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Location:
melbourne
Registered:
November 2003
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st162 possibilities?
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Tue, 08 June 2004 09:55
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im just wondering if anyone has a st162 sx with the original 3sge engine, and a couple performance mods.
im sorta wondering what is the potential of the stock engine in the sx celica? how qucik can they do a 0-100 with basic mods?
PLEASE DONT SUGGETS TURBOS!!!!
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Location:
South Australia
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Tue, 08 June 2004 12:52
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Umm...search around...me, RobST162, devil_rolla, SR_TWINCAM etc all have ST162s and there's various info in the members rides section - although I don't know if many of us have taken them down the strip yet.
I'm currently working on a bit of a 'basic' mod (using a 5S crank to make it 2.2 litres) and I'll make sure to have plenty of dyno and quarter mile times and info as it progresses....
Sorry I don't have more info for you atm 
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Registered:
November 2002
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Tue, 08 June 2004 13:29
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As an NA car you are limited in what you can do and the 3S-GE is a pretty good engine to begin with. K&N filter in the standard air-box, trim away the plastic in the grille in front of the intake to give the air a big clear pathway in, exhaust headers, 2.5 pipe to a high-flow cat and a single straight thru muffler. You could advance the timing a little. This should get you down from mid-9's to high 8's in your 0-100 kph. If you are feeling brave and like to experiment try a JDM ECU from a gen-1 3S-GE and run on 98 RON fuel and that may give you another half a second, maybe.
Mitch.
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Location:
melbourne
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Tue, 08 June 2004 13:51
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wel if i could get it down to running 0-100 in mid 8's, id be laughing. i was thinking of doing exhaust, extractors, highflow CAI with Pod filter, suspension setup, and some good tyres, good spark plugs,leads and ignition coil.
should get me high/mid 8's no probs.
other mods that i havent looked into as much but would consider: head work such as basic port and polish, cams, and retune the ECU. chips are expensive!!!
but yeah any other ideas out there? dont want to get into serious modification as im not exactly a mechanic.
i was just after someone else who had modified there engines, and what tehy have to say about the mods and the performance increase they had specifically to the 3sge.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
December 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Tue, 08 June 2004 14:06
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First thing to do would be to take care of the handling - best thing would be KYB shocks n king springs, seems to be the goer amongst celica modders. Add a swaybar too as the stock are pissy as. Then Panel filter n headers n full zorst.Thing is u cant have straight thru as this is way too loud . I tried it n its heaps over the 94dB limit - u need a resonator in there. Also, u cant chip as it isnt MAP and remappin the ECU doesnt really do much. Go to coil n better leads n runnin better fuel will also make a huge differnce. Have fun!
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Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Tue, 08 June 2004 14:07
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dude just read my thread on my car if you want ideas from what I have done.. not that I am an expert.. FWDboy here knows lots more than me
I think the JDM ECU option is actually a pretty good one actually.. me has suspicions about my car to such an end.. still haven't decided about the engine lol.maybe japanese too..
am planning on going to the track this Sat, hopefully I will have the $45 I need to get in for a run but things are a bit tight atm so we'll see
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Location:
South Australia
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Tue, 08 June 2004 15:46
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lol - fibber Rob 
I can't wait to see what your car can do!
(/hijack)
JDM ECU is definitely a good thing, I haven't had any experience with them but who knows? It's just a slightly different fuel/ignition map that is designed for higher octane fuel, now that 98 RON is readily available I'm surprised more people haven't tried this (maybe I should go to an importer sometime soon - hehe)
I've explored other cheap options as well, for example, shaving the head to get some extra compression - here's the catch - there isn't enough room to take anything substantial off the head, the valves sit very close to the edge of the combustion chamber (damn multi-valve head).
Cams are a good option, Crow make a performance cam for the 3S-GE (try Crow Cams for contact info) - I couldn't spot one in their online catalogue, but that thing hasn't changed since I looked over a year ago...I shot an email off to them so I'll let you know.
Some people like to grab shim under buckets - I think you may be able to get these from Toyota/TRD, I haven't checked that one out but people do them on 3S-GTEs - I think Stewart (Classique71) got them for his great big eff-off motor. They are a peace of mind thing really unless you are pulling big revs with high-lift cams in which case you'll definitely want them. They aren't exactly cheap, and I think you have to get new valve springs as well (go double springs, yeah )
The standard ECU cannot be remapped - it doesn't contain eeprom or flash or anything like that (unlike something good like a Subaru ECU) - so either piggy back it to change the ignition map, or replace the whole thing.
Also - just about everyone tends to get their mitts on ST165 or ST185 twin-piston front brake calipers. I haven't yet put them on my car, but they'll easily out perform the standard units (may want to grab an ST165 brake master cylinder too). If you want some go, you got to get some whoa too.
Pod filters are more hassle than what they are worth, a good K&N or Green Cotton replacement panel filter (anything washable) with the CAI (check out this for BLOODY neat CAI) will perform as well, and sound as good, as the pod. Plus it looks twice as legal as having an exposed pod filter in the engine bay.
Whiteline sway bars come in at around $150 each...KYB shocks should set you back $550 all up for front and rear - Rob has H&R and seems to like them. King Springs are dirt cheap, cant remember how much though The ST162 sway bar linkages are crap-tacular, and I haven't found a good replacement set yet, most of the suspension rubbers are all moulded into the joints (things like ball joints etc) and can only be replaced by getting the whole new ball joint from toyota (again, I've yet to find a decent replacement). You can get front and rear sway bar mount rubber from any of those urethane type distributors (Nolathane, Noltec etc) and the lower control arm rubber is replaceable as well.
There, that should do for now. I've printed most of this stuff around the place before...check out this thread as well it's got some general ST162 love and discussion and some useful advice and experience.
*collapses*
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Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Location:
South Australia
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 00:34
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Yeah i forgot one other cheap(ish) option. The 2nd Gen head + 1st gen intake manifold upgrade. If you can get your hands on something like an MR2 3S-GE's head and stick the gen 1 intake on it, and wire that all up, it'll give you a nice performance gain for no more than a few hours work and a few hundred dollars.
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Location:
South Australia
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 01:42
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Argh - one more thing - I'm not sure if these are *exactly* the same on exhaust header manufacturer's lists, but any set of exhaust headers for an ST184 (5S-FE 1990-1995? Celica) will fit on a ST162 (3S-GE 1986-1989 Celica) as well.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 05:18
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Fantastic post FWDboy!!!! 
Im changing the bucket shimes on my head.... so i might do the swap to the 2nd gen... the exhaust side matches up as well yeah?? hehe
the only 2 cents i can do is a pod filter is crap if its inside the engine bay.... i had it inside the engine bay and really couldnt rev past 5500rpm, but when i moved it into the front guard i could easily rev past 6000rpm and fuel economy was heaps better!!
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Location:
melbourne
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 05:30
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thats exactly the kind of information im after, although, i really would like to here some times u boys are getting (0-100 or whatever) , even if it is ur mate in the next seat with his stopwatch!!!
i own a 4ac corolla at the moment. i dont actually have a celica, but im torn between my choices for next car which i will hopefully be after very soon.
im down to:
Pintara T, or Ti
celica sx 162
corolla ae82
honda integra or civic pre 1990
im pretty much after a 4cyl non-turbo P plater car.
the ae82 is in the lead for now, as its performance seems to be right up there with the celica, as well as beeing cheaper to run, modify, buy, and insure. however i like the interior, reputation and design of the celica.
i dont think ill be spending more than $4000 on the initial purchase.
im open to opinions.
thanks very much for ur help guys.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 05:51
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personally... and this is fully biased... the celica!!!!!
I cant tell u times cause everytime i get sumthing fixed sum other shyat breaks... hehehe
but i can tell u sum of the cars ive raced... um driven past....
BEATEN
vt commodore
'89 prelude
'92 celica (think it was the fe)
... lost to everything turbo...
and cant beat a vs commodore...
but that should change as a new clutch, flywheel.. and maybe head goin on.
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Location:
melbourne
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 07:20
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well that is all well and good, however, do u believe that u could beat an ae82 corolla with similar mods
They simply have an adavantage because of their lightweight bodys and excelect (and very interchangable) 4age series of engines. a slight power gain on an ae82 will improve performance so much more because of its light weight (power to weight ratio).
i really just dont know. i think a celica is a nicer car, but i wish it performed just that little bit better!!!
really lihe the interior of the celica tho. the ae82 interiors rattle and shake to much when driven!
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 07:28
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ae82 isnt that much lighter than st162...
the 4age is fantastic... and if i was had money for a project car i whould build a hachi roku 4age 20v!!!
but the st162 has the 3sge... its the 4age with 2l's!
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Location:
melbourne
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 07:35
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yes i can agree with you there. the 3sge is a great engine, and i do not underestimate it.
but now that i htink about it, as nice as celica will be to own, they are a little more pricey than the twincam ae82's.
for a newish P plater like me, think i need the cheaper ae82 which i can flog about (rev), as well as crame all my mates in the back, and still afford petrol (god damn the shit is geting expensive these days!).
i will still consider a Celica if it is the right price, but i cant exactly count on it. 
i wish i ahd more money 
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 22:36
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hey boys .. can u tell me the diff between ST and SX ... i have done a search before, but dunno what i used as keywords !
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Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Location:
Gold Coast, QLD
Registered:
April 2004
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 23:31
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| Les wrote on Thu, 10 June 2004 08:36 |
hey boys .. can u tell me the diff between ST and SX ... i have done a search before, but dunno what i used as keywords !
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See my reply to your other thread........
(as referenced by Rob above!)
Matt
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Location:
Epping, Sydney
Registered:
April 2003
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Re: st162 possibilities?
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Wed, 09 June 2004 23:34
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and a good reply it was too!
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