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Location:
leumeah NSW
Registered:
November 2004
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2tg excitement
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Tue, 03 May 2005 07:05
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hey guys if i was to get a 2tg and do all the minor mods (3t crank new pistons bigger cams) and get it injected. would it be possible to run quad t/b's and a sc12 supercharger? Is it better to supercharge efi or carby? would i have to decompress the engine? oh by the way it will be going into a ke20.
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Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
December 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Tue, 03 May 2005 07:25
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its better to supercharge efi.
if you want to run high amount of PSI, youd be wanting to decompress the engine.
however, im led to beleive that 8-9 psi is ok, since your running an sc12, they dont produce much psi above that amoune, 12-15 psi is the limit i beleive?
as for quad throttles, yes you can do it, but it has to be custom AFAIK, the 4age silver top throttle will work but youll need an adaptor plate to mate the ports to your engine.
Eldar.O.
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Location:
Devonport Tasmania
Registered:
June 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Tue, 03 May 2005 10:30
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First,
DONT BOOST A STD ENGINE.
unless u know what u are doing, if u are asking this question, thne dont do it.
Second,
Injected is better, but carbies are easier.
To A Certain Degree.
many people will argue for either.
But it all depends on how much money u have.
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Location:
brisbane
Registered:
October 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Tue, 03 May 2005 10:52
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well your ideas seem to be pretty far apart, not that they can't be done but its a lot of custom work $$ to bring them together, you are better off with a more simple setup. plenty of ideas on this website making loads of power.
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Location:
On your mum!
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Tue, 03 May 2005 10:54
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boosting a standard engine that is in good nick is fine. I would recommend that you go EFI with a supercharger.
Boost versus static compression ratio is dependant on the cam timing (IE dynamic compression is the important factor here), and integral strength of the components used.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Tue, 03 May 2005 11:18
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I'd imagine it would be much easier to start with a 4agze to get what you want to do. quad t/b's wouldnt be easy but it'll be even harder on the 2tg i'd say.
pay someone a few hundred to mount a 4agze and save yourself building a 3tg hybrid.
that's my 2 cents anyways.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Tue, 03 May 2005 19:42
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Would it be more practical to pull the turbo of a 3tg and then supercharge that? That way you would have all the injection hardware.
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Location:
Pilbara
Registered:
November 2004
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Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
December 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Wed, 04 May 2005 05:40
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| smitty1 wrote on Wed, 04 May 2005 03:42 |
Would it be more practical to pull the turbo of a 3tg and then supercharge that? That way you would have all the injection hardware.
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why would you even think of doing this?
the only good thing about superchargers is the lack of lag, youd be sacrificing power, for the sake of lag, which, in itself can be reduced significantly by using a smaller turbo, for example the t25 off an s13 silvia.
you must remember, that superchargers, while compressing air, and giving a better power output, also rob the engine of power in order to turn the compressor.
the end result of supercharging a former turbo engine may be that you end up with a power figure lower than that of an NA engine.
to cut a long story short.
you have an engine, you remove the turbo, and add a supercharger, this reduces the power output, because of two reasons, the supercharger cannot produce the same amount of PSI as a turbo, and the supercharger is using the engines power to turn the compressor to make more power.
whereas, if you leave the turbo on there, and upgrade, the management, injectors, turbo and add an I/C, youll receive a shitload more ponies, but at the cost of turbo lag, albeit minimal, depending on the type/size of turbo used.
to summarise FURTHER: turbo = good, supercharger = bad
hope this helps.
Eldar.O.
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Location:
Pilbara
Registered:
November 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Wed, 04 May 2005 05:56
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Um, I would not say that superchargers are 'bad'. It depends on the application of the blower and the tuning setup. The guy is just asking questions about stuff he don't know.
Just a thought, if you are s/charging or turbocharging a NA motor, the throttle response is not affected by 'lag' in the same way an all turbo motor is. The higher compression of a NA setup means that you will still get that throttle response. It just means the old NA motor gets a kick in the pants once the turbo kicks in. In applications with most NA turbo or supercharged conversion it's probably safe to say that a max boost of about 6 to 7 psi will be heaps and safe to run. Any more and you will be entering 'on the edge' world. At that boost range, a supercharger will not be much different to a turbo. If anything it may even be better cos you have that constant boost thing going on.
So, if the motor has readily available parts that suit then it will make sense to use them rather than busting arse trying to make a square peg fit a round hole (Hmmm sounds a little sus eh?). In this case the turbo option is the way to go.
It's all in the tuning. Thats how hondas running 10:1:1 compression can still be boosted cos they have very good aftermarket tuning packages available.
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Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
December 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Wed, 04 May 2005 06:09
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youve completely misunderstood me...
im talking about the 3tgte, removing the turbo in favour of a supercharger (3tgze), im bemused as to why you would do this because, in all sense of the action, i cannot justify doing so.
why would you reduce power figures in order to reduce almost non-existant lag?
Eldar.O.
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Location:
Pilbara
Registered:
November 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Wed, 04 May 2005 06:26
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'sighs' no mate. I'm in agreement with you. Read my post again. And... I'm not doing the mod here, the other guy is. I just thought that it was fair to say superchargers were not 'bad' as such. Like I have said before in my last posts on this topic, if there are available OEM parts that will fit like the 3TGTE manifold then use em (thats what I'm doing to a 3TEU at the moment). Of course it's silly to supercharge a turbo motor. I thought from the dudes post he is talking about a hybrid 3TG motor.
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Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
December 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Wed, 04 May 2005 06:49
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cool cool, as long as im right 
yeah, im looking at supercharging my 2tg/3t and it should be able to handle 7-8 psi, well, i should hope so, because thats what its getting!
i dont want to start having to rebuild it with forgies etc.
looking to do this near the end of this year though, can wait till im on holidays 
Eldar.O.
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Location:
Pilbara
Registered:
November 2004
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2004
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Wed, 04 May 2005 19:56
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EldarO
I wouldn't be doing this, but it seemed to line up with what kdogg was asking for more than anything else. Injected, 1.8, supercharged motor.
Ian
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Location:
Perth,western australia
Registered:
December 2003
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Re: 2tg excitement
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Thu, 05 May 2005 02:09
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and as for supercharger vs turbo,
a good twin screw blower will give you the same amount (if not more) boost than a turbo,though out the entire rev range.(think 8psi from 1500rpm)
the fact that it uses power from the engine to turn is takin into account from the start so its not like your losing power.
and also,the supercharger will give you more torque low down.
this will give you better launchs etc.
but,the cost of a good twin screw supercharger is a bit more than a new or recon turbo i would think.
it all comes down to application and dollars.
one cannot be said to be good or bad in a general sense.
cheers
Dom
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Nice to be secure innit? lol