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Registered:
May 2002
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 Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Mon, 26 April 2004 13:37
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Hi guys ... after driving down to W'gong (to go deep sea fishing which I highly recommend! hehe) fourth gear in my sprinter pops out when I am driving ... sort of pops half way out so it is disengaged, but if I try to pop it back into fourth, it crunches ...
This is when I am just driving normally ... Any idea why this happens ? Do I need to replace anything i.e. the whole gearfckingbox ?
(Ps to Sprinterboygze - u used the original T50 in the Sprinter correct?)
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 00:55
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If u have ur fot on the gas and suddenly back of will it jump out?
if it is then the syncro is gone
If u have the money i thing rebuilding is the best... or swap it for a better box that fits ur car
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 00:57
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i can have my foot still on the gas and it pops out !
what is the synchros and how much are they to buy / get a shojp to fix ?
if i wack in a new gearbox it will suffice ?
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:03
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The syncro allows the gear get into gear without double clutching. It helps match the speed with the flywheel and engine.
Im my car i had the same problem but with second gear (i hear a lot of peepz get it with 2nd)I got a 2nd hand box from japan but it wasnt that good... im getting the same problem again.
Is the clutch slipping at all?
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:06
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ahh thats right read bout it late last night but forgot whathefuckit was alrady nice ....
what is your car box combo ?
so should I pick up another gearbox from another sprinter ?
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:11
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I drive a celica with a 3sge
Seriously i dont know what other boxes go into the hachi roku, u might have to wait till later in the day when more peepz come on to find out.
But if possible try not to get just a second hand one... cause although the toyota boxes r though... they arent bullet proof... specially for the older cars. So see if i can get a hold of a rebuilt item or rebuild urs.
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:13
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oh and in answer to your question bout the cluth - no its not slipping
rebuild it .... ok better make some calls round to see what ppl are charging these days for this sorta work
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:19
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hey... u can always just hold it in gear!  
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:21
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thats gay ....
i have been doing that 
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:24
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But if u tell them that 4th gear synco is stuffed they should just fix 4th
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:29
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its all usually one piece.. so it gonna have to all be replaced..
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Ademelaide, SA
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:35
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| SoarerFury wrote on Tue, 27 April 2004 10:59 |
its all usually one piece.. so it gonna have to all be replaced..
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uhh...no it's not.
you can buy 4th gear synchro new from toyota, and it's around the $50 mark.
pretty difficult to rebuild without the right tools tho... 
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:38
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wheres the best place to get it rebuilt ? any recommentdations ?
do I need to get i rebuilt ?
otherwise my mate and i can just put the 4th gr synchro in ourselves ...
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:40
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yea.. ur right there.. but i was thinking about another box.. $50 isn't bad.. but what sorta tools.. splicers?
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:43
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just called up $800 to rebuild .. not a cheap fix at all !
the guy said it may be ball and joint... or the synchro ...
looks like i will just do a home job then !!
thanks fellas
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Ademelaide, SA
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:43
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take it to a toyota dealer, and see if a mechanic will do it for cash...go to the workshop..not the main service desk.
or, take it to a gearbox specialist.
normally, you need a press, dial indicator, and a range of circlip pliers.
$50 was the price last time i bought one...
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 01:51
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hmm it does not crunch so it should not be the synchros ...
dog teeth maybe ? i think i will just get a new box ..
lookin at 500-600 just to rebuild 4th gear alone
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Location:
Albany WA
Registered:
October 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 10:48
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Rebuild: Pricey.
A guy is working on W series gearbox adapters, but he cannot produce yet. I have no idea where the shifter is going to come out, but I think this is the only alternative for me.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
sydney.au
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 11:13
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buy another t50
end of story
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Location:
Albany WA
Registered:
October 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 11:29
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Depending on what it lives behind.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 12:18
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try some different gbox oil or anti friction additive first I would be. Our family corolla used to do that in 5th. I'm not sure what we did to fix it. I read on the net somewhere what the supposed solution was..maybe search around.
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Location:
Eskilstuna, Sweden
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 12:58
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| wraith wrote on Tue, 27 April 2004 20:48 |
A guy is working on W series gearbox adapters, but he cannot produce yet.
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Do they go by the name of Dellows?.........
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Tue, 27 April 2004 23:19
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| HighRolla wrote on Tue, 27 April 2004 22:18 |
try some different gbox oil or anti friction additive first I would be. Our family corolla used to do that in 5th. I'm not sure what we did to fix it. I read on the net somewhere what the supposed solution was..maybe search around.
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ok will try thanks !
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:16
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ok now someone tell me how the fck to drain the gear oil and refill and how many litres of it do i need ??
its a 4agze - anyone have any pics to assist ?
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:22
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if its a T50 then there are 2 plugs on the gearbox. One to fill one to drain... The fill ia about half way up on the passenger side of the GB, the drain is right below it... take these out, drain it and fill it till oil is the level of the fill plug. You can use an oil pump or something if you find it difficult to fill it (i got one for something like $7 from supercheap). Oh yeah, make sure you get the fill plug out before the drain plug, otherwise, if the fill wont come out, you will have a gearbox with no oil! (although you could just remove the shifter and fill from there  )
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:23
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Draining the oil is easy, just remove the plug on the bottom. Filling is easiest through the shifter hole inside the car. The catalog where you buy oil should tell you how much it needs, but the easy solution is to open the filler plug and pour in oil till it just starts to dribble out the hole.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:26
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do note that you need to have the rear end jacked up when you are filling it so the oil can run forward into the gearbox.
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:35
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oh what brand gear oil do u recommend ??
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:39
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Redline Shockproof, but if you're unsure if the box if really permanently stuffed, you might wanna go something cheaper
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:41
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Castrol Syntrax. 75W90
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:45
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kmart ?
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 01:50
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Bursons, Repco.
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Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 08:06
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Check out this website - they're talking about C series gbox, not sure if the same problem for your T50. It's a bit of a tough one.. you outlay on good oil and products when they may not work...then you're down close to 100 bucks and your time. If you buy a box try and get a warranty on it or kow that it's decent.
http://shell.deru.com/~sgn1/AW11/Enginere.htm
Here's the text if you can't be bothered going there (pretty long):
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Transmission syncro wear and the infamous 5th gear popout
The 85-86 Mr2 had the C-50 transmission while the 87+ NA models had the C-52, which was an upgraded and strengthened version of the C-50. This included stronger input and output shafts with larger diameter bearings on some of the
gears, along with updated syncros. The C-50s are notorious for having what's been described as the 5th gear popout. This is where 5th gear will pop out engagement when the throttle is applied. Some C-52s also have this problem. The trannys will also sometimes have bad 2nd or 3rd gear syncros. While one might think that these trannys are not that great because of all these problems, this is not entirely true. If treated correctly, with a somewhat periodic changing of the tranny oil, a C-50 or C-52 can handle great amounts of power and last a long time. If you have the 5th gear pop out problem, first check your tranny and engine mounts to see if they are worn out and causing too much engine movement. After that, some have been able to stop the problem by replacing the 5th gear and synchro, others have not. John Welch gives the following:
Having rebuilt several C-50/C-52's I think I have a pretty good idea what causes the 5th gear pop-out problem, and how to fix it.
The majority of the problem is the drivers habits, and improper lubrication.
The design on the "C" series of trannys requires that the fluid be kept at the proper level, and be in good condition. It does not have a "pump" to circulate the fluid, it relies upon the movement of the gears in a bath to move the fluid throughout the trans case.
The use of a good quality fluid that is replaced every 20K miles should be considered "standard" for this trans. I use Redline MTL-90 and am VERY happy with it. You may have good results with other brands, or weights, I'm not here to debate them, but I like the Red Line.
The cause of the pop-out is not the syncros, hubs, or gears.... it's from wear on the main input shaft, and output shaft bearings. The output shaft is almost submerged in gear oil, the input shaft however is partially out in the open, This is the one that shows the most wear.
The nature of helical cut gears (used in almost all production manual tran's) is that they run quiet, but the down side is the power that is lost through the axial loads placed on them and the bearings. Helical gears are constantly exerting a liner load down the length of the shaft that they are running on. This translates into a higher bearing load.
The "movement" of the shifter that you observe when changing throttle inputs is actually a display of the movement of the gear shafts inside the transmission, and play in the bearings.
The solution is to replace the main bearings, and make sure that the pre load on them is correct when assembling the trans, and use a good lubricant.
As for the strength of the "C" series of trannys, there are weak one's, and strong ones... Some have additional webbing on the outside of the case and others don't. I have been running a "webbed" C-52 in my 1987 MR-2 for quite awhile now.... and although I only get about 7K-10K miles out of a transmission, I consider that the cost I must pay for pushing 22psi into a 4AGE motor.
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P.S. I don't know if we ever fixed our 5th gear popout on the family rolla (I was only about 12 when we sold it..more than 10 years ago) so don't bank on the change of oil/additives I was talking about. We've used slick 50 before and had some good results in terms of smoothness of shifts but a lot of people reckon it does nothing 
Good luck with it
[Updated on: Wed, 28 April 2004 08:31]
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Location:
Albany WA
Registered:
October 2003
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 14:55
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| Youngy wrote on Tue, 27 April 2004 20:58 |
| wraith wrote on Tue, 27 April 2004 20:48 |
A guy is working on W series gearbox adapters, but he cannot produce yet.
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Do they go by the name of Dellows?.........
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Bloke goes by the name Aaron Bremner. Got back to me pretty quick when I mailed him. Hope he can solve his supply issues.
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Sprinter Help - 4th gear pops out when driving
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Wed, 28 April 2004 22:39
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youngy, do you have his email addy? where abouts is he?
is he making bellhousings?
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