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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
January 2005
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ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 07:14
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I have a RWD ra60 with a blown 21r-c, i wanted to replace it with something just to drive with so i bought the 4age. Cost 750 for the engine and 550 for the gearbox. Recently I been wanting to get a performance engine, but also one that doesnt guzzle too much fuel or increase insurance too much. I know that 1G-GTE are the most popular conversion for this car but 6 cylinder twin turbo is much too costly for me. I am probably willing to spend up to $2000 on engine and gearbox. I was thinking of a 4agze, but I read about these conversions and it listed the problems that can happen. Such as intercooler not fitting, needing to instal ECU, proper wiring, new fuel pump, dead taco. Also the article mentioned that the supercharger stops work frequently if the intake piping was altered. And that faulty wiring can damage the engine. Im getting the engine fitted and they quoted 2-2.5g to instal a 4age. The 4age seems like a much simpler conversion therfore would it cost a lot less the 4agze? Im also partial to a 3sge generation 3 conversion with a w58.
Which of these or other options would be the most value for money?
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 07:33
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4A-GE would be a dog in an RA60, it simply doesn't have the torque for a car of that size. 3S-GE would be good but it costs a lot of money to convert it to RWD. The 1G-GTE is by far the best out of the engines you've listed, but you won't do it with your budget.
For that sort of money I'd recommend a 22R-E from an RA65... or even better, get another 21R-C for next to nothing and save your money until you can afford something decent.
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Location:
toowoomba qld
Registered:
March 2004
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 09:00
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I agree with Norbie, though if it was me I'd for a 22R-E
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 10:43
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So the 21r-c has more torque then the 4agze? Would the 120kw 4agze go slower then the 21r-c? I dont really think its a very big car, in fact its small and only weighs 1220 kilo. I thought the generation 3 3sge's were fitted to bathurst 1600 mr2s so they would be RWD wouldn't they?
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 10:49
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No, the 4AGZE has way more torque than a 21R-C, Norbie's point was that you should put another 21R-C in it, save some money and put it towards something bigger like a 1G.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 12:53
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| sleeka slider wrote on Fri, 28 January 2005 21:43 |
in fact its small and only weighs 1220 kilos
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er, i wouldnt say that is small.
small is an 800kg corolla.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 13:23
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ah ok. How much would It cost to buy and fit another 21r-c? if its over 1 grand I wouldnt bother. The reason I dont want a 1ggte is because i cant afford the insurance and fuel costs that come with it. Yeah I know mr2s are MR drive but does that matter? would it need a conversion to RWD? What is the torque and power and cost of a 22re? I think I read in a fastfours tech guide that 22re's should be avoided due to cracking often. Yeah good point the japan gt apex ae86 trueno weighs 920kg so it is a bigger difference then i initially thought. Wouldnt the 4agze weigh a couple hundred kilos less then 21-rc? It is a 1600 engine.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Fri, 28 January 2005 16:49
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1. A 21R-C is hardly a desirable piece of hardware, so it shouldn't cost more than a couple of hundred bucks at the wreckers - not that I've priced them lately.  You could probably score one for less (maybe even free) if you posted a wanted ad here on ToyMods.
2. If you're worried about the cost of fuel and insurance, you can't afford to modify your car. Period. Keep your car stock if this is a major concern. Having said that, the 1G-GTE will use less fuel than the 21R-C (just ask Nark), and TPP insurance isn't going to cost the earth (comprehensive is a waste of time for a car worth so little).
3. Yes it does matter, the MR layout of an MR2 means the engine is mounted east-west, just like a FWD car. Mounting it north-south is possible but it's a mission, and an expensive one at that. This has been discussed at length around here, do a search if you want to know more.
4. The 22R-E is no powerhouse, but it's a step up from the 21R-C, and it has the advantage of being EFI as already mentioned. You can find some basic specs here:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Pit/9975/dataBy Subject/GasolineEngines.html#R-series
Cost would probably be around $1k for everything you need, including ECU, loom, EFI fuel tank etc.
5. I wouldn't wipe my arse with the "tech" content of FastFours. 22R's are well known for being practically indestructible and lasting forever if maintained properly.
6. R series engines are big heavy bastards, A series engines are weenie little toy engines, so yes there would be a significant weight difference. Not enough to offset the extra bulk of your RA60 though.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Australia
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 01:18
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Wouldn't he be better off to sell the RA60 and buy an RA65/MA61 ?
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Location:
toowoomba qld
Registered:
March 2004
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 01:30
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Fastfours don't know. Some idiot who never looked after the motor in his car prolly said that. I bet if you ask them about another realable Toyota motor like a 3S-FE, they'd say there shit.
I don't know would insurence change too much by putting a 22R-E in the car, but if your worried about it, go for the 21R-C. Talk too your insurence company about. they should be able to tell you if you will be paying alot more, if you go for a quicker motor. But I'd throw away the idea of putting a 4A-GE in it. that would be just like the Mazda Roadpacer (rotor in a heavy Premier sedan). I'd go for the 22R-E myself
My two cents
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Location:
toowoomba qld
Registered:
March 2004
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 01:32
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| CrUZsida wrote on Sat, 29 January 2005 12:18 |
Wouldn't he be better off to sell the RA60 and buy an RA65/MA61 ?
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If theres one cheaper then what he wants to do then yes
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 05:14
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If you keep your eyes open you can score an RA65 for not much more than $1k. Even if it's $2k you're still better off, ie factory EFI, IRS, F series diff, better looking front end.
You'd be amazed how cheap MA61's are as well, if you don't mind buying a clapped out piece of crap. I bought my last one for $1200, complete and running (sort of). 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
I renounced punctuation
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 06:25
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1X.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 07:51
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4agze are definately not worth getting then if it needs a conversion. What about the 3sge? It's used in the japanese celicas so it wont need converting and shouldnt need much modification to install. I reckon I will go with the 3sge coz its the best in my price range, as far as i know
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Location:
townsville NQLD
Registered:
February 2004
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 08:22
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why not pull apart the motor and diagnose the problem, may just need a hone + rings + bearings, may just be something simple......never know ure luck.
might also wanna think about the 18RG....they bolt in apparently with a sump change. might the 18rgeu though.
brett
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sat, 29 January 2005 08:25
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3SGE involves converting FWD to RWD - expect to blow you budget ($2K?) bigtime.
you'll have to stick to a RWD engine if that $2k is your upper limit. Soft option is the 21RC or 22RE, with the 1GGxE in the distance unless your budget can grow to anywhere between $4-6k.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Sun, 30 January 2005 00:38
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| sleeka slider wrote on Sat, 29 January 2005 17:51 |
What about the 3sge? It's used in the japanese celicas so it wont need converting and shouldnt need much modification to install. I reckon I will go with the 3sge coz its the best in my price range, as far as i know
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Oh FFS, did you bother reading this thread at all? People have taken the time to reply to your questions, the least you could do is actually read them.
I agree with GiantTomato, get a 1X and stop wasting everybody's time.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
January 2005
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Location:
wangaratta
Registered:
May 2004
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Re: ra60 .... which 4 cylinder engine?
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Mon, 31 January 2005 00:44
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if you cant afford a decent conversion, there is no way in hell you can afford an SW20 MR2. simple.
browse the for sale section and just have a look at all the cars in there, and look at what is in your price range.
most of the cars on here are significantly cheaper than in the real world.
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