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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
July 2003
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KE30 has to much tramp
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Mon, 23 August 2004 01:47
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I have a KE30 with a 3TGTE and it has a RA23 celica diff that will soon be locked. It sucks i cant even do burnouts because it gets to much tramp. Has anybody got a KE3# that they have set up with tramp bars or any thing else to stop tramp. Any information would be good.
Thanks Will
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Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Tasmania
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Mon, 23 August 2004 13:30
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I have the same problem. When I adjust the Koni red shocks up to hard, I get no tramp, but and can not realy drive the car like that either. (Too bouncy, imposiable to drive). I recomend a extra main leaf, that is clamped to the main leaf in a few places. Also, remove the rubber bushes that go around the leaf pack in the middle.
I too have a RA23 diff welded locked, and I snapped a axle (which can ruin the whole diff center also). But still have a NA 2TG so its no so bad. I will go with a LSD in my RA23 diff and I don't expect to snap axles again after that.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Wed, 25 August 2004 03:54
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I am going to get the leaf spring reset and add an extra leaf so hopefully that will fix the problem. I have about 115rwkw on stock boost so can you see why I need both wheels spinning. The price of a few axles has to be worth having twin wheel spinning all the time. How much is a good pair of shocks (Bisltein Koni) for the back?
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Wed, 25 August 2004 04:25
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I think the shocks in the back of mine were over $550 a pair (mine was a package of springs, front and rear shocks, front coil-over kit labour etc so I can't remember what all the individual prices were.
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The price of a few axles has to be worth having twin wheel spinning all the time
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Hopefully yours last longer than the ones in my car did, otherwise it will piss you off pretty quick. Spending more time changing them than driving the car is not much fun.
My car is making over 170rwkw without tramping, using the setup I described above. So if you get yours sorted out you should be fine.
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Location:
On your mum!
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Wed, 25 August 2004 04:56
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I did similar to K382TG.
I have added extra leaf and I use Monroe GT130 shocks. Better shocks would be good.
Just adding the extra leaf will not solve the problem (although it will help). If you don't want to kill the ride (ha) the add the leaf to the front half only, you also may need to add tighter bushes at front eye (eg nolathane).
Good luck.
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Wed, 25 August 2004 15:54
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Mate sounds like you have too much positive pinion angle! ie the pinion is facing up! Unless you know what you are doing and for the ease take it to a driveline shop! check this first if you have put a axle assembly out of a different car.If this checks out ok, The only way to stop axle wrap or tramping on a leaf sprung rear is tramp rods, if they still make them or locating rods which connect from the top of the axle housing or the bottom to the sub frame these will have to be fabricated by a chassis builder! the locating rods are by far the best option bust alas more cost! GT falcons came standard with these! avoid using to hard rear springs you will loose squat if you are setting up to drag this car! SQUAT=BITE= better 60 foot times!
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Location:
On your mum!
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Wed, 25 August 2004 22:13
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Pinion angle is a very good point mick.
Squat does not necessarily = better traction. Traction is best effected by lifting the weight off the front wheels and transferring it to the rear. The rear suspension needs to be strong enough to be able to cope with this weight (Dragsters generally have no rear susp movement and I have never seen a pro stocker squat beyond what is the tyre squash).
There are quite a few ways to reduce/eliminate axle tramp without resorting to tramp rods.
1) make sure that the front half of the springs are well clamped together (and that the rear halves are free to separate) you can make clamps.
2) make sure the front eye rubber is stiff (a lot of yank leaf spring draggers use steel)
3) good pinion snubber (good = tuned to bottom out at the optimum moment)
4) Good shocks are of paramount importance
5) Cal-Tracs bars (1000% better than tramp rods) look em up and make your own!
6) Pinion attack angle (as Mick pointed out, it needs to nose down a little bit).
Happy dragging and happy burnouts.
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Registered:
May 2002
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Wed, 25 August 2004 23:12
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Yep, pinion angle is a good point and was something the guy who fitted my diff was careful about (to make sure it was the correct angle).
As a note, my car is by no means setup for drag, the suspension is quite stiff (leans towards a streetable, basic track setup and works surprisingly well around a track!).
Even though it is quite stiff it still manages 1.7 second 60 foot times on street tyres (I know thats nothing flash for a drag strip oriented car but mine is just a street car and on street tyres and is not even remotely setup for drags, so I don't think it does too badly  ) and any video I have seen of my car off the line shows that its a solid little bugger and hardly lifts at the front or squats at the rear.
Cheers.
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Location:
sydney
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Thu, 26 August 2004 09:53
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Yeah can see your point on the dragster theory.But!! if is a top fueller, they carry majority of their wieght behind its centre of axis.the engine is in the rear and so is the driver.But if you look at a setup as most passenger cars have majoirty of its weight over the front they will need squat in the rear if they are rwd. its simple physics, rember the seesaw in the local park. But if you have the time,money and can fabricate things ,make a four link set up that has fully ajustable upper and yes lower control arms with either a watts link set up or panard rod, you can set the car up to have best of both worlds!
regards mick
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Fri, 27 August 2004 02:14
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The diff was done at a diif shop so that should be all good. Has anyone run the Cal-Tracs bars because they look like they are the shit and farily easy to make.
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Location:
On your mum!
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Fri, 27 August 2004 11:26
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I have been planning to make a set for some time - when I get around to it I will let you know.
Mick, I see your point, I was merely pointing out extremes. You can have too much squat - no problems. If the suspension bottoms prior to max weight transfer the rear will be un-loaded - even with a 4 link. There are plenty of ways to help traction with cart springs and we are a long way from requiring tramp rods or 4 link set ups.
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Location:
tallahassee FL usOFa
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: KE30 has to much tramp
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Fri, 27 August 2004 13:38
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i think pinion angle is only usefull for u-joint life, and has nothing to do with wheel hop/tramp/axle wind up.
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