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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Wed, 15 June 2005 03:39
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Boosted this info from a GT4OC thread that was boosted from some MR2 website.
Some interesting info!
3SGTE Standard Specs
Note: Gen1 cams are not directly interchangable with Gen2 or Gen3 but Gen2 & 3 cams are interchangable.
No Gen1 cams listed are list here for this reason.
Stock Gen2:
Intake & Exhaust
Advertised duration 236 degrees
Duration @ 0.010" lift: 260.0 degrees
Duration @ 0.020" lift: 211.0 degrees
Duration @ 0.050" lift: 160.5 degrees
Max Lift: 8.52mm (0.335")
Stock Gen3 Intake:
Advertised duration 240 degrees
4 degrees more duration, .5mm more lift than the 2nd gen
i.e.
Duration @ 0.010" lift: 264.0 degrees
Duration @ 0.020" lift: 215.0 degrees
Duration @ 0.050" lift: 164.5 degrees
9.02mm Max Lift
Stock Gen3 Exhaust:
(Same as Gen2)
Advertised duration 236 degrees
Duration @ 0.010" lift: 260.0 degrees
Duration @ 0.020" lift: 211.0 degrees
Duration @ 0.050" lift: 160.5 degrees
Max Lift: 8.52mm (0.335")
HKS
HKS 256 cams:
Duration @ 1mm lift: 216 degrees
Max lift: 9.0
HKS 264 cams:
Duration @ 1mm lift: 224 degrees
Max lift: 9.2mm
The HKS 2nd gen "low lift" 264 cams use a lobe centerline of 110deg ATDC intake, and 103 deg BTDC exhaust.
HKS 272 cams:
Duration @ 1mm lift: 232 degrees
Max lift: 9.4mm
The HKS 2nd gen "low lift" 272 cams use a lobe centerline of 110deg ATDC intake, and 108 deg BTDC exhaust.
HKS "high lift" 256 cams:
Duration @ 1mm lift: 216 degrees
Max lift: 9.5mm intake, 9.2mm exhaust
HKS "high lift" 264 cams:
Duration @ 1mm lift: 224 degrees
Max lift: 10.0mm intake, 9.7mm exhaust
HKS "high lift" 272 cams:
Duration @ 1mm lift: 232 degrees
Max lift: 10.4mm intake, 10.2mm exhaust
The HKS 3rd gen 272 "high lift" cams use a lobe centerline of 111deg ATDC intake, and 116 deg BTDC exhaust.
TODA
NOTE: These are advertised duration only, usually assumed to be 0.020" or .5mm.
Duration Max Lift(mm)
256_____8.5
256_____9.0
264_____8.5
264_____9.0
264_____10.3
272_____8.5
272_____9.0
272_____10.3
280_____10.3
288_____8.5
288_____9.0
288_____10.0
288_____10.5
304_____8.5
304_____9.0
304_____10.5
310_____10.5
320_____10.8
JUN
1004M-T001 (intake)
1004M-T101 (exhaust)
256° duration 9.0mm lift
1004M-T002 (intake)
1004M-T102 (exhaust)
264° duration 9.0mm lift
1004M-T003 (intake)
1004M-T103 (exhaust)
272° duration 9.3mm lift
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Wed, 15 June 2005 03:49
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Heres some info about degreeing your cams.
Also some reasoning behind the HKS 272 / 264 combo that all the 3S guys in the UK and USA seem to run.
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Cam timing should never be done according to marks on the cam gears but rather according to the lobe center of the cams in correlation to the cranks position.
Performance cams should always be degreed. Marks on the cam gear is only there to help when degreeing not to use as a standard to set.
Reason being:
What happens if I install a thicker gasket? both cams now advance
What happens if I install a thinner gasket? both cams now retard
What happens when I deck/mill the head ? both cams now retard
What happens if I deck/mill the head , install a thicker or thinner gasket?
What happens when I put a new cam belt on?
Too many variables to mention but I hope the point cam across.No two engines are the same therefore my suggestion too always degree the cams and not work of the marks on
the cam gear. It might bring you close but close in my books is not good enough especially if you spend $800 - $1000 on adjustable gears and cams.
Also remember that the HKS cams available for the 3S-GTE are not designed for the Turbo engines but rather for the 3S normal aspirated engines.It has been standard
practice to make the exhaust duration longer than the intake duration on a normal aspirated engine. This has been done to promote scavenging and increase cylinder pressure
at high RPM because overlap is longer and one can run narrower LSA's (Lobe Separation Angles) Applying the same methods to a turbo charges engine will not have the
desired affect because turbo charged engines does not make use of scavenging and reversion caused by larger overlaps can cause havoc.
Keep in mind that in a turbo charged engine exhaust pressure is almost at all times (99.95%) higher than intake pressure.
Reversion, when air flows the opposite direction than what it is suppose to flow, must at all times be prevented in a turbo charged engine.
If not compressor surge will occur which can result in serious damage.
If we take a set of 264 cams we will see that the inlet opens at 4 BTDC and closes at 43 ABDC for LS of 110 degrees and the exhaust opens at 36 BBDC and
closes at 10 ATDC for a LS of 103. This gives us an overlap of 14 degrees and a total LSA of 7 degrees. Not good for a smooth idle even worse when it comes to reversion
Now let's increase the exhaust cam to 272 degrees. Intake still opens at 4 BTDC and closes at 43 ABDC for a LS of 110 degrees, but exhaust now opens at 45 BBDC and
closes at 9 ATDC for a LS of 108. This now Gives us an overlap of 13 degrees and a LSA of 3 degrees.
Let's now go the opposite way, increase the inlet cam to 272 but change the LS for the 264-exhaust cam to 112. Inlet opens at 8 BTDC and closes at 47 ABDC
for LS of 110 degrees and the exhaust opens at 44 BBDC and closes at 0 ATDC for a LS of 112. This gives us an overlap of 10 degrees and a LSA of 4 degrees.
Less change for reversion and great for cylinder pressures.
A couple of things are achieved: longer fill period for a more powerful combustion which in turn will lead to a higher volume of exhaust gases with a higher initial
pressure, smaller overlap which will prevent reversion, longer effective exhaust duration which will help spool faster and stronger because of the higher cylinder pressures
and larger volume of exhaust gases present when the exhaust valve starts to open.
Test this on the dyno?
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Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Wed, 15 June 2005 09:07
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hmms interesting info about the cams - especially about the 264's i plan to get
by what little info i have i have the high lift set i think ...
was the theorys shown tested by any chance toobs ?
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 01:37
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Theres quite a few guys on GT4OC running the 272/264 HKS Combo.
Seems to flow some good numbers, but then again they all run 480+hp turbo's (GT30, GT35, T67 etc.)
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Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 02:29
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nods - im hoping to make mine similar to justens white group Agen 3 motor - basically the same camshafts as he had + turbo bar for a re trimming to suit midraange where as his i believe had a better top range trim ..
Justen if your reading this - wanna throw a quick comment re drivability with the 264's ?
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Toymods Vice President
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 02:47
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Time for another blatant rip from the MR2OC forum  .
A couple of the guys from the forum did a bunch of testing on a whole bunch of different cams ranging from HKS 256's to Toda 280's. They ended up choosing the 264's due to having a nice smooth curve with plenty of area under the curve and also a controllable idle.
Mind you it is a fairly serious engine as can be seen from the results with the 280's.
For the info on the testing and the various dyno graphs go to http://www.cj-motorsports.com/3scamtest/test.htm. They also have all of the dynojet run files which you can download and analyse with the winpep dynojet software if you're that way inclined.
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
June 2003
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 03:10
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Those dyno curves pretty well resemble my 264 setup. My cams were from Blitz but apparently pretty well identical to the HK$ equiv in 264. Idle took a bit of work but can be done with the stock ECU and dead simple with a proj ECU. They did seem to lose a little bottom end but hard to say as the swap was done at the same time as the GT25 which is known to be a bit laggy anyway.
A mate runs 272's to good effect but he has the JUN stroker kit which no doubt helps.
playing around on the dyno we found a HEAP of hp lurking in cam timing. The more modded your engine the more time you should spend chasing the hp with cam timing. From memory 6 deg retarded on the exhaust and 3 deg advance on the inlet gave us best peak hp and still maintained a strong midrange. I'd have to email him to get the exact specs/results.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
September 2004
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 04:54
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Thanks for the details fellas, All saved! 
Cant wait till i get to play with my engine.
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Toymods Vice President
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 08:34
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| sikx5 wrote on Thu, 16 June 2005 14:54 |
Thanks for the details fellas, All saved!
Cant wait till i get to play with my engine.
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Be careful what you wish for. Most people I know who've built 3S's have done it because they had to not because they really wanted to. I'd have been happy with my stock Gen3 if it kept running on 4 cylinders but damn it's a good excuse to go spastic building a monster 
If anyone's interested, when I was looking for cams I wanted something a bit bigger than the HKS 264 hig lifts. The HKS cams are really quite conservative in their lift rates leading to less area under the lift curve than could be had with a more agressive grind. The cams I got from Wade are:
Advertised Duration 266 degrees
Duration at 0.050" lift 228 Degrees
Maximum lift 10mm
As you can see they have plenty of lift. They also have just 2 degree's more advertised duration than the HKS 264's but they have 4 degrees more duration at 0.050" lift.
Now I have to get it all buttoned up and find a way to fit that HKS TO4S kit into my AW11 engine bay so I can get the thing tuned and see if I made a good choice on the cams.
The other thing I might add which I found interesting from the test I posted above, the difference between stock cams and the big ones was only around 10% total power production. Aftermarket cams are a good thing but they aren't the be all and end all, if you have really good head flow already.
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I Supported Toymods
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 11:34
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I think you need a frunk mount turbo Josh
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Location:
Brisbane, Queensland
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Thu, 16 June 2005 23:46
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| Toobs wrote on Thu, 16 June 2005 21:34 |
I think you need a frunk mount turbo Josh
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nothing better then a screaming turbo over your left shoulder 
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Location:
Colac, Victoria
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Fri, 17 June 2005 02:28
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" dude ! you sound like an airplane !! "
lol that clip was funny 
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Location:
Brisbane, Queensland
Registered:
January 2004
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Re: 3SGTE Camshaft Specifications
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Fri, 17 June 2005 05:45
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| Classique71 wrote on Fri, 17 June 2005 12:28 |
" dude ! you sound like an airplane !! "
lol that clip was funny
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Dude , ya sound like an aeroplane
'wah'
aeroplane
'Vrrrrrrrrrrrrssssssssssssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhh hh'
'i just can't get you outta my head' (kylie minogue playing in the background)
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Location:
Vancouver
Registered:
June 2004
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