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Registered:
February 2003
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Welding chassis
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Fri, 08 April 2005 23:55
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hi guys
i'm about to fire up the stick welder on the inner/under chassis.
I've heard that the crimp must be attached to the battery negative to avoid frying the ECU?
is this true?
experiences?
thanks
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Location:
BRAY PARK BRISBANE
Registered:
March 2005
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 00:11
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Seriously i wouldnt bother with a stick, it will make for some very messy welds.
Find someone who you can borrow a MIG off at least.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 03:09
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or buy the trading post ive seen some go for as cheap as 300 bucks. not a bad investment if u ask me.
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Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 04:40
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so is the general concensous that stick welding is just messy? there is no danger to it right?
I know mig welding would be ideal, but i'd need to borrow one 
anyone ?! 
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 06:56
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Use an oxy welder... the average joe can usually do a much neater weld with an oxy and you won't have to worry about frying your ECU.
Also if you are going to seam weld your car make sure you don't weld the seam in one long weld... do about 5cm of weld then a 2cm gap.
This way if you ever bend your chassis you can get the thing straightened without too much hassell.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
July 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 07:20
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MIG isn't really the best weld method for in situ welding, not to mention upsidedown under the car ('out of position welding') because of the amount of spatter they can create even if the settings are well set for you, also getting the right angles on the handpeice while lying on your back is very hard and getting a neat weld will be difficult.
Oxy is pretty bad for automotive applications due to having an exposed flame being waved under your car and the confined space underneath your car could become extremely dangerous if you need to run in a hurry, also the amount of distortion produced is great because of the amount of heating needed.
Stick is problably the best option, even absolute begineers can get a decent weld, problably get a stronger weld than most cheapo MIGs could on even the hottest of their (very limited) settings. I recomend something like 'Satincraft 13' rods perhaps something in a 2-3mm would do a good job.
Also dont forget to remove all paint and oil, these can cause severe porosity, try to avoid heavy sticthing and full seam welding, heavy tack only (unless structual of course)
And yes, disconnect the battery.
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Location:
newcastle nsw
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 11:00
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id be more tempted to use a 16tc low hydrigen 2.5mm rod rather than than a general perpose satincraft 13, it makes for a much stronger weld seeing as though it is a stuctual part of the car that your welding.
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Location:
Adelaide
Registered:
May 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 11:11
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I must be one of those sickos who doesnt find mig welding on their back very hard at all. I normally just jack the car up quite high, and whack a pair of 300W spots under each side, then lie on a creeper and weld away. Full length work gear is a must though.
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Location:
newcastle nsw
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 11:48
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well ya a mig would be easier and better but he says he only has access too a stick welder
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
January 2005
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 11:56
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I'm not trying to argue with anyone here, but I've been around a few (actually worked for one) top level rally teams over the last five years and I've never ever seen a fabricater use a stick welder, for anything.
Geoff
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 12:19
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this is how you would do it if you were being serious about it.
(see wilbo, the internet has made me un-dumber  )
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Location:
Sunshine Coast Queensland
Registered:
October 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 13:20
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You can use an arcwelder to weld metal all the way down to .6mm but it tkes a great deal of patience and skill.
I have been a tradesman for 22 years now and while i would happily seam weld a car with an arc welder i would not recommend someone without a good deal of experiance to attempt it because you could end up doing a great deal more damage than good.
A mig is by far the best option and OXY shouldnt even be considered.
But if you have someone that can fix the mistakes you may make then by all means weld it with the stick.
Everything is a learning curve so have go and report back. 
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 13:46
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with stick welding i prefer the satinchrome rods get a much much nicer weld even if costly
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
November 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 13:55
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| thechuckster wrote on Sat, 09 April 2005 22:19 |
this is how you would do it if you were being serious about it.
(see wilbo, the internet has made me un-dumber )
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so has this been done with a mig? ive had experience with a mig welder (even if it was 5 years ago - wasnt exactly hard for me to learn) i havent got much knowlage of seam welding, i take it that example it the ideal way to seam weld? has it been acheived with a mig welder?
thanks
ps sorry to hijack des.
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Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sat, 09 April 2005 23:20
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tis cool
great, thanks guys
Also i forogot to mention that i'm NOT seam welding anything on the chassis - i've just broken my seat mount, and bought a new seat with different rails....I just want to weld some brackets to line everything up.
so stikc welding should be ok yeah?
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Location:
ireland
Registered:
October 2004
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sun, 10 April 2005 00:50
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the metal is so thin in the ae86 that you shouldnt go near it with an arc welder, you should mig weld it with .6 or .8 wire and on a low setting.
i have repaired numerous rusty shells and thats the way i do it
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Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sun, 10 April 2005 03:48
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hmm whats an arc welder again?
i know mig is the one with the copper feed...
welding n00b
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I supported Toymods
Location:
melbourne
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sun, 10 April 2005 06:26
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arc welder = stick welder,
a MIG welder is an arc welder too, but they dont get called that.
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Location:
ireland
Registered:
October 2004
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sun, 10 April 2005 12:34
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| domasik wrote on Sat, 09 April 2005 23:55 |
| thechuckster wrote on Sat, 09 April 2005 22:19 |
this is how you would do it if you were being serious about it.
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so has this been done with a mig? ive had experience with a mig welder (even if it was 5 years ago - wasnt exactly hard for me to learn) i havent got much knowlage of seam welding, i take it that example it the ideal way to seam weld? has it been acheived with a mig welder?
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the subaru pictured was done with tig & mig i think - they certainly built their roll cage with tig - but there's no need for that fancy stuff with steel-only body/chassis
yes it's an ideal way to weld as it's not long, continuous welds and it's along important bits of the car and it's done with the roll cage and other suspension mds in mind (e.g. where to stiffen up, what will get extra plates/hardware, etc)
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Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sun, 10 April 2005 12:54
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| syncro wrote on Sun, 10 April 2005 21:57 |
and the wire is not copper in the mig welder.
what are you welding? seat brackets on to the floor is it
can you just make an adapter bracket to bolt the seat top the stock location on the ae86 floor
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oh ic
yeah seat brackets onto the floor.
can't really make an adapter bracket that bolts off the stock hole cuz the original hole has been completely shredded off.
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Location:
MELBOURNE
Registered:
December 2004
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Re: Welding chassis
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Sun, 10 April 2005 23:21
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Sorry to kind of go a bit off topic but in that rally link - with all the hundreds of small welds on the chassis. Is that on the bottom of the car or inside the car. I can't tell  Also, I'm going to be welding metal into place to get rid of my rust, what would you recommend? Stick or mig?
Thanks
Troy
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 02:37
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My choice for welding sheetmetal such as a car is to use a TIG welder. It's what I've been using on my car and it works well. I wouldn't even consider using a stick.
Ian
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 03:49
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How do you manage to avoid warpage on body steel with a TIG?
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 04:00
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Just by welding a small amount at a time. Done properly the TIG puts less heat into the panel than other methods.
Ian
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Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 06:03
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so let me get this straight
arc = stick welder
mig = the one that feeds the line out
tig = ??
oxy = ??
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Location:
MELBOURNE
Registered:
December 2004
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 06:20
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| ae86slaver wrote on Mon, 11 April 2005 16:03 |
so let me get this straight
arc = stick welder
mig = the one that feeds the line out
tig = ??
oxy = ??
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Ditto. ANyone?
Thanks
Troy
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 06:24
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TIG = Tungsten Inert Gas = In simple terms, an electric for of Oxy Welding. The electricity forms the heat, and you manually add the filler rod.
Oxy = Oxy / Acetylene Welding = The Oxy heats the metal and the filler rod is added manually.
Ian
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Location:
northern beaches
Registered:
August 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 09:39
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was chatting to my welding techer the other night and he said that most pannel beaters use mig for repairs, etc but the realy good/old school ones still like to use arc, because the weld is softer hence better for file-finishing and the like.
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Location:
western suburbs,sydney
Registered:
June 2002
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 12:19
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I strenghtened the seams in my engine bay around the struts and front rio by brazing just borrowed the oxy, filler rods and flux from tafe it took me a couple of hours to do and worked a treat!
You have to be very careful with the heat/amps as i was brazing against metal thinner than 1.6 so i put some wet rags around the area that i was welding so the heat wouldn't distort the metal.
I found brazing to be cheap evective method of welding that i had great control over but i suppose you need the right welding process for the right job.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 12:46
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| serge wrote on Mon, 11 April 2005 22:19 |
I found brazing to be cheap evective method of welding that i had great control over but i suppose you need the right welding process for the right job.
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when you have to rent bottles, buy the gas, buy the rods and the flux it's probably better described as an expensive effective method of welding
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Location:
western suburbs,sydney
Registered:
June 2002
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Welding chassis
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Mon, 11 April 2005 13:29
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hell no - buy a nearly disposable gasless or gas Mig from Bunnings or Repco 
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