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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Fri, 30 September 2005 21:19
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Hi guys,
My name is Henrik, And I'm from Sweden. my english is not so good.
I'm planing to put a turbo om my Toyota R18-C engine i believe it is.
And i really need to know the compression ratio on this engine.
Any one have a clou?
I have not found it any where.
Any help is good help.
Henrik.
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Location:
Land of Oz
Registered:
June 2004
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Fri, 30 September 2005 21:57
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Hi,
The 18R is 8.5:1, but not so sure about the 18R-C.
seeyuzz
river
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Fri, 30 September 2005 22:45
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| river wrote on Sat, 01 October 2005 07:57 |
Hi,
The 18R is 8.5:1, but not so sure about the 18R-C.
seeyuzz
river
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ok, thanks a lot,
Whats is the differens of the 18R and the 18R-C engine?
Any one know how much i can boost the engine whitout lowering the compression ratio??
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Sat, 01 October 2005 10:41
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Any one?? please...
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Sat, 01 October 2005 10:41
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Any one?? please...
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Sat, 01 October 2005 23:50
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henrick,
main differences between 18r and 18RC is the anti-pollution gear like the air pump, EGR, some vacuum control stuff and fixed mixture-control carbi.
the compression ratio is both is the same (they have same pistons, rods and crank)
you can find more info here <http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Pit/9975/dataBy Subject/Engine.html> a handy site worth bookmarking
however...
the engine design (non-crossflow) makes it real complicated for turbo-ing - as you have to squeeze most of the hardware onto one side of the engine.
like this:
If you insisted on boosting one as-is. i'd suggest limited boost to about 4-5 psi. You would still have to do something with timing (e.g. overall less mechanical advance, higher static advance, curve modified ot bring advance up to full advance before significant boost occurs).
You could also try to adapt the boost-retard-capable vacuum advance of a cordia turbo or other old-school turbo engine.
Bad timing will make the motor ping and detonate - and this will kill it rapidly.
i'd suggest one of the following for turbo-ing: 18RGUE, 3t-ge, 22RE - i think any of them would fit tho you'd have to look and think about which sump will fit into the '77 model.
I'd stick to an existing EFI engine - my experience with carbi+turbo has been less than satisfactory.
Also, am not sure if europe got any 1ggte's but they turn the humble 18R-powered celica into a rocket! see here for some pics of a convesion of RA28 from 18RGUE to 1GGTE
cheers,
Charles.
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Location:
Townsville North Qld
Registered:
June 2003
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 Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Sun, 02 October 2005 01:29
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1G-GTE certainly is a rocket engine for an RA celica... though dont discount the turbo'd 18RGEU. Ive seen them run sub 9's in an RA40 street legal. 22RTE is also a good one, as they have better power before they go on boost being larger capacity... makes them more drivable. For fitment simplicity the 18RGEU bolts in, and being lower compression, handles boost well too even with stock internals... id probably say with dizzy re-curving or a multi coil crank sensor operated ignition system, 10psi should be a top limit for boost.
Cheers, Owen
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Sun, 02 October 2005 11:42
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| o_man_ra23 wrote on Sun, 02 October 2005 11:29 |
1G-GTE certainly is a rocket engine for an RA celica... though dont discount the turbo'd 18RGEU. Ive seen them run sub 9's in an RA40 street legal. 22RTE is also a good one, as they have better power before they go on boost being larger capacity... makes them more drivable. For fitment simplicity the 18RGEU bolts in, and being lower compression, handles boost well too even with stock internals... id probably say with dizzy re-curving or a multi coil crank sensor operated ignition system, 10psi should be a top limit for boost.
Cheers, Owen
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Thanks every one for taking time to answer my dumb questions,
i am really new on toyotas and don't know what engine types all of you guys are talking about. I suppose that the are quite expensive. 18RGEU? in what model is that engine, and the GTE and the 22RTE.what if i lock the ignition in one place? whould that work to boost a bit more? is it the ignition that limits the boost? I'm going to pressurise two Stromberg CD175 carbs.
Thanks again every one for your good answers. Henrik
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Tue, 04 October 2005 08:58
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Hi again guys, is the any steel head gaskets to buy for the 18R-C engine? if i boost to hard,,,, what is the weakest link in the engine? is it the pistons or the piston shafts or the crankshaft that will brake first?
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Tue, 04 October 2005 10:21
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if by piston shafts u mean the connecting rods {conrods}, then no, they wont break, neither will the crank, pistons would be the first {if anything} to go, unless it starts to detonate {ping/rattle} then anything could give way
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Tue, 04 October 2005 13:06
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hi henrick,
there are no steel headgaskets made for 18RC.
If you run excessive boost, you'll probably destroy the pistons.
| tros-kaffe wrote on Sun, 02 October 2005 21:42 |
i am really new on toyotas and don't know what engine types all of you guys are talking about. I suppose that the are quite expensive. 18RGEU? in what model is that engine, and the GTE and the 22RTE.
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find out about all kinds of toyota engines here:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Pit/9975/tm_ind ex.html
it's a bookmark everyone should have.
As for expensive, it depends on how hard they are to find. These are engines that are geting on in age so you'll only find them in wrecking yards - most will be tired and in need of some kind of rebuilding,
the GTE is codes used to describe what the block has attached to it:
G-twin cam
T - turbo
E- EFI
| Quote: |
what if i lock the ignition in one place? whould that work to boost a bit more? is it the ignition that limits the boost? I'm going to pressurise two Stromberg CD175 carbs.
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a locked dizzi might prevent excessive ignition advance when on boost - in effect limiting boost. Proper boost control is done with wastegates.
i still think you should be trying to find an EFI engine and starting from there.
cheers,
Charles.
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Tue, 04 October 2005 22:28
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| Mr DOHC wrote on Tue, 04 October 2005 20:21 |
if by piston shafts u mean the connecting rods {conrods}, then no, they wont break, neither will the crank, pistons would be the first {if anything} to go, unless it starts to detonate {ping/rattle} then anything could give way
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Yes, thats was what i meant. (connecting rods) "sorry my bad"
So unless the engine detonates the pistons is the first to go?
Is there any other pistons from a nother engine that bolts on that is stronger?
This was truly a god site i found, kind users and god ansvers to my stupid questions, if you guys lived closer i whould buy a big lager to all,
[Updated on: Tue, 04 October 2005 22:28]
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Tue, 04 October 2005 22:40
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| thechuckster wrote on Tue, 04 October 2005 23:06 |
hi henrick,
there are no steel headgaskets made for 18RC.
If you run excessive boost, you'll probably destroy the pistons.
| tros-kaffe wrote on Sun, 02 October 2005 21:42 |
i am really new on toyotas and don't know what engine types all of you guys are talking about. I suppose that the are quite expensive. 18RGEU? in what model is that engine, and the GTE and the 22RTE.
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find out about all kinds of toyota engines here:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Pit/9975/tm_ind ex.html
it's a bookmark everyone should have.
As for expensive, it depends on how hard they are to find. These are engines that are geting on in age so you'll only find them in wrecking yards - most will be tired and in need of some kind of rebuilding,
the GTE is codes used to describe what the block has attached to it:
G-twin cam
T - turbo
E- EFI
| Quote: |
what if i lock the ignition in one place? whould that work to boost a bit more? is it the ignition that limits the boost? I'm going to pressurise two Stromberg CD175 carbs.
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a locked dizzi might prevent excessive ignition advance when on boost - in effect limiting boost. Proper boost control is done with wastegates.
i still think you should be trying to find an EFI engine and starting from there.
cheers,
Charles.
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Hmmm no steel headgaskets,,, how about copper gaskets?
I am just testing a "dizzi" i think  that lower the iginition when boosted, that whould help, yes?
EFI,, Electronic Fuel Injection??? But i like carburators, and i am learning some thing too as i go, But i know nothing about toyota engines. 
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Wed, 05 October 2005 11:39
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| tros-kaffe wrote on Wed, 05 October 2005 08:40 |
Hmmm no steel headgaskets,,, how about copper gaskets?
I am just testing a "dizzi" i think that lower the iginition when boosted, that whould help, yes?
EFI,, Electronic Fuel Injection??? But i like carburators, and i am learning some thing too as i go, But i know nothing about toyota engines.
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i think ridgecrest in australia make copper headgaskets - as for northern europe? i dont know. it might be easier to read thru local rally and motorsport magazines adn see who custom makes copper headgaskets.
a boost-retard dizzi would help you a lot - especially as you seem keen doing this the old fashioned way (carbi, dizzi, etc) 
yes, EFI = electronic fuel injection, also can do ignition control depending on the kind of EFI ECU and hardware that you install.
As for learning about EFI, i would encourage you to read thru www.msefi.com (also known as Megasquirt EFI) - it's a DIY EFI setup. There's a few folks from northern europe running megasquirt. The manual (sorry - english only) is on the site somewhere (which seems to be dead tonight)
Also, the VEMS project <http://www.vems-group.org/> might be a good read and a big learning curve - but it is european-based.
To learn more about the toyota engines, read thru the link in my earlier post - the 4 links at the top of the page are the important ones.
cheers,
Charles.
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Wed, 05 October 2005 22:26
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i think ridgecrest in australia make copper headgaskets - as for northern europe? i dont know. it might be easier to read thru local rally and motorsport magazines adn see who custom makes copper headgaskets.
a boost-retard dizzi would help you a lot - especially as you seem keen doing this the old fashioned way (carbi, dizzi, etc)
yes, EFI = electronic fuel injection, also can do ignition control depending on the kind of EFI ECU and hardware that you install.
As for learning about EFI, i would encourage you to read thru www.msefi.com (also known as Megasquirt EFI) - it's a DIY EFI setup. There's a few folks from northern europe running megasquirt. The manual (sorry - english only) is on the site somewhere (which seems to be dead tonight)
Also, the VEMS project <http://www.vems-group.org/> might be a good read and a big learning curve - but it is european-based.
To learn more about the toyota engines, read thru the link in my earlier post - the 4 links at the top of the page are the important ones.
cheers,
Charles.[/quote]
Lots of good reading in the http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Pit/9975/dataBy Subject/Engine.html link.
New question, if an engine has the same bore and the same stroke as my engine, does that piston fit in my engine?
asuming the "hmm what is it called?" piston bolt?? hehe no thats probobly not the rightr word, the thing thats conects the pistons whit the conrods.
are there many carmodels that used the 18R-G engine? DOHC.
If i get the boost-retard dizzi to work,, can i increase the boost then? and how much in that case?
"If my englich is to bad, fel free to correct me"
[Updated on: Wed, 05 October 2005 22:29]
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Thu, 06 October 2005 10:30
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Wher to find the colorcode on the car?
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
February 2003
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Re: Toyot Celica Har Top 77 compression ratio??
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Thu, 06 October 2005 10:46
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| Quote: |
New question, if an engine has the same bore and the same stroke as my engine, does that piston fit in my engine?
asuming the "hmm what is it called?" piston bolt?? hehe no thats probobly not the rightr word, the thing thats conects the pistons whit the conrods.
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the piston-pin or gudgeon-pin is what you are referring to.
the gudgeon-pin would have to be the same spot on the replacement piston. is would also have to use the same size pin and fit over the conrod end.
also - the shape of the top of the piston would also have to be the same (e.g. 18RC are flat, 18RG have cut-outs for the valves
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are there many carmodels that used the 18R-G engine? DOHC.
If i get the boost-retard dizzi to work,, can i increase the boost then? and how much in that case?
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not sure about car models in europe - but the link earlier does have info in several tables that links engine types to car models.
boost retard will help slightly - but dont expect to be able to double the boost you want to run just because the dizzi pulls the advance back a bit under boost.
I'd discuss with mechanics what kind of boost you're running, the compression ratio you're running and what kind of timing is needed. boost retard might only pull the advance back 5-10 degrees.
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"If my englich is to bad, fel free to correct me"
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your english is much better than my swedish (actually, apart from 'absolut' and 'ikea' i can't speak a word of swedish).
colour code should be on the build plate on the firewall near the brake booster
[Updated on: Thu, 06 October 2005 10:47]
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Location:
Sweden
Registered:
September 2005
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