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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 04:41
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Hey guys,
I've got a bad build up of surface rust on the roof of the KE20.
Anyone got any great ideas on removing it easily/quickly??
thanks,
CamZH
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 06:03
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If its just surface rust can't you give it a light sand then use some rust preventative on it. Someone correct me if I am wrong
Damian
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Location:
Melb
Registered:
January 2003
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 06:19
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Yep that sounds about right.rust converter is a good product
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 06:48
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Hey Guys,
Sounds like a fantastic idea!
only its not light surface rust its very heavy!!
I've tried just about everything, the flap disc's on the angle grinder work ok, but they clog up with the rust stuff.
Also underneath some of the rust there is its incredibly hard black stuff.
Sanding is working with just normal paper, but it takes forever!
CamZH
ps. also been using a phosphoric acid based rust converter.
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Location:
Canberra
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 12:33
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How about those wire brushes you can get for angle grinders, they are cone shaped, they are good for removing rust and paint. Just out of curiosity, is the black stuff like a layer of paint or is it thick? I had this layer of blackish paint on my celica that was/is a bitch to remove.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 12:51
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The wire brush on the angle grinder doesnt touch this rust!!
and wont even think about the black stuff!!
The black stuff isnt paint, its under the rust, it seems like burnt rust?? it shows up after using the angle grinder
CamZH
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 13:00
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1.sandblast
2.weld
3.grind back
(repeat steps 2 &3 if necessary)
4.etch prime
5.bog
6.primer
bla bla
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Location:
Melbourne
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 13:51
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Sounds too far gone.
Talk to a panel beater/sheet metal workshop. Consider carefully cutting a good roof off a wreck according to their instructions and taking it to
them. They should be able to braze it or TIG weld it on your car without too much warpage.
You can't really stop rust with rust convertor - only slow it down.
Rust sucks!
Good luck
David
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 05 February 2003 19:57
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| Quote: |
Consider carefully cutting a good roof off a wreck
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We're talking about a KE20 here!
It seems that if i just get some super aggressive sand paper that might be the trick.
thanks,
CamZH
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Location:
Japan
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Thu, 06 February 2003 10:11
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CamZH this doesn't sound like a very good thing to repair. If the rust isn't too effected by an angle grinder or a wire brush attachment i would seriously be taking David's approach. Rust is car cancer and if it's in the body then it's only a matter of time. How is the rest of the body? Don't waste good money working hard on something that is a dead end if you can find a better body or a whole new roof.
If you insist on working on the roof try a 36 grit sanding disc fitted to the angle grinder, once you have grinded as much as you can off then get a power drill with a 6mm drill piece (or suitable size) and use the drill to dig out any rust you can before using some good rust converter...but it might just be easier to make the car a convertible!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Thu, 06 February 2003 11:02
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Its not that bad, and the rest of the body is really good!
I just got my 9" grinder back tonight and i'll try that with a 80grit flap disc, i think the problem with the 4" grinder using the dics was the rpms, it was burning the disc and making a hell of a mess, but the 36 grit might work, i have a 40grit disc, but i dont want to attack the steel too much....
Cam
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Location:
Japan
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Thu, 06 February 2003 11:31
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Cam are you able to post a picture of the rust? I would like to see it as from your earlier post to me it sounded quite bad. If you are sure the rust isn't too deep into the metal there are no holes going right though spend some time cleaning it up. Don't get too carried away with the 40 grit paper on the thin metal (using an air tool is great as you can adjust the rpm easily).
Using that 80 grit disc strip off all the paint around the rust, take it back way passed the rusted spot as rust is like an iceberg in the way that there is usually more hiding under the surface. Hack into it with the 40 grit disc and try to get as much off as you can without making the metal too thin. If the metal is thin then don't use the drill idea or you will turn your roof into swiss cheeze but rather get a wire brush and some sandpaper (use an engraver if you can get one) and clean up any little rust divets.
In the end you will have to use some filler and spray putty anyway so don't worry if you scratch the roof up a bit.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Thu, 06 February 2003 11:45
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Hey Riceboy,
I'll take a pic for you tomorrow.
Its no where near going through the roof, its just BAD surface rust. I was never going to try the drill idea as its not badly pitted. Thes rust patch is smaller now that i have worked on it for some 4-5 hours!
I'll keep you informed
Cam
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Fri, 07 February 2003 06:27
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Hey Riceboy,
got those pics for you.
i Havent touched it since wednesday but just about to hit it with the 9"
CamZH
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Fri, 07 February 2003 08:09
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have you tried rust converter then the wire brush drill attachment?
it is too much to sandblast because it may damage the roof.
A new roof would be the easiest way to go about it, if you could find a decent one.
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Location:
Japan
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Fri, 07 February 2003 09:06
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Cam how did it come up after using the 9"? If things still aren't looking good perhaps it is time to get chemical!
I can't think of anything off the shelf (as i have never used chemical cleaners on rust) but you may want to look at treating it with some acid. (may need to talk to an acid dipper - not an acid tripper!) to see if you can just give the roof a bit of an acid bath. A diluted hydrochloric acid should do the trick. I would still keep sand blasting as an option as well though as the roof surface is already damaged. Things don't look too serious.
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Location:
Perth, WA
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Fri, 07 February 2003 11:22
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Hey Riceboy,
the 9" wasnt so good, with the flap disc on it, it was fairly aggressive and unconsistent, ie. sometimes it would cut harshly and other it would do nothing!
It was also harder to use as when it would cut it would do it well and heat up the metal very quickly!!
The orbital sander seems to be doing well!
CamZH
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Toymods Social Secretary
Location:
Sydney
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Sun, 09 February 2003 08:32
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now PAINT IT!!!
i recommend PURPLE!! 
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Location:
Japan
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Mon, 10 February 2003 13:19
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Cam good to see things are working out for you. Job is coming along well now. Glad you are doing a bare metal respray, if prepped properly the result will be much better, i didn't have time for a bare metal respray and was using white so it didn't matter as much (i was also not looking at a showcar result, just something neater) but still you can see the results of cutting corners with paint. What colour will you be painting it?
Matt.
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Mon, 10 February 2003 19:47
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Hey Matt,
I'm still not 100% sure what colour to spray it!
We were originally thinking dark blue..
but it might end up being a mauve/purple! 
Any tips on spraying?
CamZH
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Location:
Ipswich
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Mon, 10 February 2003 21:22
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Did the HCL strip the paint as well? Or did you use paint stripper beforehand? And I'm guessing that the HCL just ate away the rust and you just had to rub it on? Wow...
After you took away the paint and then the rust, did you prime it everytime you stopped for a day or so and then start again? Doesn't the rust come back if you just leave the bare metal out?
I'm needing to fix some rust in my Rolla as well...
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Location:
Finland
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Tue, 11 February 2003 10:50
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Whats the brand of the rust eater? HCI? that stuff really looks great. I've never used any rust converters becouse i have always had doubts about them. I hope that your rust doesnt start to bloom shortly after the painting. I did sandblast every rust spot (nothing more) that i had and covered it with Spies & Hecker 2k phosphorus-acid paint like every bare metal. Use good body-fillers 'cos they have some rust-converters in them and another aspect is that good body-fillers dont shrink after wards.
And about color, indecent orange would be the way to go... 
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Tue, 11 February 2003 11:15
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Hey Guys,
I didnt try and strip the paint with the acid, just the rust.
the acid is just hydroclauric acid (HCl).
I've been leaving the car bare, apparently the etch primer (phosphoric acid base) doesnt like being left too long. so i was planing on doing it in 1 go.
Indecent orange?
I think we've lost something in the transaltion
Irridecent Orange on the other hand would look cool!
CamZH
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Location:
Finland
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Tue, 11 February 2003 12:02
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Ok! i've got crappy translator program  and it gave indecent for obscene hope thats somewhat better(propably not). That sucker program dont get irridecent , so i've got no idea what that means but i think we mean the same. Anyhow some outrageous
orange would be cool.
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Location:
Finland
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Tue, 11 February 2003 12:03
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Yeah! bad ass orange!!!
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Location:
Japan
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Tue, 11 February 2003 13:15
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Hey Cam,
Yeah orange sounds great. Personally if i were to paint my car orange i would have to be using a rich pastel orange that was quite warm and bright and then hit it with a nice blue pearl in the clear coats that followed. I saw this done on a street machiner's FJ Holden a few years ago and it looked sensational. Otherwise if you were after a metallic orange (irridencent) i would be going for something like the HSV orange. I think if you add some white pearl into the base coat (if it hasn't got it already) it makes the paint look a bit deeper. Plus when you clear it mix a very small portion of the base coat into the clear, that makes the paint look deeper too.
Whatever colour you go for keep the pics coming. I have some pics of my respray i just have to learn how to post them.
Matt.
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Location:
Finland
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Tue, 11 February 2003 16:09
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Riceboy you took words from my mouth. I wanted to suggest blue pearl clear coat but i tought that CamZH just wanted paint and nothing fancy. Other options (my opinion) would be metallic light blue and golden pearl clear coat or metallic wine red with copper/something brown like pearl clear coat, so that it would be classy and deep color not like bloody shit  . But hey it's up to CamZH and his money...
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 12 February 2003 10:21
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Hey Guys,
we were originally thinking a nice metallic blue..
pearl? not somehting i thought about really..
However.. Rod has offered me some paint (reddy purple with pearl) at good price and it's a offer hard to refuse, but i still need primer and etch primer!
Anyone got any idea where to go to get paint???
CamZH
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Location:
Gold Coast
Registered:
October 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 12 February 2003 10:43
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go the metallic blue and a white interior!
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I supported Toymods
Location:
Toodyay, WA
Registered:
July 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 12 February 2003 11:38
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WHITE INTERIOR???
WTF are you thinking!!
I'd burn my KE20 before it ever had a white interior!!
The windows will be dark (black) and the interior will be black also.
Cam
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Location:
Castlemaine Vic
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 12 February 2003 11:49
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hmmm...dome let the EPA see those pics, all that acid on to the lawn and down the drain?!
anyways, brings back memorys to when my ke20 was in her birthday suit
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 12 February 2003 11:52
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interior... that just slows you down!
power to weight baby!!!
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Location:
Japan
Registered:
December 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 12 February 2003 13:36
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Jayem i have to agree with you completely, it is Cams money and his decision. Here we are throwing around all these wild ideas yet when it came to my own Sprinter i chose boring old white! hahaha...yeah real creative! But hell, i got 4 litres of MR2 (colour code 043) white paint for $75! So the colour choice was easy. $1000 per litre paint just isn't in my budget. I also wanted a bit of a sleeper and i think white cars can be made to look quite tough without attracting too much attention. I will probably end up airbrushing something stupid on it through boredom. As for my interior, much of it will be white as i still have white paint left! But i have to take Bugman's side here...i have stripped my interior right down so i am more or less painting the the inside of the shell. My passenger is lucky they aren't sitting on an apple box when they ride with me, i reluctantly kept my passenger seat but NO STEREO! I even had the external aerial removed and welded up the hole on the RHS guard.
But again Cam good luck and keep pics coming.
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Location:
Finland
Registered:
November 2002
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Re: Rust Removal
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Wed, 12 February 2003 16:56
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Riceboy, its pretty much the same here. My corona is painted about 6months ago by Spies & Hecker totally gloss black. All chromesh are well polished. I removed aerial too plus locks, all text plates and side mouldings. All mounting holes are welded shut. I like that its quite clean looking now.
I think my car is going to get new paint in year or two. Becouse i havent removed gas tank flap(?), rear door handles and i havent fabricated glass fibre hood and fenders yet and so on  . Other wise it should be easy spray on. Maybe it will come gloss black (again) with green pearl clear coat. My interior is yet stock but thats all I can say now->no plans. But my main interest is in chassis and engine now  .
Btw. 2litres paint + 2litres clear coat with pearl effect + hardeners. 170¤ if I remember correct. I asked this some while ago.
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Location:
Sydney
Registered:
May 2002
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 Re: Rust Removal
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Thu, 13 February 2003 13:02
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Another alternative is a vynel roof. I've had this done on 3 of my cars and results exceed the cost, which was around $150 per car, they come to you with prestitched cover and install, takes a morning.
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