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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
November 2004
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Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 01:19
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Hi,
I am new to the world of toyota's, but im current;y building a pure drift AE86. The soul purpose of this car is to drift. Not even sure if it is going to be street registered.
What is the best option suspension wise. Nobody seems to have coil overs all round why is this? A decent set of coil overs up front with adjustable camber tops and short stroke with about 6kg springs seems to be the go.
What is a typical drift setup for a AE86.
Any help would be gretly appreciated.
Thank you.
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Location:
QLD
Registered:
October 2004
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 02:40
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i wish i could help but i cant
ill ask some mates nd get backs to u
cheers
justin
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Registered:
December 2004
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 03:17
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I don't know about AE86's but i'm pretty sure it's impossible to have coilovers on the back due to the suspension setup.
But yeah go round to some suspension shops and ask what they think.
www.whiteline.com.au
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 03:48
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 04:21
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I know there is alot of load on the standard shock but do you think that it would be sufficiently strong enough with the standard mounts?
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 04:38
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I think the mounts would need to be strengthened. That pic above is of Bill's AE86 and he made mention of adding some bracing to the mounts.
But it can be done!
Cheers
Joel
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 05:04
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well. for drifting, since you are not worried about traction, seems you basically just set it up with far too stiff springs to be useful anywhere else, really hard shocks to reduce any possible suspension movement, lots of negative camber to look "fully DoRifTo....." and set the rear up to be even harder than the ridiculously hard front so that you always get oversteer..
since all you are doing is sliding, the throttle is more important, and as long as you have enough torque to initiate and hold the slide.. sorry "DoRift".. then what does it matter what the suspension does?
there will be much less weight transfer than if you were actually getting traction around a corner, so the normal rules for settign a car up for good handling do not apply 
Cya, Stewart
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 05:06
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| turboalfa wrote on Mon, 24 January 2005 12:19 |
What is the best option suspension wise. Nobody seems to have coil overs all round why is this? A decent set of coil overs up front with adjustable camber tops and short stroke with about 6kg springs seems to be the go.
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even funnier is when someone has spent $500 or so on adjustable strut tops and then sets them in the factory position
why do you need coil-overs? why not just get springs with the desired rate? i know it's not JDM spec, but it does the same job.
Cya, Stewart
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 05:07
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Yep, the suspension needs to be as hard as possible. If you're really serious about your dorifto, don't muck around with springs - just replace them with a block of wood. No need to worry about body roll or suspension movement!
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 05:17
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| Quote: |
and set the rear up to be even harder than the ridiculously hard front so that you always get oversteer
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Maybe i'm wrong (please slap me and correct me if so), but wouldn't softening the rear and stiffening the front cause more oversteer?
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 05:57
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mmmm, i always thought that the end which transferred and distributed the weight most evenly (softest) had the most grip. if you make front hard, then the inside wheel will lift, and then you lose total traction, since all weight goes to outside tire. if it's softer, then both wheels stay in contact with road = more grip..
for the rear, if it is hard, again, inside tyre lifts, and if you have a single spinner, it's game over... if you have a hard front and soft rear, so the inside front wheel lifts, but you are accelerating, then you have more weight transfer to the back of the car, and it can be more evenly distributed across the rear wheels.... so you have better grip (ie less oversteer?)
for my POS, it has soft front and hard rear, and inside tyre lifts... has lots of oversteer, but i have only been able to induce understeer by excessive braking.
hmmm, or maybe i've been smoking better crack than you  
Cya, Stewart
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:00
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*me thinks I should go home and pull out Fred Phun's How to make your car handle book tonight.
Or smoke some of that crack you are on.. 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:03
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Don't listen to anyone here.
Solid mount your diff to your body -you don't need any suspension and you don't have to worry about "tuning" it. You'll be drifting with the D1 boys then.
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Location:
Wollongong
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:03
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| Quote: |
Maybe i'm wrong (please slap me and correct me if so), but wouldn't softening the rear and stiffening the front cause more oversteer?
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:slap:
You'd get understeer doing this.
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:13
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| TurboRA28 wrote on Mon, 24 January 2005 17:00 |
*me thinks I should go home and pull out Fred Phun's How to make your car handle book tonight.
Or smoke some of that crack you are on..
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lemme know.. i lent mine out... and my Smith books are back home 
strange... i've never seen "drift suspension options" in a "performance handling" book... oh wait thats not strange...
but back on topic.... make suspension very hard so that you don't get body roll.. that way when you enter a corner you will lose traction (which is usually a really bad thing), and you will be DoRifToing.. if you make the front softer than the rear, then you may actually retain some front grip and not crash onto the grass.
seems most dorifto kids have really hard frotn suspension because it doesn't look "cool" or "rad" to have the front of the car seesawing like a boat as you flick from side to side...
it's purely an image thing, but most people don't understand why it's done...
if you know how you want your car to behave, just select suspension to do that. for drift, you want to have the worst possible combination, ie one that induces terminal oversteer.
Cya, Stewart
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:18
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Joel slaps himself in head...
Yes just thought about this and you are right.
So back to the topic eh
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Location:
Terrigal
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:19
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Fred Phun makes mention of drift.
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:38
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"then you may actually retain some front grip and not crash onto the grass" 
But really can there be a set up that retains the best of both handling and drifto ?
Maybe there a ok medium , since as soon as you dump your sic as ae86 on the weeds it handles like crap anyway . Not that stock ae86 handles that well anyway .
See the main problem is once you get relatively high levels of grip the forces produced make the car much harder to drive . As well as not forgiving , if the car has lots of mechanical traction the level which everything happens is LOTS faster . Therefore your throwing of the car into tankslappers down the road takes on a completely different level , since you need to go passed the traction level and loose grip . Your rock hard , no travel set up might give you a impression of handling really well since the car is easily controlled in sliding , but these is all happening at a relatively slow speed compared to a grip set up .
Or go get yourself a book on handling , most are 20 years of age and written by yanks copying the europeans information released to them which is 10 years old anyway . If you follow there rules you should come out with a car which will slide at 20kph no problems .
And answering the question of handling set up , why dont you go get yourself a s13 its far easier to set up with the huge supply of part for Drifto up there . As well as not crashing another ae86 , theres only one crashed a week in my area .
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Location:
Rosanna, Melb
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 06:52
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Basic drift setup as I've experienced/heard.
- If you can get the rates you want stick with conventional springs and shocks, it should be cheaper. About 8kg/mm front and 6kg/mm rear although this is personal preference.
- Lower it however much you feel like
- Decent shocks, matched to your springs
- All poly bushes
- Lots of caster
- 2-5 deg camber (depending on how sik you want to look)
- stock front swaybar
- 18mm rear swaybar
- increase front track however you can
- Brace the chassis however you can
Search on here about how to achieve any of the above.
But most importantly get out there and practice. You can achieve a lot with a cheap setup but good skills and big balls.
Hen
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 07:03
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who can supply me with some high rate springs for the rear??
looking at some 7-8 kg suckers.
dodgydan
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Location:
Kita-Ku, Sapporo, Japan
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 24 January 2005 07:13
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any decent spring shop should be able to make up any spring you want..
K-mac, whiteline, kings.. shall i go on?
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Location:
New Zealand
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Sun, 30 January 2005 20:39
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man... Henns & improvedae86s posts were the only one of any worth.
i can't believe how much shit you guys give to people who want to do "drifting".
you don't want it stupid hard so that it slides like it's on wet glass... else you'll never be able to do anything at any speed.
set it up for circuit, then use tyres to suit the power/speed comprimise for the right track.
some tracks power is not important, so high grip rear good.
some tracks power is important and might not have enough so can comprimise with less grippy rears, but this will cost you speed.
TAKE IT TO THE TRACK.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
November 2004
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 31 January 2005 01:48
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Most of my drifting will be done at willowbank, so it's a pretty open, free flowing track, where i would think abit of power is an advantage.
Im in the process of building the engine for my 86. (CA18DET)
It should make ample power (in the vacinity of 180rwkw)
Where is the best place to buy suspension components for a 86?
Thanks,
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Location:
western queensland
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Mon, 31 January 2005 11:23
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you guys should join www.antidriftfaction.com and ban this anti-social excuse for motorsport
check out mr2drift's car if it's on here, it's a sprinter with simple custom suspension
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Fri, 04 February 2005 05:56
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i think it would be a fair thing to say that the suspension setup of a drift car diverts all the body roll and chassis twist to the tyres and exerts mechanical twistings into tyre smoke and thermal energy, while retaining a smooth transition from grip to slip. springs for resisting the roll and pitch and diversion of energy to right places, then shocks to keep the smooth transitions.
an unorthodox diversion of mechanical forces?
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Location:
western queensland
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Fri, 04 February 2005 06:45
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well put i'd like to think drifting is a lot more difficult than most make out, if it was easy all the commodores and escorts that come to the track would be back instead of going home quietly before the end of the day  well i don't mind if people arn't into drifting, they can all go away and leave us to play by ourselves again
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
September 2003
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Re: Drift Suspension
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Sat, 05 February 2005 07:28
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| Henn wrote on Mon, 24 January 2005 17:52 |
But most importantly get out there and practice. You can achieve a lot with a cheap setup but good skills and big balls.Hen
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Yup, agreed with Hen
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Banned user
Location:
Liverpool NSW
Registered:
March 2004
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