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Location:
Brisbane - Chapel Hill
Registered:
June 2002
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 T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Wed, 12 January 2005 01:49
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I have been researching this for a while, so some of the questions I have might take a bit of explaining. Sorry this is going to be longwinded...
I have a Datsun 1200 Ute, planned is a 4AGZE+w58+
Ideally I'd like it to be a semi-serious, fun car, for hillclimbs, sprint days, and some street stuff. If It gets a GTE setup at a later stage I dont expect any more than 250rwhp maybe?
So far I have no real issues any aspects of the build up, except the driveline. Trying to decide what to put in the rear of the thing, is giving me hell.
(I'm pretty much certain I will be using a w58, and I'm trying to organise the bellhousing etc)
Now my preferred option was to use what I already have lying around in parts. Here are some measurements and pictures of what I dug up:
Farthest to Closest: TA22 ?(Bens Diff),TA22 Custom (Torsen LSD), RA28 (UZA28's Old Diff),TA23 (My Bent Diff).
These measurements are very rough
Axle Comparison, Left to Right RA23, RA28, Cutdown Ford
Spline Comparison, Top to Bottom RA23, RA28, Cutdown Ford
Bearing Comparison, Top to Bottom RA23, RA28, Cutdown Ford
Some Questions I Have regarding T diffs in general:
- When people refer to T-series diff's "breaking" are they referring to the T292, T312, Other or all?
- I didnt notice any _reference_ made to the differences in housing sizes between diffs. eg. the xA22 diff housings axle casing part is only 59mm in dia, whereas the xA23,8 housings are over 65mm in dia. I suppose nobody cares as long as they get the correct axle/bearing combination for that housing? I'd imagine the bigger one is less prone to flex maybe?
- Where do T-series setups usually succumb? Axles, Gearset, Diff Carrier, Elsewhere, or do they simply "break everywhere"?
- Are there differences in the snouts between T-series Diffs?
Left Torsen, Right TA22 4.111. For some reason the snout I had the torsen mounted in is 11 nut and 1 bolt, as opposed to all my other snouts which are 12 nut. Is that the only difference? They seem to "fit" ok, and the carrier etc seems of similar dimensions with a cursory inspection...
Other Notes (Application Specific):
- I had it in mind to use the T292 as a basis, cutdown with ford bearings and axles like my TA23 Diff.
- I was planning on building a simple 4-link rear-end in place of the leaf-sprung rear, with a watts-link. Width might interfere with fuel tank placement (might just move/replace it)
- The standard datsun H165 diff is roughly 1280mm hubface-hubface. So I guessed anything stronger I could find would need to be cut down. This is ok, as it might open options for a different bearing setup (brake selection) and I can get nice deep dish custom offset Panasport FS 15's.
- Lots of Underbody rust, especially in the tray, so the wheel arches will likely be minitubs
- Staying 4x114.3 PCD
- H190 LSD's are (aparently) rocking horse shit
- I have money, and I am more than willing to improve my limited fabrication skills, but I'm an impatient motherfucker!
- I have had a good chat to one of our more experienced members (Terry O'Beirne) about some of the above details, I have taken what he said to heart, I'm just trying to cover all the angles. Terry please feel free to add if I am in error in any way here. 
Considering the R31 BW othewise, or I am quite happy to go F-series size (go toyota!), but the weight worries me, and I will have to jump on the LSD buying bandwagon sooner rather than later! Need to make the decision NOW! 
There, I think that covers it.
Any Suggestions Appreciated
(the toymods search can often suck donkey balls, so im putting this here too, will edit as(if) the thread evolves: T
series T-series 6.7 " breaking broken break diff housing 4AGZE 4A-GZE strength
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Wed, 12 January 2005 02:17
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Interesting...
Are you sure your TA22 diff with the smaller axles and bearings isn't a D series? The TA22 came with 2 different diffs, a D and a T, and they don't differ much visually. The D is 6.62" and the T is 6.7"
I'd really be inclined to think that a T-series diff would be tough enough for the punishment, but I could be wrong I suppose. Reason being that a lot of drifters etc with AE86's seem to be able to really abuse their T-series diffs without too many dramas... A Datto1200 ute isn't very heavy at all. No harm having a stronger diff I suppose.
Question - why a 4AGZE?
With the snout mounts, I did notice that too while I was at the wreckers. The later model Celicas (RA28?) seem to have a slightly different mounting, where it's not flat all around, but has a raised bit for a longer stud. Apart from that they visually look the same... Not sure about interchangeability. Also, the tailshaft flanges changed as well throughout the T-series, I've come across 3 different ones so far.
As I mentioned in my email, I *think* WRX LSD's are H190's? I know a few people with H190 LSD's (in dattos) so they can't be all that rare.
One good thing about going with an R31 diff is that BW LSD's are cheap as piss. You can buy a *BRAND NEW* BW78 with LSD etc for about $1300 (if I'm not mistaken), and you can get the clutch cones for about $400. MUCH MUCH cheaper than any Toyota LSD, but apparently they don't work as well, or last as long, as the clutch style LSD's that Toyota use. But they're cheap.
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Location:
Brisbane - Chapel Hill
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Wed, 12 January 2005 05:19
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Hey Fook 
Dont know if the smaller kinds are D-series. Are D-series still 10-bolt? I'll see if I can find out...
4AGZE since I had the frontcut sitting here ready to drop into my 4AGE celica when the vehicle decided to become semi-amphibious. I have 4x4AGx's here at various stages. It's just what I had. [Oh and I typically hate nissan bogans, hence toyota ] Stock GZE's are tuff little motors too.
I measured the flanges on all of my snouts, and they appeared to be the same diameter. I should really bolt an old celica driveshaft on them to make sure.
Interesting that toyota would change flanges that often too?
Perhaps I dont have the original diff from my car, but the RA28 diff I have doesnt have that longer stud thingy. Who knows hey?
Looking into the WRX H190 combo. I dismissed the H190 a while back for some reason im struggling to remember.. Anyway, there was this old smoky vanette parked on my walk to work everyday. I eyeballed the diff a few times, much to the distaste of the owner IIRC they are only slightly wider, I'll check the datto forums again.
Edit: Spelling
[Updated on: Wed, 12 January 2005 05:21]
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Wed, 12 January 2005 05:41
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Hmm, so you hate datto's but you bought a datto1200 ute? 
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Interesting that toyota would change flanges that often too?
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And really annoying! My diff is (aledgedly) out of an RA23, and so I got the back half of the tailshaft so that I had the appropriate flanges etc, and then got my Corolla tailshaft shortened and the new flange put on. But my diff center was broken, so I got a diff center out of a TA22 and bolted that on, and went to bolt the tailshaft on and found it wouldn't fit!!!
Some fun with a drill later, and it all went together just fine
Not 100% sure which Celica it was that had the longer stud on the diff center mount, IIRC it was the one with the square front end on it...
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Location:
Brisbane - Chapel Hill
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Wed, 12 January 2005 06:32
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Oh, it might have been an RA40 then (the Ugly Duckling ...)
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Location:
ireland
Registered:
October 2004
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Re: T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Wed, 12 January 2005 08:05
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i had a 4agze corolla gt coupe (sprinter )with a uk spec t series diff with the toyota lsd and i broke two crownwheel and pinions, 3 halfshafts and broke two lsd centres over a period of about 8 months, they are not a strong diff. the later (86/87)halfshafts are a bit stronger.
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Location:
Tamworth NSW
Registered:
November 2004
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Re: T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Fri, 14 January 2005 12:35
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My 4age datsun 1200 ute has an AE86 diff in it. The diff is alittle wider you can put on flares or wheel rims with an offset so they widen in not out.
To handle power try finding a chrysler Centura that ran a hemi 6 cylinder. They handle a 351 v8 in an RA28 race car no problems.
Good luck
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: T-series Differences, LSD Diff Dilemma, 4AGZE 1200 ute (Die 56k)
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Fri, 14 January 2005 12:55
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Hmm interesting , if the wrx is a h190 is it a 27 spline or the 31 spline axle size ? Because the 27 spline axles are far weaker , the 31 are very well built .
The lightest conversion i have had under my car so far is a h190 with a modified housing , far lighter than a t series .
And the f series / nissan housing atm is maybe 10kg heavier again , and i cannot find another axle to replace a twisted one {HELP ANYONE}
But also cutting any other diff apart from a t series down to that width might be a hassle to without custom axles . The h190 can only be cut down 25mm making it 1425mm disc to disc from memory .
What a 180b wagon got in it ? I have a friend that had one of those diffs in a quick 1200 coupe back in the 80's
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