are doing. Furthest back is sucking? air from the charcoal cannister and the closer one is hooked up to the thing near the air filter? Hopefully somebody else can help with what this is does..
2nd pic showing the line to let air in a/c idle up (lower) top one blocked off.
3rd and 5th show the VTV and its hoses not sure what this is. 4th photo a bit random
You can also see the 2 coolant hoses attaching in the 3rd picture and in the 5th again. On the bottom that is. It seem like they both come or go to lines that are after the thermostat. I'm not sure whether these coolant lines serve the cold start injector, as the cold start injector is in the middle on the front of the intake plenum (is that what you call it?).
Also check this site:
http://www.mr2mk1club.com/repairsp59.html and scroll down to Removal and point number 2 shows the start of the hose removal.
ae95 I've heard guys here succesfully running the car without the cold start injector connected. Mine runs at 2000rpm for a few minutes with it connected, so I thought yours shouldn't really have too much trouble if that's not working properly. Maybe disconnect the electrical connector from the cold start injector - see if this makes any difference, if it doesn't then it may be wise to fix up something to do with that injector... providing the car is running well otherwise.
Anyone that figures out what all the pipes exactly do it would be good to add to this post for future reference . good luck bmak
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 05:44
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I think those two coolant lines operate the auxillary air valve -not the cold start injector (the injector is seperate to all this). This makes minor adjustments to idle speed depending on engine temp. Just reading from the website in last post under Idle comments (have to go back to repairs index page).
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 10:04
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so the one on the top, closest to the TPS goes to the charcoal canister...
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 10:32
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Yep that's it. Check last photo. Does anbody know if it would matter if you swapped them around (ones on the top that is)? I haven't touched them since I got the car which was 3 years ago so I assume they're correct.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 10:50
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cool... i needa connect that up, will do that tommorrow...
thanks for that...
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Location:
Menai area of Sydney
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 11:12
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The two pipes with plastic caps over them (one bent & one straight)(in pictures 2 & 5) are for power steering idle-up if you have (a) power steering and (b) the model of steering rack that has an idle up switch on the top where the steering column universal joint is.
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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 12:07
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Thanx for that
I'll run the (C) conection to the canister & the rest i have no need for.
highrolla: I would leave your hoses connected with the (C) going to the canister.
When i was checking the top 2 fittings they were ported to different areas of throttle body.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 12:35
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No worries bmak
Oh ok bmak I won't mess with them. You got the coolant lines sussed etc? Is the engine running or you in the middle of conversion (or near end maybe).
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Location:
Menai area of Sydney
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Mon, 23 February 2004 12:37
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Make sure you block any unused tubes on the throttlebody so you don't get any problems with fast cold idle etc.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 09:13
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Referring to your labelling system...
In my car No.1 and 2 are blocked off (See pic 1). No.3 goes to funny thing mounted near air filter box (what is that f....n thing). No4 goes to charcoal cannister. Lowest red circled is to a/c idle up (if your's is same..see my pic 2), above that is blocked off ...maybe psteer that my car doesn't have. Then in mine there seems to be one above that that isn't blocked off  or is that something else?? I don't know what that vacuum port is in your thottle body. I thought for idle there was a channel around the throttle "flap" that could be adjusted with the screw to change idle speed. Please correct me if this is bs. I haven't had much experience playing with em..just providing the pics and had a look where they go etc. Oh..I adjusted the A/c idle up about a month ago so the car didn't stall at lights when a/c on..that was sweet, had the car for 2 years before I knew it existed 
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Location:
Vic
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 09:57
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its all sorted now
Thanx everyone
I'm putting the motor in my ke70. It should be ready to start tomorrow nite.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 10:18
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Sounds exciting  ...let us know how it goes
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Location:
Menai area of Sydney
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 12:03
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If you blow into the big thick pipe at the bottom, air will come out of the "vacuum port" (if it's not blocked). From what I can work out, this is a cold idle adjustment that is used to adjust your idle speed until the engine water heats up the idle valve under the throttle body. As the engine warms up, the vacuum port gradually closes. So I believe that what people are calling the A/C idle up is a combination of idle-ups and the device attached to the airbox allows filtered air to be fed through to the vacuum port and the amount of air (which decides your idle speed) is controlled by another adjustable valve in the vacuum line. I have tested this idea by having a cold engine with an unblocked idle valve, starting it up and it idles at about 3K, then gradually moving my finger across the vacuum port to slowly block it. As the port is blocked more and more the idle will drop. As the engine warms up, the volume of air through this port drops so there is less effect on the idle and when the engine is warm there is no air passing through the port. The water heated valve below the throttle body is referred to in some workshop manuals as the idle motor. The actual A/C idle up or any other idle up is connected through the top of the throttle body and increases the air flow into the plenum by bypasing the throttle butterfly and hence increases the revs slightly.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 12:42
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I don't know if I'm quite with you on that - I know what I've shown as the A/c idle up (marked in red) works when the car is warm. Pic 1 of my pics shows the a/c idle up control valve in the top right (right of windscreen wiper motor). This takes air from the air box - follow the pipe from the valve (you will see). The air is then drawn in through the lowest one on TB (marked) taking air from the outlet of the valve. I know this for a fact as where it connects to the air filter box I disconnected it - with the a/c on you could feel the suction, and turning the A/c idle up valve changed the amount of air sucked and hence idle speed. This was all done on a warm motor. I don't know whether this would be different on later GE's as mine is one of the earlier ones. I'll have to read scorps' reply again. The water heater connections at bottom of TB operate the Auxillary AIr Valve..i don't know whether this is referred to as an idle speed motor - maybe the GE doesn't have one?? I've read about idle speed motors before though..thought all EFI cars have one
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Now as well as the above electronic controls there is also a purely mechanical device which operates as the engine warms up - the Auxiliary Air Valve. Thankfully its much simpler than it sounds -its just a waxstat valve that controls a small air bleed around the throttle plate. When cold it is open, so giving a lift in idle rpm. As it warms up (its fed by coolant), the wax capsule expands and progressively closes the valve to stop the air bleed and hence the rpm lift. It is physically located under the throttle body and is a simple bolt on unit.
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Have a read hear - these guys seem to know what they're talking about
http://www.mr2mk1club.com/repairsp15.html
We're making a meal of this one aren't we
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Location:
Menai area of Sydney
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 14:00
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To make my reply a little shorter ...
Anyone experiencing high or low idle speeds when the motor is cold needs to adjust the amount of air going through the auxilliary air valve ("vacuum port") by adjusting whatever is connected to that vacuum line.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 15:53
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onyl thing i dont understand is which pipe you are referring to when you say "big thick pipe"
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 24 February 2004 23:44
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He's talking about what I've shown as the vacuum line to A/c Idle up as it is thicker than the other ones (i think). BTW I think the auxilary air valve is independent of the top vacuum hoses from what I've read.
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Location:
Menai area of Sydney
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 03:30
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Right on both counts HighRolla. 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 05:12
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So where does this pipe connect to? Can anyone take a pic? Mine has been blocked off, so that would be why the car doesnt idle properly.
thanks guys
-Ian
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 05:27
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What? you don't have the 2 coolant pipes into your throttle body?? i inlet one outlet i assume
Is this what you're talking about:
Those pipe should be connected.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 05:42
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im talking about the bottom red circled pipe, the one which is on an angle. isnt that the auxilary air valve?
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 05:56
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On mine i'm pretty sure that's the a/c idle up (the one with angle on it), actually I'm sure of it just takes air in depending on whether a/c is on and how much the valve is open. The AAV is activated by the water temp and uses those 2 coolant hoses i showed in last post.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 06:34
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ok i traced the hoses and they lead somewhere under the inlet manifold. What could go wrong with this? as my car idles at 3k constantly when i uncover the port. a faulty temp sensor of some sort?
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 06:43
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Are you talking about the coolant hoses now??
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 07:14
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lol yep
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 07:53
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too many hoses . When you said you "uncover the port it idle at 3k" - does that mean that you took the coolant lines off and left it open? I'm hoping somebody else can help you cause I'm struggling Maybe you need a new Auxillary air valve...
please read this from start to finish:
http://www.mr2mk1club.com/repairsp15.html
An extract from here says that when it's faulty idle speed usually increases so maybe this isn't the case or yours is a different case of same prob. But if you've got 5 min read the link above so you don't start tearing things off and jumping to conclusions.
| Quote: |
This feedback indicates that the Auxiliary Air Valve (AAV) is perhaps the biggest culprit for both hot and cold idle. This makes sense - it is a waxstat device - and the wax capsules do leak eventually - so the valve no longer opens and shuts when it should. The principle is similar to the thermostat in the cooling water system.. (The AAV is a bypass air channel around the throttle plate meant to lift cold idle rpm and be shut when hot.)
Given the age and mileage of all our cars this is quite plausible - loss of wax means it could be more open than it should be - hot or cold. This then means that both hot and cold idle revs are affected - upwards.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 08:57
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im talking about the port inside the throttle body
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Location:
Menai area of Sydney
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 11:37
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I'm probably confusing everyone by too much info and not enough access to motors to test what I'm saying. However, the port inside the body is for the idle air valve and is fully open when the engine is cold. As the engine warms up, this valve is closed off more and more as the temperature rises and the idle gradually drops from around 3000rpm to "normal". If you restrict the amount of air going into the thick inlet pipe on the bottom of the throttle body, you can reduce the fast idle from around 3000rpm to whatever figure you want.
I have looked at several cars over the last few months to try to understand how that air is regulated but nearly every car is different. From what I can see, vacuum valves are used to adjust the fast idle and idle ups such as A/C are linked to let additional air in when the idle needs to be increased due to load. That's why it looks like the thick pipe goes to the A/C idle up ... because it does but that's not all it's connected to.
This url has some interesting info on how the idle air valve works - from page 10 on for 4Axx engines and page 14 for 4AGE.
http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/h26.pdf
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 12:27
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Hate to keep the post going but on my 4AGE that lowest pipe that I've marked as A/c idle up which scorpion thinks is a combination (fast idle etc. ..if this is what you're saying) is connected to that valve near windscreen motor. before I adjusted it this valve was almost fully closed and would not suck any air in even when A/c was on. However when my car was cold it would still idle at above 2000rpm showing that it does not affect cold idle. I adjusted this valve so it was open somewhat and hence when I used my a/c the idle speed increases to compensate, before engine would stall with A/c on. This valve is electronically controlled and gets a signal from the ECU that the A/c is on..otherwise it is fully closed when A/c off. So I'm pretty convinced this is only A/c idle up not anything to do with cold idle adjustment.
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Location:
Menai area of Sydney
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 12:56
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On reflection I think HighRolla is right. Sorry for all the pain but at least we've had a chance to thrash it through. Now I have to work out how people can reduce their cold idle from 3000 down to 1500 or so because this will all be ahead of me when I finally get to complet my conversion ... well my engine's actually.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 13:10
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Read end of p9 and start of p10 that's for the GE. It dicusses the type of valve then lists the engines that feature it. See on p9 the blowed up pic of the on/off control VSV. That's like the A/c valve located near the windscreen motor in my pic1. This is also the case for the line that runs from the top of the throttle body to that thing near air cleaner box. This is probably activated by demisters and other littler things hence the reason for the smaller pipe. The A/c drains quite a bit so requires a bigger pipe to gain more air. AAV looks after cold idle (coolant pipes).. i think.
Thought I had it now confused again - i've seen that pdf before, it confused me then now its confused me again. Information can be dangerous 
Your chance to talk now scorps. It's too hard trying to work out what these little jap geeks have designed "ahh mr. toyoda..we'll trick them with this one..  " jap to english translation
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 25 February 2004 13:31
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Just saw your reply then Scorpion.. ihad been procrastinating over my reply for like 20mins. Yeah we haven't solved Ae95s prob. AE95 you're talking about the on on the "flap" now are you? I don't know anything about that..sorry
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Thu, 26 February 2004 02:43
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If anyone cares..the vacuum hose on the top of the throttle body which goes to funny thing near air cleaner box is used for idle up of rear demister, lights, interior fan etc. I just tried this and it sucks in air whenever one of these is switched on (I took off the hose that is the inlet to the valve, connected to air cleaner box on little T branch and you could feel the suction). Sorry ae95 doesn't help your prob
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
May 2003
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Location:
Wollongong
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Tue, 19 July 2005 10:31
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I know how old this thread is but i'm currently doing the same job as this with my 4AGE.
There is the hose running from the throttle body to a small white/silver plastic box hanging of the airbox.
Then from this is another hose running to somewhere. Does anybody know where this one runs to?
Thanks
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Location:
Lara, Vic
Registered:
February 2005
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Thu, 21 July 2005 08:25
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There are two pipes onmy 4age thorttle body that when you use the correct Power steering rack, they conenct up to. Not sure why the hell the p/s rack needs vacuume, but it does.
If you take one of these hoses off, the car will idle at like 3 grand.
The others on mine are the A/C and the CC,
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Location:
Wollongong
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Thu, 21 July 2005 12:51
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It's all sorted now, but thanks anyway.
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Location:
Malaysia
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: 4AGE hose identification
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Wed, 28 September 2005 21:04
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HighRolla,
I'm currently investigating on some idle-up issues on my 16V redtop. That device with the green electrical connector with a hose running to it from the top of the TB (second hose from top) - is that the idle-up valve? The other hose that comes out of it, where is that connected to? I think I'm missing that valve as I can't locate it anywhere in the engine bay and my N-port is blocked - which results in rpm drops when any electrical load is applied.
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