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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 11:37
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Hi all,
I am having a clutch and all the gismos made to be able to bolt me w58 up to the 302 ford motor. Will the same clutch etc fit onto an r154 if the w58 ever snaps? Or would i be able to make one for an r154 which also fits a w58?
Cheers - Blake
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 11:44
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W58 and R154 use totally different clutch types (push vs pull) which are not interchangeable at all.
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 12:33
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I'm not taking the chance with my conversion - it costs too much to have it stuff up!!! I'm putting a R154 5speed Supra box behind a 302 Cleveland at the moment. I sold the W58 I had kept for the conversion and bought the R154 instead.
Rod Hadfield at Castlemaine Rod Shop can adapt a M series bellhousing from the original R154, to suit the V8 bolt pattern (both Windsor and Cleveland share the same bolt pattern) for about $150 - much cheaper than buying a new bellhousing at $550. I have a spare bellhousing and throwout fork, with slave cylinder included if you need one, let me know?!
You also get to use a larger yoke with bigger uni's that will be more suited to the torque of the V8. Finally, no, the clutch between a W and R box will not interchange. Again using the Hadfield setup, you use a standard Ford flywheel ($50 second hand + $40 to have it refaced), and clutch pressure plate.
You can purchase many different sized friction plates (again direct from Hadfield if you wish), from 10" single or double plate - 11" single plate, to suit your needs and the type of pressure plate and flywwheel you use ( many ford flywheels are multidrilled to take a variety of clutch types!). If you need more info, let me know?!
Clint!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 12:37
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forgot to say, I actually sold the W58 box to a guy who had one in his VK Commodore with a worked 308. He'd already killed 2, and this was his third purchase in 6 months - "I think there's something in that for all of us ... don't you?!" Have also sold a few others over time to guys replacing broken units behind their V8's. Food for thought!
Clint!
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Location:
Mildura
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 12:39
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Clutch plate itself should be interchangable(input splines are the same).
Given that you wont be using the Toyota bell housing the type of clutch that you use with the W58 should(almost certainly) work with the R154.
Just because the R154 uses a pull rather than push in the supra doesn't really come into it as most conversions use the engine manufactors clutch setup with a conversion thrust bearing.
When I did my V6 chev hilux conversion I got hold of a clutch book and just searched it till I found a suitable clutch.
I ended up using a Toyota dyna clutch plate(255mm diameter) and a 11" chev pressure plate.
There are numerous 9-9.25-10-10.5-11" clutch plates available for the toyota spline count and size so finding one to suit a ford pressure plate size is easy.
Count the splines on the gearbox input shaft and then measure the shaft diameter and go look at a PBR or whoevers book till you find one.
Marty
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 12:41
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Thanks for telling me. If i didnt have to go to the trouble of cutting out my trans tunnel id certainly go for an r154...wat car did u just put the 302c into? Mines a ma61 supra...yes i agree with you...i dont wanna make a headache with one part being inadequate...the diff is fine...tough as nails...gearbox is tough too...but torque of v8 may need that steel case?
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Location:
Mildura
Registered:
May 2002
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 13:00
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SO everyone...whats the advice? R154 and cut the trans tunnel out to fit, or go with a w58 and see how things go? you said because i wouldnt be using the toyota bellhousing and clutch...the parts may actually fit the r154? What parts could u be certain of? How much would the convo cost ?
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 13:03
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guys, I'm on msn messenger under ifitsuits@hotmail.com, or ICQ on 171124572, find me and lets natter!
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Location:
Mildura
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 13:11
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Best bet would be to ring Castlemaine rod shop and ask ROD.
Or ask Clint he is obviously doing this now.
If both setups use the same bellhousing I can't see a difference in clutches setups other than maybe a thrust bearing and possible a spigot bearing(for input shaft length differences).
marty
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 13:35
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Ok do you have his number mate? yeah im only gonna do this project once...so it needs to be done correctly...if it means cuttin the tunnel for an r154 than i spose itll have to do...
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 13:40
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OK, got off my back side and found some prices for you!
At CRS, I have a price of $150 to adapt the 7M bellhousing to a Ford V8, $25 for a spigot bush, and an 11" clutch friction plate for $180. If you use a W58, you will also need to modify the yoke to take a bigger uni joint, costing $120. Your gearbox x member should go close to fitting, only requiring minor mods if any at all.
I'm using a 11" heavy duty Ford pressure plate to a single friction plate - it's harder than my dick in the morning, but has never slipped, in any form of motorsport I've done. I've never had to modify the trans tunnel as the whole conversion is just about to be slipped back into a 1972 XA Falcon ute, that I plan to drive around Australia early to mid year. I'm happy to show anyone interested when I'm in your area.
I never ran with the W58, it's a completely different setup. I wasn't prepared to spend money on a weaker alternative, so have spent a bit extra on the box to get a much better transplant. For that reason, I recommend the R154 over any other. Yes a bit more stuffing around but better in the long run.
CRS phone number is 03 5472 2853.
Clint!
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 13:47
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Thanks mate. yeah what i have presently in my ma61 is the 5me sohc 2.8l i6 with a w58 man box. If i am convinced enough and can find one at the right price ill go for a r154. So is the 7m bellhousing irrelevant? Or will that be needed from the r154? Did soarers come with r154?
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Perth, Western Australia
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Tue, 14 January 2003 14:03
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you will still need a bellhousing to modify if you go the R154 route (personally I wouldn't waste my time with the W58 - it's not going to last, remember the low down torque is an inherent quality of any V8. I also had reservations about the size of the W58 clutch - only 220mm, verses 280 for the 11" ford style). Postage for the bellhousing would only be around $20, let me know if you need one as I have one spare. Yep some Soarers came with R154's, you will need to look for the specific model and year. My box is from a MA70 Supra.
Not certain on how much the trans tunnel would need modification, the R154 is bigger but not obscenely so, I'll measure mine up tomorrow if you want the details?! I'd say a bit of friendly persuassion would also allow fitment!
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Wed, 15 January 2003 07:33
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lovely...shame youre not in qld
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Location:
Brisbane
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Clutch and conversion for 302 to w58
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Wed, 15 January 2003 09:00
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hey do you guys know if the gearshift locations are the same on a r154 as a w58? Both fit on a mk3 7m so im guessing there the same?
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